Neat article. If you squint, I don't think there is a ton of difference between what most handymen do and what most software engineers do: they both have some generalizable skills, and when they get asked to do something they say 'yes' and then figure out how to do it. I don't think the challenge level of most day-to-day software tasks is any harder than the "where'd that water stain come from" puzzle he described in the article. The difference, of course, is in working conditions and payment.
But even if the AI technologies we're so nervously excited about replace all our jobs, the handymen, plumbers, and electricians of the world will be mostly unaffected. Their work is hard to automate. I hesitate to say we'll change places in terms of economic status—more likely, all the out of work engineers and designers will move into those industries and drive down the prices.
I mostly agree with you. I've been a full-time software engineer for the past 28 years and a part-time handyman for the past 5 months. One of the biggest differences that you don't mention is the use of your body. Software engineering is purely intellectual -- often to the detriment of your body (or mine, anyways) since it's often the case where I sit at the keyboard for hours on end, day after day. As a handyman, your body necessarily is a key part of the work you do. Lifting tools, materials, carrying them, getting into weird positions to access the problem area (under bathroom sink for example). The other aspect is the physical nature of the work. The work is tangible. You can take a photo of the thing that needs to be fixed before the repair/construction and then another at the end and compare the before/after photos. Even if you don't care about the photos, you can still see the tangible, physical end-result of your work. With software engineering, at best it's usually just a status update on a Jira ticket.
Regarding AI technologies, I agree that it's extremely unlikely that AI will take over the work. It's possible that may help in some diagnostic cases. I strongly disagree with "all the out of work engineers and designers will move into those industries". Why? Many (perhaps most even) software engineers that I've worked with are too lazy or too proud to do handyman type work. Some of the handyman work can be physically quite taxing and some of it can be quite humbling. Examples of taxing work - when you're doing a gate rebuild/repair in 107 degree temperature in direct sun. Example of humbling work - opening up p-traps under sinks and having some of the smelly, dirty water splash on you.
As a coder when I want to figure something out I can just try it an obnoxious number of times and ways within minutes, with almost no marginal cost. Even on the job. When a handyman wants to learn plumbing he has to do things like knock holes in the ceiling just to have a look. If a handyman gets it right only as often as I do in my REPL, he'll fail fast. Atoms are so much tougher than bits.
the handymen, plumbers, and electricians of the world will be mostly unaffected. Their work is hard to automate.
It’s funny, when I started in ML 10 years ago people said the same thing about writers, artists, musicians. And yet here we are today. Robotics is just the next thing to be “solved” in AI field, the same way computer vision or NLP got solved - after decades of hard effort and little progress. Once the algorithms are ready people will build robots who will be much better than humans at any physical tasks: faster and more precise.
“The reason is that, in other fields [than software], people have to deal with the perversity of matter. You are designing circuits or cars or chemicals, you have to face the fact that these physical substances will do what they do, not what they are supposed to do. We in software don't have that problem, and that makes it tremendously easier. We are designing a collection of idealized mathematical parts which have definitions. They do exactly what they are defined to do.
And so there are many problems we [programmers] don't have. For instance, if we put an if statement inside of a while statement, we don't have to worry about whether the if statement can get enough power to run at the speed it's going to run. We don't have to worry about whether it will run at a speed that generates radio frequency interference and induces wrong values in some other parts of the data. We don't have to worry about whether it will loop at a speed that causes a resonance and eventually the if statement will vibrate against the while statement and one of them will crack. We don't have to worry that chemicals in the environment will get into the boundary between the if statement and the while statement and corrode them, and cause a bad connection. We don't have to worry that other chemicals will get on them and cause a short-circuit. We don't have to worry about whether the heat can be dissipated from this if statement through the surrounding while statement. We don't have to worry about whether the while statement would cause so much voltage drop that the if statement won't function correctly. When you look at the value of a variable you don't have to worry about whether you've referenced that variable so many times that you exceed the fan-out limit. You don't have to worry about how much capacitance there is in a certain variable and how much time it will take to store the value in it.
All these things are defined a way, the system is defined to function in a certain way, and it always does. The physical computer might malfunction, but that's not the program's fault. So, because of all these problems we don't have to deal with, our field is tremendously easier.”
Wonder how many on HN are like this, but with software or other industries.
