Next will be the litany of comments pointing out that the declarative API works reasonably well for blocking ads. That's mostly true, for now. Google's shown in several different areas that they know how to slow-roll the real objective over years, when needed.
This is roughly the equivalent of taking a heuristic malware blocker and making it depend solely on file names or file checksums. I can't prove it, but I feel like it's only the first shoe dropping.
I know the submission title matches the title of the Reddit post, but both titles are misleading—Google didn't mention uBO by name, they just confirmed that all Manifest v2 extensions will be disabled.
Of course Google don't mention uBO by name. But this is the real reason they are doing it. Privacy is just a pretext.
uBO lite will still be available but it will be very nerfed.
Hopefully people move to Firefox, but I'm not so optimistic. It took a huge campaign to get people to move from IE6 to Firefox, and I'm not certain it can be replicated with Chrome.
That sounds very similar to hiding behind sneaky talk in order to keep the practical effects in the background.
Almost no-one cares about the terms "Manifest v2 extensions" - because almost no one recognizes them for what they really are. Most people can understand it by its effect - that it will disable UBO. Only sneaky people will insist on using the technically correct, but obscure term in a PUBLIC announcement - clearly the aim is to make sure that the public overlooks the announcement.
We are a small startup using Zoho and Notion (for developeras and knowledge base). We like Zoho. Whenever we felt like we need a solution now for some new requirement, they have it!
Some of their apps are very good like Books, Expense, Sign, Drive and Write, most are good enough and a few need more work (calendar, booking, and meet). When you need help there is always a person to talk to and they are pretty fast in support.
In dollar pricing, they are very cheap, but in India, they are still on pricey side. But worth every rupee we spend on them. Zoho CEO is bit of a character!
I switched to 95% firefox in 2021. I needed ad block on my phone browser due to some awful (but necessary) sites. I still use gmail for my main email and use other google-specific apps in my browser/phone. So I keep a chrome browser installed on my PC with my main google account logged in. I only use that for google stuff though. All other browsing is done in firefox. It's worked out great for me.
I've been de-googling myself slowly over the past 5 years or so. The shift has been marked, but even cynical old me is surprised how quickly they are turning on their user base.
The signs have been there all along though.
So... in all seriousness... Brave or Firefox? What about that Kagi Orion browser?
Google just keeps on digging in. Their search engine has been a smoldering SEO dumpster fire for the past 10 years; Now it’s blazing.
Chrome? Friends don’t let friends use Chrome. It’s the unadulterated Android OS of the browser world.
I’ve been considering Kagi, but I don’t see an easy way to pay for it without basically removing all anonymity… it really is a relentless yet boring dystopia.
Sure, but it doesn't have the same functionality [1]:
> With Manifest V3, uBlock is required to limit how many websites our users are able to add to their allow lists. Going forward, you'll only be able to add up to 5,000 websites to your allow lists.
> Moving forward, we’ll no longer be able to enable automatic daily updates to filter lists.
Features lost by the Ublock Origin V3 version by gorehill:
- No cosmetic filtering (##)
- No scriptlet injection (##+js)
- No redirect= filters
- No csp= filters
- No removeparam= filters
This isn't just a oh no we need to rewrite for V3, it's a very user hostile action to take control away from users.
Because only Google can be trusted of course.
I have been using Firefox since version 1 as my primary browser, originally because it had Firebug, and later out of apathy to change. I’m also weird in that I’ve been using DDG as my sole search engine for years. I haven’t felt like I’ve been held back by these tools in the slightest, whether for web development or personal use.
I like the idea of DDG, but its search results have always been noticeably weaker than Google and even Brave Search these days.
As an example, try searching "DuckDNS" on DDG. The homepage is nowhere to be found on the first several pages of DDG, but is rightfully the first result on Google.
Considering how much edge wants to gain back browser share, if they kept mv2 support the combination of supporting real ad blocking while still being a chromium browser is pretty appealing.
Exactly. Being able to effectively block ads is a highly desirable feature. All it takes is a well-funded marketing campaign that educates users when Google stops supporting MV2 extensions.
Hey, this one might actually finally help Firefox's marketshare. Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting anything massive, but imagine if people's adblockers got disabled over night: a horde of technically-inclined users, being newly-introduced to what the Internet currently is like to use without an adblocker, might just decide it's worth it to switch rather than try Manifest v3 adblockers and find out if it's really good enough. (It is not terrible right now, but really, why bother? It's not as good.)
I get the feeling that along with youtube anti-adblock efforts that this is google rifling-through-the-couch-cushions phase, and we'll see them actually execute this time because it's worth it.
Makes me wonder if they have plans to deal with FF as well. I wouldn't be surprised to see them stop paying for FF search box defaults or progressively negotiate lower payments each year.
Google is so reliant on ads, they will probably push through with this. More ads in search, YouTube, GMail and the wider Web is the only way for them to grow revenue. More other Google businesses are small fish compared to their ad revenue.
