YouTube's Adblock detection might break the law in the EU

[Scion9066]

From the linked EU memo in the YouTube description: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/MEMO_1...

Can users still use ad blockers?

The proposal does not regulate the use of ad blockers. Users have the freedom to install software on their devices that disables the display of advertisement. At the same time, the Commission is aware that 'free' content on the internet is often funded by advertisement revenue. Therefore, the proposal allows website providers to check if the end-user's device is able to receive their content, including advertisement, without obtaining the end-user's consent. If a website provider notes that not all content can be received by the end-user, it is up to the website provider to respond appropriately, for example by asking end-users if they use an ad-blocker and would be willing to switch it off for the respective website.

[wnevets]

Sounds like this video is trash then?

[drexlspivey]

I don't think this argument has any legs. You request a page from a web server, the server gives you back some html and some javascript, you execute the javascript which detects if you are using an adblocker.

There is no tracking involved, if you believe the js you got back is spyware you can refrain from running it and you can't watch the vid. Should every website ask for your consent to serve you javascript now?

[boomboomsubban]

>There is no tracking involved,

Wouldn't that depend on when YouTube starts the "three video" counter? A blanket ban on ad blockers may not violate the law, but their implementation may.

[downrightmike]

It allows them to create a profile of the users. Same reason android no longer has an api to detect which apps are installed along side yours.

[vmfunction]

That would be a welcoming change! With html5 standard, pages can have text, image, video, even css animation, all without JS.

If the page need to load some SPA app, draw the canvas (accessing GPU), or WebUSB, etc, then ask for permission would be a good idea. Just like how accessing ones' camera and mic requires permission. It will force web developers to do less stuff in JS for just display. And if an app type of application is needed, then ask for permission.

[mksybr]

> Should every website ask for your consent to serve you javascript now?

Ideally, yes.

[renewiltord]

Every HTTP request should ideally be preceded by a dialog button and if affirmative consent is not provided, the request shouldn't be made.

For example, I did not consent to this y18.svg file that this website has served to me. This is a non-consensual violation of my computational autonomy. Just to put a logo up? Horrific.

[notoriousdel]

Yes.

[nash]

The irony of this being a youtube video is not lost on me.

[tokai]

Are people actually getting blocked? I saw the adblock-block popup once, and after flushing the cache and updating filters of my adblocker I haven't had any issues using yt since. Am I just in a lucky A/B group or is the detection and blockage actually that toothless?

[nwoli]

I’m getting fully blocked. I barely mind it anymore though, it basically acts as a great procrastination block. (I think there’s work around a like that embedded videos still work but I like reducing the amount.)

[ttyyzz]

Yesterday I got the popup constantly but could chose to watch anyway. Today it said "you can watch 2 more videos.." and now I'm blocked after said 2 videos.

[LelouBil]

YouTube updates the script multiple times per day and uBlock Origin devs are fighting back, but they will always be a little bit behind.

Maybe you didn't try to play videos when they didn't update their fix yet.

[sircastor]

I got blocked briefly. I switched to non-logged-in or using an alternative interface for a bit. I switched back and haven’t seen hide-nor-hair of the warning. I don’t know what that means though. Here’s hoping they don’t disable my Google account.

[nkozyra]

Cannot watch a video at all with it enabled while in my account.

If I go incognito I can.

FreeTube for now, I guess.

[neuromanser]

I've seen the pop-up twice in roughly two weeks, both times in Firefox on Linux with uMatrix, uBlock Origin and SponsorBlock.

[ksherlock]

I'm blocked, but for a different reason. Every click, their SPA javascript decides i'm not connected to the internet.

[PrimeMcFly]

Chrome users are out of lock due to the way extensions work, Firefox users can continue blocking without issue.

[cardboard9926]

Yes, it's crazy. Upon updating ublock, even turning it off and clearing cookies resulted getting blocked.

[Jaxan]

I get the pop up constantly. But you can just close it and watch the video.

[jjulius]

I've been blocked for a week now.