I'm not building sky scrapers (next triple AAA game engine), I'm fixing the leak in the ceiling (bug with some in-house corporate gui). It can be a little soul-draining, but do it for the kids.
I’m always driven to reach for more, in my career. I don’t think that’s ideal for happiness. Maybe it’s not always even ideal for my career.
Through COVID, I’ve had a lot of obvious gains. I used to commute four hours a day, and now I work from home. I’m paid more. I’m working with more interesting technology. Despite all of that, I still alternate between putting a lot of effort into finding my next step to a bigger career or feeling bad about not putting enough energy into it.
Although the overlap is minimal in many ways, I was strongly reminded of Wes Cecil's series on the Philosophy of Building a house[1].
Cecil's purpose is a bit different, but beyond the obvious theme of using the building of a house for philosophical reflection, I do think there's some cross-over in insights, if not in focus.
I recommend it to anyone, ESPECIALLY anyone thinking about, or in the process of, building a house. And his channel in general is excellent fun.
Thanks! I want to build a house in the future and I want it to anticipate my psychology and be functional and yet have a timeless design if that makes sense. Also needs fung-sui.
> My kids get regular doses of “No limits!” and “You can be whatever you want!” in school, and I resent it because it simply isn’t true. You cannot actually be whatever you want. That’s harmful, sentimental garbage. Fact is, the real world is chock full of limits.
I've long observed that modern culture and media seem to be really stuck on this idea that kids everywhere are having their dreams held back by evil adults who just want to crush their dreams, for no good reason in particular. The archetype in many movies is that some adult is telling some kid to abandon his dreams.
I always found this interesting because no one ever attempted this with me. As suggested, they attempted the opposite, and told me that I could be whatever I wanted. Ultimately I think this was well-intended, but harmful advice. Most of the things I like or care about aren't just infeasible careers -- they're not jobs at all. The things I'm "passionate" about are just not career-worthy. I like reading books, playing video games, doing house chores while listening to podcasts, and talking to friends. It might sound stupid, but as a younger adult (18-25) I really had the mistaken impression that I didn't enjoy work because I hadn't found a good job yet. Really, there was nothing I enjoyed in my life which could actually survive the transition to a career. What I just described is really all leisure, and can't count as work.
Yes, you can technically make a career out of the things I listed, but they cease to bear much resemblance to how I participated in them. Casually playing a video game occasionally is much different from developing or writing, or reviewing games. Occasionally reading a good book is much different from being able to write a book, or reviewing books for a living, etc. And a proclivity towards enjoying a book every so often says nothing about one's ability to make a career out of books. I suppose the point I'm trying to drive at is that there is a wide berth between what someone is interested in, and their ability to make that into a career.
I would have benefited from being forced into the workplace sooner so that I could realize that all jobs out there are "work," even if there are some enjoyable aspects to them. ie, that there are fundamental differences between work and leisure, and that a kid who enjoys some hobbies is totally incapable of identifying his "passions." But, no one really seems to want to tell that story, at least in popular media. They want an easy good guy and bad guy. They seem fixated on the idea that as a child I truly knew myself, and in some sense was pure -- and that the world was an adulterating influence, bitterly set on holding me back. The opposite was true: as a child I barely know myself, and the world was ready to teach me important lessons, but mentors and media kept trying to protect me from learning about the world.
Educators and parents don't do a great job of saying "if you want to be A, then you should work on your V skills" or "while you may be passionate about C, it is not a career.. have you considered D,E,F?".
And also for those going off to college it would be useful to have the hard conversation early "while it may be fun to live in G HCOL city for 4 years, if you want to make a life there, you are going to need a HCOL paying job like H,I,J.. so maybe don't pursue low ROI degree K".
I definitely interacted with a lot of younger millenials/GenZ in my career who were constantly changing jobs laterally because nothing was a "good fit". So they spent the first 5 years of their career churning water instead of doubling their salary. This is the kind of thing that sets a person back for life.
To me it's like "wow yeah you don't find working on a CRUD app / BI analytics / retail website to be the most life affirming thing in the world?" Guess what, as Mad Men said.. "that's what the money is for". People can have hobbies!
Consumption (passive) vs production (active). Only some are blessed to enjoy the latter, and even fewer in a useful niche that aligns with a well-paid career.
Effectively, we reached post-scarcity society. As such, current zeitgeist changed from “we all have to work to collectively survive” to “only few need to work and are rewarded for it and everyone else can just chill out and have their basic needs met”.