Let’s hope that other browser makers use this opportunity to attack. Chrome’s dominant market share is unhealthy for the Internet anyway.
That’s actually a meaningful way for other browser makers to differentiate themselves. Notably Firefox, but potentially also Microsoft Edge. While Edge is based on Chrome, they could decide to keep supporting manifest V2 extensions.
It is the default choice nowadays. Most people on the Internet are not emotionally invested in whose browser they are using. They just want to use a browser that works on every site.
The thing that makes chrome completely unusable to me is how you can't Ctrl-Tab between tabs in recently-used order.
Maybe it's possible to do it with an add-on but I don't like installing add-ons because they always want access to your complete browsing history. I'm not doing that just to restore basic functionality.
I've been using Firefox exclusively for a few years on Desktop and mobile, and it has been great.
It's pretty rare that something doesn't support Firefox, and usually it's some weird web tech demo I found on here. Nothing that I'd miss.
Ublock Origin is no small part of why I use Firefox for Android, and a redirection plug-in for old reddit, nitter, etc make following links in forums sufferable.
This is the inverse of accurate, uBlock Origin already has a MV3 extension in progress (beta at https://ublockorigin.com/ top middle of the page). As others have noted, uBO is not even named in the Google releases, this applies to all MV2 extensions.
Annoyed they are barrelling ahead with this still, but not an attack on uBO or ad-blockers directly. Seems like they even made some changes to service workers to enable ad-blockers as well.
Perhaps gorhill will weigh in with more comments if he sees this. Curious if any of their changes to MV3 actually moved the needle on the issues previously identified.
Firefox is mainly funded by Google, if they've decided to be this aggressive about it, then I am guessing that they've absolved whatever restraint they had and that they're probably going to either force Firefox to follow suit, or cut funding.
Neither bodes well for the people's champion in the browser wars.
Given Chrome/Android doesn't support extensions at all, and Firefox/Android does, for Android you'd tend to prefer Firefox as your browser regardless.
(Or another browser which supports adblocking natively. I use EinkBro (on an e-ink device) most of the time; it has integrated ad-blocking. I believe Brave and Vivaldi will also provide ad-blocking.)
Vivaldi: Yep. "Vivaldi Browser on Android | Fast Android browser with Ad blocker" (from page title) <https://vivaldi.com/android/>
I am so glad, so glad I was proven right, I knew the second back in like 2009 when I tried chrome and right clicked on a youtube channel background and it didn't let me get the image link unlike firefox that Chrome was an evil that was going to creep to who knows what standards.
And here we are, 14 years later, Google finally slowly got its masterplan done, and it will keep getting worse.
While I have many grievances with Firefox, there is simply no alternative, the only real alternative is Firefox, don't even give Google the benefit of using chromium, if you truly care switch to Firefox and make everyone else switch, worst case scenario use a chromium alternative but please do not use Chrome anymore, if you are a techie swap everyone you know to an alternative browser.
[+] [-] tyingq|2 years ago|reply
This is roughly the equivalent of taking a heuristic malware blocker and making it depend solely on file names or file checksums. I can't prove it, but I feel like it's only the first shoe dropping.
[+] [-] spondylosaurus|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jjulius|2 years ago|reply
If A=B and B=C, then yadda yadda.
[+] [-] xdennis|2 years ago|reply
uBO lite will still be available but it will be very nerfed.
Hopefully people move to Firefox, but I'm not so optimistic. It took a huge campaign to get people to move from IE6 to Firefox, and I'm not certain it can be replicated with Chrome.
[+] [-] Zandikar|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jugad|2 years ago|reply
Almost no-one cares about the terms "Manifest v2 extensions" - because almost no one recognizes them for what they really are. Most people can understand it by its effect - that it will disable UBO. Only sneaky people will insist on using the technically correct, but obscure term in a PUBLIC announcement - clearly the aim is to make sure that the public overlooks the announcement.
[+] [-] tomrod|2 years ago|reply
Can't stand this garbage. Ads are a malicious code payload vector worth blocking.
We will be likely move our business off Google Suite too. Any suggestions on good replacements with trustworthy vendors?
[+] [-] tapoxi|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dilawar|2 years ago|reply
Some of their apps are very good like Books, Expense, Sign, Drive and Write, most are good enough and a few need more work (calendar, booking, and meet). When you need help there is always a person to talk to and they are pretty fast in support.
In dollar pricing, they are very cheap, but in India, they are still on pricey side. But worth every rupee we spend on them. Zoho CEO is bit of a character!
[+] [-] verhaust|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hankman86|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lordfrito|2 years ago|reply
I've been de-googling myself slowly over the past 5 years or so. The shift has been marked, but even cynical old me is surprised how quickly they are turning on their user base.
The signs have been there all along though.
So... in all seriousness... Brave or Firefox? What about that Kagi Orion browser?
[+] [-] nicce|2 years ago|reply
Orion browser is still too young to match the requirements of the major userbase.
