The article tries to articulate the value add through attention to detail in manufacturing "so the bags survive 6 years of rough and tumble", but I'm not really getting it. What am I missing?
I had a $60-in-1995 northface backpack that lasted through hauling 5+ periods of textbooks every day, walking and biking to middle school and highschool. It worked fine, in fact my dad still uses it (30 years later) to hold and transport teaching materials for a college course he teaches. Lots of kids got by with a single basic $25 Jansport.
Today, kids in the U.S. don't even tote many (or any) books, most of the content and schoolwork takes place on a lightweight Chromebook that stays in the classroom.
The moment you add an aspect of culture and social pressure all economics goes out of the window. The bags cost $450 because it is the expectation that grandparents will buy an expensive school bag for their grandkids, that's it. Everything else ("it's handcrafted!", "it has 200 parts!", "it's durable") is reverse justification from there.
It's the same as trying to figure out why a tiny piece of abundant rock costs thousands of dollars when sold as an "engagement ring".
Curious coincidence, I bought a randoseru (ランドセル) [1][2][3] early this morning and complained to my wife all the way to the store. She doesn’t want our children to look different at school. They are already different enough for being hāfu [4] and she doesn’t want to traumatize them even more. The bags are stiff and, in my eyes, quite ugly, and children are supposed to carry several books every day, good exercise but there are much better alternatives. Schools are just too bully to let anyone use a different style.
As the saying goes → 出る杭は打たれる “The stake that sticks out will be driven down.”
I enjoyed the article but like much of online content about Japan it comes off like obsessive fan service.
Can you imagine carrying 1-2kg empty backpack with you every day? Just because something took long to make doesn't mean it's superior in production or quality or even perception. It's pretty, fashionable and the tradition is wholesome but that's where it ends.
I got a free backpack with my new Thinkpad laptop recently. It's light, well designed, mass produced, easy to personalize - would take this over the 450$ school bags any time of the year.
I'll hazard a guess - Japan is a walking society, and these backpacks are being worn every day, laden with books, back and forth from home to school, or on buses or the subway.
Americans generally get driven to school. The backpack is worn only between classes at school and then moved from car trunk to home, not worn during those times.
I personally wore out a $100 Eddie Bauer backpack every other year or so during middle/high school. I walked to school every day for over a mile, rain or shine. The zippers would completely fail, or the shoulder straps would detach. Eddie Bauer had a lifetime warranty so they replaced the backpacks without question.
The article seems to be aware of the fact that plastic backpacks can be durable too: "Some schools in Shimane prefecture have moved to city-provided lightweight nylon backpacks called ran-bags (yeah, don’t ask me how they name things in Japan). Unlike the randoseru, these cost a much more affordable 8,000 yen (57 USD), are lighter, and just as durable."
Also, you add your kid to Club 450 USD-schoolbag. That can be good or bad, as the other kids in that club may or may not be assholes and your kid may or may not want to be in that club. Does your kid even want to be the kid with the 450 USD school bag?
I came from a family that could easily have afforded the 450 USD school bag. But that would have been ridiculous to me. If you are rich and want to teach your kid to treat money so they can survive without inheritance, you definitely should do the opposite of buying them the 450 USD school bag. A lot about a good person is about valuing the right things the right amount. School bags are cool, but bad ones are not that much worse than 450 USD ones.
As someone coming from one of the richer families in my schools I always was the guy using what was there. My brothers old bag, some rucksack that wasn't in use anymore, a shopping bag. I certainly never looked rich. If I wanted anything more I had to buy it using my own money, and that was slimmer than the money of some of my poorer peers. If I made my case well and long enough in front of my parents they would support what I was trying to get with a fraction of their money. And there was always birthdays/christmas. I was one of the few kids in school not playing the game of defining yourself via branded cloths and I had a convinced stand on that. Nobody that I truly cared about gave a damn about this anyways, quite the opposite: Many had respect for me not playing these games and having the convidence to do it. To
My parents not just buying me every shit was one of the best educational things they ever did (and they did a lot of good).
450 USD is a lot of money for any bag, the only kind where this kind of money makes sense is specialized hiking gear (if you hike enough to justify the expense). But sometimes not spending 450 USD on a bag is the lesson you need to teach your kid.
My kids carry a ton of books, I'm a large guy and find their bags weigh a ton, it's awful for my kids. I have a 5'3 100' daughter and her bag weighs a significant portion of her own weight.
And their Chromebooks are not the tiny svelte high end ones. They're the chunky cheap and heavy ones too. And they're Middleschool, so can't leave them in one classroom, they get toted around, and back to home for homework every day.
> Today, kids in the U.S. don't even tote many (or any) books, most of the content and schoolwork takes place on a lightweight Chromebook that stays in the classroom.
This may be a regional thing, because my kids have to lug heavier loads back and forth to school every day than I ever had to when I was a kid, and that's on top of their Chromebooks and sometimes an instrument for band. They also don't get lockers big enough to store anything substantial so they've got to carry everything all the time. We pretty much go through a new backpack each year for each kid because they get so worn down from having their capacity continuously stretched to the limit.
> Today, kids in the U.S. don't even tote many (or any) books, most of the content and schoolwork takes place on a lightweight Chromebook that stays in the classroom.
> I had a $60-in-1995 northface backpack that lasted through hauling 5+ periods of textbooks every day
Mine did that, and has since been lying out in the rain in the back yard holding firewood. It's a decade+ later and the thing is still perfectly fine other than being a bit dirty. Bet a good wash would get it back to being perfectly usable as a backpack.