Our collective approach to education reflects this new economic situation.
It’s even harder to give any advice to children now, with AI massively disrupting everything in few short years.
That was not the article I was expecting! Really enjoyed it.
I think the guy is underselling himself. He's running his own successful business, something I cannot imagine doing. He's hitting new (even if similar) problems every day with real world settings and real world consequences, and helping people. Sounds pretty impressive to me. When it comes to DIY I don't stretch beyond fixing tap washers or replacing power switches with obvious problems for fear of causing expensive damage.
The fact he can do it while battling on going mental health hassles is impressive too.
That the author describes himself as a self-taught handyman may not sound like much to USA readers like myself, but it's my understanding that Canada has a much more widespread formal trade apprentice program than what's available in the states (through unions). I've always wished something like that was developed here, since it doesn't seem like union labor will ever make inroads on the USA residential market.
I loved this article, we need more people like this on planet earth. Also, I've got to say, those paintings are AMAZING!... is that oil or acrylic or what? I would die to be able to paint like that.
> My kids get regular doses of “No limits!” and “You can be whatever you want!” in school, and I resent it because it simply isn’t true. You cannot actually be whatever you want. That’s harmful, sentimental garbage. Fact is, the real world is chock full of limits.
This is the danger of participation awards. It's how people end up in careers they aren't suited to.
As a society, we owe it to our children to be honest with them and guide them down paths that will satisfy the aspects of life that are important to them. It's a balancing act between ability, aptitude, drive, and personality.
Doing well in math and science does not necessarily mean that the child will be happy in a career that require those skills, especially if they actually enjoy music, art, or shop class more.
Unfortunately many of these trade-offs are presented financially to kids; that doing what you love may result in a financially challenging life, and ignore the satisfaction and mental health benefits that would derive from such a choice.
There's a little too much focus on the distant future, which is very abstract for everyone to consider, especially children.
Really, you can pursue anything you want to, regardless of the time horizon that you have considered it in.
Walk down the street and see something interesting over the road? then cross over and take a look. Play with the a keyboard in the shop and like the feel? buy a cheap one, get some lessons, pursue it until you no longer want to. You may drop it, you may become a rockstar. You don't need to know you want to be a rockstar though.
Children are already curious, we spend a lot of time trying to get them to formalise their curiosity into concrete plans. Life doesn't need long term planning, to be successful, or be happy.
Trading off satisfaction/mental health benefits with the very real stress of "a financially challenging life" is something I am constantly confronted with when I look at our son's life (now 34). In some ways I admire his committment to NOT working 40 hours a week, so that he has time and energy for his art and music which is what really makes being alive worth it for him. But when he doesn't even earn enough to pay for a place to live, has no savings, no real future prospects of anything changing ... I am not sure that his satisfaction at working on art/music can balance that out.
You may not be able to do whatever you want, but you can often get a lot further than you think. The first few years after school are the time to shoot for the moon.
I agree with your sentiment, but I would add two caveats:
1) Its not obvious, and hard to predict, when something one enjoys would actually make an satisfying career. Many find that turning passions into means-to-put-food-on-the-table kills the passion, or warps it.
2) Its not obvious, and hard to predict, how the mental and physical health hit will be from a "financially challenging life". Some are fine scraping by, but on average, being financially insecure is highly correlated with depression, suicide, anxiety, substance abuse issues, divorce, etc etc.
All that to say, its good to be as realistic as possible with children, and as another suggested not only focus on high time frame decisions, and as you suggested avoid casting things as merely financial decisions.
> Unfortunately many of these trade-offs are presented financially to kids; that doing what you love may result in a financially challenging life, and ignore the satisfaction and mental health benefits that would derive from such a choice
While not strictly true, it’s very much true in the general sense. Many of our passions don’t make us money. Like it or not, living in society requires quite a lot of money.
Struggling financially puts a strain on mental health, job satisfaction, relationships, etc. It dominates your experiences, your thoughts, your food, and ultimately your lifespan. It’s *hard*.
“Work hard”, “do what you love and you’ll never work a day in your life”, “my passion is my work”, blah blah blah. These extremes taint the thought process of our children. As a society we poisoned the minds of multiple generations.