But Kagi beats Google already as search engine.
[+] [-] sys_64738|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rossdavidh|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] karmasimida|2 years ago|reply
Their user base are not us.
[+] [-] barkerja|2 years ago|reply
I'll likely revisit it soon, when there's hopefully been some more fixes and improvements.
[+] [-] SllX|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] defensem3ch|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|2 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] Loggias|2 years ago|reply
Chrome? Friends don’t let friends use Chrome. It’s the unadulterated Android OS of the browser world.
I’ve been considering Kagi, but I don’t see an easy way to pay for it without basically removing all anonymity… it really is a relentless yet boring dystopia.
[+] [-] Timber-6539|2 years ago|reply
Also, it would be prudent to note that an MV3 version of uBlock Origin has existed for quite some time now.
[+] [-] selcuka|2 years ago|reply
> With Manifest V3, uBlock is required to limit how many websites our users are able to add to their allow lists. Going forward, you'll only be able to add up to 5,000 websites to your allow lists.
> Moving forward, we’ll no longer be able to enable automatic daily updates to filter lists.
[1] https://support.ublock.org/hc/en-us/articles/11749958544275-...
[+] [-] fyrn_|2 years ago|reply
This isn't just a oh no we need to rewrite for V3, it's a very user hostile action to take control away from users. Because only Google can be trusted of course.
[+] [-] mmcnl|2 years ago|reply
[0] https://developer.chrome.com/blog/resuming-the-transition-to...
[+] [-] irrational|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] paul7986|2 years ago|reply
They should've released their own search engine long before that bad PR thing showed Microsoft was harvesting some data.
Joe Rogan prior was promoting DDG for awhile to his millions of listeners.
[+] [-] toastercat|2 years ago|reply
As an example, try searching "DuckDNS" on DDG. The homepage is nowhere to be found on the first several pages of DDG, but is rightfully the first result on Google.
[+] [-] meitros|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hankman86|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] skullone|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jchw|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sparrish|2 years ago|reply
https://blog.chromium.org/2018/10/trustworthy-chrome-extensi...
[+] [-] bentcorner|2 years ago|reply
Makes me wonder if they have plans to deal with FF as well. I wouldn't be surprised to see them stop paying for FF search box defaults or progressively negotiate lower payments each year.
[+] [-] hankman86|2 years ago|reply
Let’s hope that other browser makers use this opportunity to attack. Chrome’s dominant market share is unhealthy for the Internet anyway.
[+] [-] hankman86|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] archsurface|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] asylteltine|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hankman86|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] brokenmachine|2 years ago|reply
Maybe it's possible to do it with an add-on but I don't like installing add-ons because they always want access to your complete browsing history. I'm not doing that just to restore basic functionality.
[+] [-] geodel|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ge96|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DistractionRect|2 years ago|reply
It's pretty rare that something doesn't support Firefox, and usually it's some weird web tech demo I found on here. Nothing that I'd miss.
Ublock Origin is no small part of why I use Firefox for Android, and a redirection plug-in for old reddit, nitter, etc make following links in forums sufferable.
[+] [-] hexadec|2 years ago|reply
Annoyed they are barrelling ahead with this still, but not an attack on uBO or ad-blockers directly. Seems like they even made some changes to service workers to enable ad-blockers as well.
Perhaps gorhill will weigh in with more comments if he sees this. Curious if any of their changes to MV3 actually moved the needle on the issues previously identified.
[+] [-] dang|2 years ago|reply
Google resumes transition to Manifest V3 for Chrome extensions - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38292409 - Nov 2023 (73 comments)
[+] [-] zygo|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] preommr|2 years ago|reply
Firefox is mainly funded by Google, if they've decided to be this aggressive about it, then I am guessing that they've absolved whatever restraint they had and that they're probably going to either force Firefox to follow suit, or cut funding.
Neither bodes well for the people's champion in the browser wars.
[+] [-] clouddrover|2 years ago|reply
https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/wiki/uBlock-Origin-works-b...
[+] [-] dredmorbius|2 years ago|reply
(Or another browser which supports adblocking natively. I use EinkBro (on an e-ink device) most of the time; it has integrated ad-blocking. I believe Brave and Vivaldi will also provide ad-blocking.)
Vivaldi: Yep. "Vivaldi Browser on Android | Fast Android browser with Ad blocker" (from page title) <https://vivaldi.com/android/>
Brave: Yep. "Brave Browser is a web browser app that blocks ads, protects your privacy..." <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.brave.brow...>
[+] [-] dev1ycan|2 years ago|reply
And here we are, 14 years later, Google finally slowly got its masterplan done, and it will keep getting worse.
While I have many grievances with Firefox, there is simply no alternative, the only real alternative is Firefox, don't even give Google the benefit of using chromium, if you truly care switch to Firefox and make everyone else switch, worst case scenario use a chromium alternative but please do not use Chrome anymore, if you are a techie swap everyone you know to an alternative browser.