[Scion9066]

Previous discussion of this topic:

Privacy advocate challenges YouTube's ad blocking detection scripts under EU law

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38050838

[WheatMillington]

Why should companies be required to offer content to people for free?

[amatecha]

Welll... to be fair, that's literally the only reason the platform got as big as it did, and became "the" ubiquitous video hosting platform. They fronted the cost to capture a massive audience, and now they gradually extract more and more value out of the user base they lured in.

[krapp]

Because they do offer content to people for free, and have for years. And people might actually be willing to put up with ads if they weren't so invasive and obnoxious - static ad banners, for instance, would probably be fine. But interrupting a video every few seconds for several minutes of ads is just ridiculous.

Also because the ability for the end user to have complete control over the content the server sends them has been baked into the web since the beginning. You can send your content for free and hope that I choose to view your ads (which I probably wont,) or you can put your content behind a paywall, and hope it's worth paying for (it probably isn't.)

What you can't do is send your content for free and just expect me to view your ads, as if the internet were old media like radio or television, where even then, you could skip ads with DVR or just change the channel.

It's not our problem corporations thought the web was going to be a gravy train where the rules didn't matter, and they poisoned the well and ruined everything in the process. To hell with all of them, let them burn. We'll go back to sharing videos on torrent or something.

[gotoeleven]

I would happily pay for youtube without ads if I was confident that they wouldn't start putting ads in it anyways like always seems to happen with these services.

[heavyset_go]

Every single streaming service will eventually converge on showing the same amount of ads consumers have shown they're willing to put up with, and that's the amount of ads that are shown on cable TV. That's about 3 to 7 minutes of ads per 30 minute block[1].

Not showing ads is leaving money on the table, and streaming services are like any other company, they will need continuous return on investment no matter what. They will eventually get that return by showing ads[1], shareholders will demand it.

Look at Hulu, Netflix and YouTube. They all show ads now. Netflix previously didn't show ads and now does. Hell, I can't watch a 20-minute YouTube video without watching several minutes of ads.

These services' actual clients are the entities that have million/billion dollar advertising budgets, and not individual customers who pay a paltry monthly fee. Even if services start with no/minimal ads to get their foot in the door, they will eventually have to take their advertising partners' money, and those partners will want to show ads.

[1] https://digiday.com/future-of-tv/ad-supported-streaming-serv...

[t-writescode]

You could pay for YouTube Premium until it starts playing ads, then?

[adv0r]

if you navigate to elpais.com, they embed youtube videos, and you are required to accept youtube conditions before reproducing the video

https://imgur.com/a/m1NAWeC

[beanjuiceII]

if EU can stop this adblock i forgive them for GDRP or whatever its called

[drukenemo]

GDPR is extremely important and should be adopted worldwide in my view. It creates protections for handling and storing of personal data.

[bblacher]

Please explain why you think the GDPR is bad.

[dale_glass]

How does Youtube detect adblock anyway? Is that documented anywhere?

[codybontecou]

I read somewhere Youtube used to send a response like {..., ads: [1, 2, 3]}. uBlock would see this response and turn it into {..., ads: []} and load the page accordingly.

I guess now, Youtube expects a response back, and occasionally, the request/response is faked. So, when uBlock adjusts the request/response and says "This user watched the ads", Youtube knows the request/response was fake and there were no ads to begin with, notifying that user is using an adblocker.

[Dwedit]

It's not very hard to see when particular web requests did not happen, or particular JS did not execute.

[kleiba]

There was an article posted on that topic here a few days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38061187

[nikanj]

Might*

*Actually doesn't

[sonthonax]

I can see you're already being downvoted because Hacker News has a really juvenile attitude to DRM.

No one has the right to YouTube (or free media for that matter).

[ren_engineer]

is Google really that desperate for revenue that they need to do this shit? Comes off as desperate

[amatecha]

The thirst is real. I imagine no publicly traded company will ever stop nickel & diming to the ultimate degree. Even when you think the maximum level has been reached, they'll find a new way to extract more from users.

[Ekaros]

Do you want the charts to keep going up? If so yes, they need to do this and more...