We _should_ be teaching children that their job does not define them. That “do what you love” is unrealistic. Do what allows you to be comfortable and do what you love. Will you have be able to humblebrag on social media? Probably not. Will you be in the top 10% financially? Probably not. Will you not struggle financially and have time to do the things you actually love (family, friends, hobbies, whatever)? Hopefully! That’s the goal.
Like remedial math, those messages might not be targeted at your kids, or any kids who get meaningful support at home. There are a lot of kids who are constantly told they are useless and will never be good for anything.
In first grade, you 100% tell them they can be whatever they want, by the end of 12th (or however it works where you are) they should be honestly looking at what sort of things make money to handle that part of life. But also, you know, how to be happy and such.
Several parts resonated with me. This one early in the article stood out:
> But the vast majority of what I know in my work has come from continuously saying “yes” to jobs I’ve never done before – I decided I could figure them out by being careful.
I learned something like the above from my dad — watching him jump head-long into things he knew nothing about (or very little about).
When I was a teenager and travelled to Alaska to visit him he had just got a job there running the water treatment plant in Homer. He took me up to the plant where he showed me how yeti all works — the huge osmosis filtration system, the small laboratory onsite for insuring the city water quality. He showed me how he draws water out and runs various tests on it. Dipping a test tube first into a bath of HCl acid (with his bare fingers) before rinsing it, filling it with sample water, then into an ultrasonic bath to release any dissolved gases, then into a device that measures the water turbidity by shining light though the glass vial and measuring the scattered light.
I knew he had taken Chemistry in college but running a water treatment plant did not seem to be on his resumé to my knowledge. "How did you know how to do this?" I asked. He pointed to a three-foot row of binders along one counter in the lab and said, "I read the manuals they keep here."
"But how did you even get the job?"
"Told them I had worked as a chemist (true), and said I could do it...."
This was a small town in Alaska so maybe things were a little looser — but still, I admired his fearlessness. Knowing him I suspect too if I had asked him what the consequences would have been if he had failed or been "found out" I am sure he would have said, as he often did, "What's the worst thing that could happen? I get fired."
I was also amazed then to see him adding a room onto his small home in town. I was not shy to add weather stripping to a door or window but once you are pouring a footer, framing, hanging drywall you were, in my mind, firmly in pro territory. Somehow my dad just jumped into it and figured he could learn it (best to learn on your own house, I guess).
What's the worst thing that could happen? He would have to hire someone to come in and finish his mess.
Since then I have tried not to have pre-supposing mental barriers as to what I can and cannot do. And in a lot of ways the world of possibilities began to open up for me.
I mention all the above because I have found throughout my life that most people seem to be like I was before my encounters with my dad started to change my perceptions. I want other people too to be unafraid to try doing a thing themselves.
I think that there is a whole skill set in learning how to do what your father was doing, and it has been one that I've worked on a lot in my life.
One thing you may keep in mind is that "getting fired" or "hiring another contractor" aren't, in fact, the "worst that can happen".
I have been doing a certain amount of "entertainment rigging" (suspending $100K+ stacks of speakers in the air for concerts). I didn't have as great a perception of our responsibilities for the safety of other people until I started working on things that could easily kill someone if the job is done poorly. My standard went from "would I stand under that?" to "would I let my buddy's kids stand under that"?
In many things there are plenty of "even worse" outcomes- your water system could have lead in it, for instance. Or the wall could blow down and kill someone.
I don't say that as a criticism of your father; rather there are two motivations:
a) part (perhaps most) of the skill set of being willing to try and fail is knowing when to call someone else who does "know"
b) it's good to be kind with ourselves about being a little afraid when we are doing things because often we can't know what we don't know.
[+] [-] karaterobot|2 years ago|reply
But even if the AI technologies we're so nervously excited about replace all our jobs, the handymen, plumbers, and electricians of the world will be mostly unaffected. Their work is hard to automate. I hesitate to say we'll change places in terms of economic status—more likely, all the out of work engineers and designers will move into those industries and drive down the prices.
[+] [-] neverartful|2 years ago|reply
Regarding AI technologies, I agree that it's extremely unlikely that AI will take over the work. It's possible that may help in some diagnostic cases. I strongly disagree with "all the out of work engineers and designers will move into those industries". Why? Many (perhaps most even) software engineers that I've worked with are too lazy or too proud to do handyman type work. Some of the handyman work can be physically quite taxing and some of it can be quite humbling. Examples of taxing work - when you're doing a gate rebuild/repair in 107 degree temperature in direct sun. Example of humbling work - opening up p-traps under sinks and having some of the smelly, dirty water splash on you.
[+] [-] atticora|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] p1esk|2 years ago|reply
It’s funny, when I started in ML 10 years ago people said the same thing about writers, artists, musicians. And yet here we are today. Robotics is just the next thing to be “solved” in AI field, the same way computer vision or NLP got solved - after decades of hard effort and little progress. Once the algorithms are ready people will build robots who will be much better than humans at any physical tasks: faster and more precise.
[+] [-] teddyh|2 years ago|reply
And so there are many problems we [programmers] don't have. For instance, if we put an if statement inside of a while statement, we don't have to worry about whether the if statement can get enough power to run at the speed it's going to run. We don't have to worry about whether it will run at a speed that generates radio frequency interference and induces wrong values in some other parts of the data. We don't have to worry about whether it will loop at a speed that causes a resonance and eventually the if statement will vibrate against the while statement and one of them will crack. We don't have to worry that chemicals in the environment will get into the boundary between the if statement and the while statement and corrode them, and cause a bad connection. We don't have to worry that other chemicals will get on them and cause a short-circuit. We don't have to worry about whether the heat can be dissipated from this if statement through the surrounding while statement. We don't have to worry about whether the while statement would cause so much voltage drop that the if statement won't function correctly. When you look at the value of a variable you don't have to worry about whether you've referenced that variable so many times that you exceed the fan-out limit. You don't have to worry about how much capacitance there is in a certain variable and how much time it will take to store the value in it.
All these things are defined a way, the system is defined to function in a certain way, and it always does. The physical computer might malfunction, but that's not the program's fault. So, because of all these problems we don't have to deal with, our field is tremendously easier.”
— Richard Stallman, 2001: <https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/stallman-mec-india.html#conf9>
[+] [-] dennis_jeeves2|2 years ago|reply
I will actually then think that all this AI stuff is not smoke and mirrors, the way it currently appears to be.
[+] [-] FrustratedMonky|2 years ago|reply
I'm not building sky scrapers (next triple AAA game engine), I'm fixing the leak in the ceiling (bug with some in-house corporate gui). It can be a little soul-draining, but do it for the kids.
[+] [-] joshuanapoli|2 years ago|reply
Through COVID, I’ve had a lot of obvious gains. I used to commute four hours a day, and now I work from home. I’m paid more. I’m working with more interesting technology. Despite all of that, I still alternate between putting a lot of effort into finding my next step to a bigger career or feeling bad about not putting enough energy into it.
The handyman must be less restless.
[+] [-] SuperNinKenDo|2 years ago|reply
Cecil's purpose is a bit different, but beyond the obvious theme of using the building of a house for philosophical reflection, I do think there's some cross-over in insights, if not in focus.
I recommend it to anyone, ESPECIALLY anyone thinking about, or in the process of, building a house. And his channel in general is excellent fun.
[1.1] https://youtu.be/GDg194s5tnQ
[1.2] https://youtu.be/iId98RogAIg
[1.3] https://youtu.be/-eXQZZsMAz0
[+] [-] theGnuMe|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] everdrive|2 years ago|reply
I've long observed that modern culture and media seem to be really stuck on this idea that kids everywhere are having their dreams held back by evil adults who just want to crush their dreams, for no good reason in particular. The archetype in many movies is that some adult is telling some kid to abandon his dreams.
I always found this interesting because no one ever attempted this with me. As suggested, they attempted the opposite, and told me that I could be whatever I wanted. Ultimately I think this was well-intended, but harmful advice. Most of the things I like or care about aren't just infeasible careers -- they're not jobs at all. The things I'm "passionate" about are just not career-worthy. I like reading books, playing video games, doing house chores while listening to podcasts, and talking to friends. It might sound stupid, but as a younger adult (18-25) I really had the mistaken impression that I didn't enjoy work because I hadn't found a good job yet. Really, there was nothing I enjoyed in my life which could actually survive the transition to a career. What I just described is really all leisure, and can't count as work.
Yes, you can technically make a career out of the things I listed, but they cease to bear much resemblance to how I participated in them. Casually playing a video game occasionally is much different from developing or writing, or reviewing games. Occasionally reading a good book is much different from being able to write a book, or reviewing books for a living, etc. And a proclivity towards enjoying a book every so often says nothing about one's ability to make a career out of books. I suppose the point I'm trying to drive at is that there is a wide berth between what someone is interested in, and their ability to make that into a career.
I would have benefited from being forced into the workplace sooner so that I could realize that all jobs out there are "work," even if there are some enjoyable aspects to them. ie, that there are fundamental differences between work and leisure, and that a kid who enjoys some hobbies is totally incapable of identifying his "passions." But, no one really seems to want to tell that story, at least in popular media. They want an easy good guy and bad guy. They seem fixated on the idea that as a child I truly knew myself, and in some sense was pure -- and that the world was an adulterating influence, bitterly set on holding me back. The opposite was true: as a child I barely know myself, and the world was ready to teach me important lessons, but mentors and media kept trying to protect me from learning about the world.
[+] [-] steveBK123|2 years ago|reply
Educators and parents don't do a great job of saying "if you want to be A, then you should work on your V skills" or "while you may be passionate about C, it is not a career.. have you considered D,E,F?".
And also for those going off to college it would be useful to have the hard conversation early "while it may be fun to live in G HCOL city for 4 years, if you want to make a life there, you are going to need a HCOL paying job like H,I,J.. so maybe don't pursue low ROI degree K".
I definitely interacted with a lot of younger millenials/GenZ in my career who were constantly changing jobs laterally because nothing was a "good fit". So they spent the first 5 years of their career churning water instead of doubling their salary. This is the kind of thing that sets a person back for life.
To me it's like "wow yeah you don't find working on a CRUD app / BI analytics / retail website to be the most life affirming thing in the world?" Guess what, as Mad Men said.. "that's what the money is for". People can have hobbies!
[+] [-] intelVISA|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] vl|2 years ago|reply
Our collective approach to education reflects this new economic situation.
It’s even harder to give any advice to children now, with AI massively disrupting everything in few short years.
[+] [-] dajtxx|2 years ago|reply
I think the guy is underselling himself. He's running his own successful business, something I cannot imagine doing. He's hitting new (even if similar) problems every day with real world settings and real world consequences, and helping people. Sounds pretty impressive to me. When it comes to DIY I don't stretch beyond fixing tap washers or replacing power switches with obvious problems for fear of causing expensive damage.
The fact he can do it while battling on going mental health hassles is impressive too.
[+] [-] mcbishop|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] georgeoliver|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ChrisMarshallNY|2 years ago|reply
Sadly, this guy does not sound like any handyman that I've known, but then, I have not known any handymen with a theology degree.
But I have certainly known a number of fairly incongruous folks, in unusual vocations, so I'm not surprised.
[+] [-] raintrees|2 years ago|reply
Integrity is one of my targets. And I mostly sleep well at night.
[+] [-] moneywoes|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] georgeoliver|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bequanna|2 years ago|reply
We should be thankful the US doesn’t have a system like that which artificially reduces the supply of labor.
We should make it easier for people to work in the trades. Not wrap and bunch of unnecessary formality and regulation around it.
[+] [-] globalnode|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pards|2 years ago|reply
This is the danger of participation awards. It's how people end up in careers they aren't suited to.
As a society, we owe it to our children to be honest with them and guide them down paths that will satisfy the aspects of life that are important to them. It's a balancing act between ability, aptitude, drive, and personality.
Doing well in math and science does not necessarily mean that the child will be happy in a career that require those skills, especially if they actually enjoy music, art, or shop class more.
Unfortunately many of these trade-offs are presented financially to kids; that doing what you love may result in a financially challenging life, and ignore the satisfaction and mental health benefits that would derive from such a choice.
[+] [-] have_faith|2 years ago|reply
Really, you can pursue anything you want to, regardless of the time horizon that you have considered it in.
Walk down the street and see something interesting over the road? then cross over and take a look. Play with the a keyboard in the shop and like the feel? buy a cheap one, get some lessons, pursue it until you no longer want to. You may drop it, you may become a rockstar. You don't need to know you want to be a rockstar though.
Children are already curious, we spend a lot of time trying to get them to formalise their curiosity into concrete plans. Life doesn't need long term planning, to be successful, or be happy.
[+] [-] PaulDavisThe1st|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sjducb|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] psd1|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tyrvale4760|2 years ago|reply
All that to say, its good to be as realistic as possible with children, and as another suggested not only focus on high time frame decisions, and as you suggested avoid casting things as merely financial decisions.
[+] [-] biiiyyt|2 years ago|reply
While not strictly true, it’s very much true in the general sense. Many of our passions don’t make us money. Like it or not, living in society requires quite a lot of money.
Struggling financially puts a strain on mental health, job satisfaction, relationships, etc. It dominates your experiences, your thoughts, your food, and ultimately your lifespan. It’s *hard*.
“Work hard”, “do what you love and you’ll never work a day in your life”, “my passion is my work”, blah blah blah. These extremes taint the thought process of our children. As a society we poisoned the minds of multiple generations.
We _should_ be teaching children that their job does not define them. That “do what you love” is unrealistic. Do what allows you to be comfortable and do what you love. Will you have be able to humblebrag on social media? Probably not. Will you be in the top 10% financially? Probably not. Will you not struggle financially and have time to do the things you actually love (family, friends, hobbies, whatever)? Hopefully! That’s the goal.
[+] [-] rfrey|2 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jrm4|2 years ago|reply
In first grade, you 100% tell them they can be whatever they want, by the end of 12th (or however it works where you are) they should be honestly looking at what sort of things make money to handle that part of life. But also, you know, how to be happy and such.
[+] [-] unknown|2 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] Rhondalynn|2 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] JKCalhoun|2 years ago|reply
Several parts resonated with me. This one early in the article stood out:
> But the vast majority of what I know in my work has come from continuously saying “yes” to jobs I’ve never done before – I decided I could figure them out by being careful.
I learned something like the above from my dad — watching him jump head-long into things he knew nothing about (or very little about).
When I was a teenager and travelled to Alaska to visit him he had just got a job there running the water treatment plant in Homer. He took me up to the plant where he showed me how yeti all works — the huge osmosis filtration system, the small laboratory onsite for insuring the city water quality. He showed me how he draws water out and runs various tests on it. Dipping a test tube first into a bath of HCl acid (with his bare fingers) before rinsing it, filling it with sample water, then into an ultrasonic bath to release any dissolved gases, then into a device that measures the water turbidity by shining light though the glass vial and measuring the scattered light.
I knew he had taken Chemistry in college but running a water treatment plant did not seem to be on his resumé to my knowledge. "How did you know how to do this?" I asked. He pointed to a three-foot row of binders along one counter in the lab and said, "I read the manuals they keep here."
"But how did you even get the job?"
"Told them I had worked as a chemist (true), and said I could do it...."
This was a small town in Alaska so maybe things were a little looser — but still, I admired his fearlessness. Knowing him I suspect too if I had asked him what the consequences would have been if he had failed or been "found out" I am sure he would have said, as he often did, "What's the worst thing that could happen? I get fired."
I was also amazed then to see him adding a room onto his small home in town. I was not shy to add weather stripping to a door or window but once you are pouring a footer, framing, hanging drywall you were, in my mind, firmly in pro territory. Somehow my dad just jumped into it and figured he could learn it (best to learn on your own house, I guess).
What's the worst thing that could happen? He would have to hire someone to come in and finish his mess.
Since then I have tried not to have pre-supposing mental barriers as to what I can and cannot do. And in a lot of ways the world of possibilities began to open up for me.
I mention all the above because I have found throughout my life that most people seem to be like I was before my encounters with my dad started to change my perceptions. I want other people too to be unafraid to try doing a thing themselves.
[+] [-] scarecrowbob|2 years ago|reply
One thing you may keep in mind is that "getting fired" or "hiring another contractor" aren't, in fact, the "worst that can happen".
I have been doing a certain amount of "entertainment rigging" (suspending $100K+ stacks of speakers in the air for concerts). I didn't have as great a perception of our responsibilities for the safety of other people until I started working on things that could easily kill someone if the job is done poorly. My standard went from "would I stand under that?" to "would I let my buddy's kids stand under that"?
In many things there are plenty of "even worse" outcomes- your water system could have lead in it, for instance. Or the wall could blow down and kill someone.
I don't say that as a criticism of your father; rather there are two motivations:
a) part (perhaps most) of the skill set of being willing to try and fail is knowing when to call someone else who does "know"
b) it's good to be kind with ourselves about being a little afraid when we are doing things because often we can't know what we don't know.
[+] [-] NaishaBerrios12|2 years ago|reply
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