I’m with you on that. I’ve had a north face bag for almost 20 years (and it looks like it!) but it’s still strong as can be.
The unfortunate thing is I was in the market for a new bag and went to the north face store of course and the only bag they had in the whole store was some shoestring style bag. Quite disappointing to see north face forget their roots.
Hello! Author here. Pleasantly surprised to see this on the front page! I thought I'd address a couple of questions here:
- Why is it so expensive?
You can definitely buy cheaper randoserus made in China and these are giving lower-end Japanese manufacturers a run for their money. For example, https://www.amazon.co.jp/-/en/dp/B09H5RLGQF is around 45 dollars.
Even off-the-shelf Japanese randoserus are cheaper than the customized ones.
Some basic reasons for the high cost are: materials (leather, fake leather) are expensive, there are many parts, manual assembly, and the variations and customizations don't lend themselves to scale.
Randoseru often last longer with good care, and are in fact passed down. Many organizations also collect and donate used randoseru to the less privileged. There are also businesses that will recycle the high quality materials into other accessories: See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHcgol5i7gs
In addition to this, some people also get their randoseru "minified", where it's cut up and a fist sized version made. My wife still has hers.
My son just received his first randoseru and the company that made it offers to "minify" using almost all of the original key parts from his, in the future.
While I think Japanese society has lots of good traits and outcomes such as a low crime rate, and a ethic to involve everyone in process improvements, this is another clear example of what the English call "keeping up appearances". It seems Japanese call it "tatemae" -
https://japan-dev.com/blog/honne-and-tatemae
If it's so expensive and durable, where does that bag go after school? Why does each generation have to buy new bags, why are they not passed down from parents to children?
Do you expect a sensible “because of reason X” answer to those questions?
I have zero expectation of rationality from this type of thing. People will give reasons to buy a new one, just like you gave reasons to use an old one. But ultimately it is the cost/benefit of aligning behaviors with other people which will drive their decisions.
A new randoseru made of genuine or synthetic leather can carry a price tag of around 30,000–40,000 yen at a chain store/supermarket. Typically randoseru from department stores or traditional workshops will be priced in the region of 55,000–70,000 yen, with some models (particularly those branded with logos) reaching over 100,000 yen. Clarino, a synthetic material frequently used as a substitute, reduces the cost somewhat. Often randoseru are available on auction sites in new or used condition at much lower prices, particularly after the start of the Japanese school year in April. As of January 2012, the five top randoseru in order of popularity at Amazon.co.jp are in the range of ¥8,280–¥16,980 yen.
Translating those numbers to US dollars and rounding a bit, we get:
New one at the supermarket: US$ 210-280
Department store or traditional workshop: US$ 390-400
Prestigious logo: $700
Most popular on Amazon.co.jp back in 2012: US$ 60-120.
What the distribution of sales are between those $60 bags and those $700 bags is, and how much shit a kid carrying a $60 bag will get from the kids carrying the pricier ones, I dunno. It certainly seems that Mr. and Mrs. One-From-Nippon are definitely looking at some upscale-ass randoseru though.
I ran with the same Jansport bag from 1989-2000. I wonder if they still offer that awesome warranty? As a kid my family really didn't know about it and it was pre-internet. My grandma was amazing repairing it. These bags do look pretty cool IMO but I feel there's more to the price that is essentially the generational guilt-trip of a custom that makes it that price.
I was going to say something similar, I think I had the same cheap Jansport pack from the mid-80s until well into college. Replaced it with another <$25 pack from Costco that I've kept until now. The main difference has been the inclusion of a padded laptop pocket.
The free backpacks I get every so often from work are "ok". My employer gave me a <$100-ish pack I've also enjoyed for the last decade or so without trouble.
Unless that pack comes with a bit of gold in it, or part of a college degree, I have no idea what makes it worth it.
I was talking about randoseru with my daughter just the other day. She and her sister both attended Japanese public elementary schools and used the same randoseru for all six years. Though she was tall for her age, she complained about the weight of it then and doesn’t have fond memories of it now. Her son will be starting at a public elementary school in Yokohama in a couple of years, and she doesn’t seem eager to get a randoseru for him. While some of the kids I see walking to and from that school have randoseru, most are carrying lighter and more versatile cloth backpacks.
This grandparent will be happy to pay for whatever my daughter wants for her son, though it’s likely that she will insist on paying for it herself.
To insert a sentence that has nothing to do with the topic, I am in China. My daughter is in the second grade of elementary school. Her schoolbag must weigh 6 kilograms and contains various books, exercise books, and test papers. This was not the case when I was in elementary school. My little schoolbag was empty, with only 2 books and 2 thin notebooks. Nowadays, children have too much homework and they have to write until 10pm every day.
This isn't really the math. A $50 backpack from a decent brand will easily last 5-10 years under normal use. You aren't getting anything extra in terms of durability from the $400+ worth of exotic materials and handcrafting. It's a signal of social status, like any other piece of luxury fashion, but not much more than that.
I _love_ Japanese dedication to craft; really any hyper-focused efforts, but i digress.
The problem that I have with this of course is families who cannot afford these really well made pieces of gear (touched on at the end of the article) and where children who can't afford it are ostracized because of it.
Growing up I was on meal plans due to our financial status and paying in physical tickets, made me and the others like me a small target of ridicule. Personally I don't think it was a lot, but naturally we banded together and became friends simply because we paid for lunches a particular way.
The social pressure is crazy and unnecessary and feel terrible for the kids who can't have it as well as the families who literally sacrifice for it.
I have a Saddleback thin front pocket backpack that’s currently 7 years old. I plan on passing it down to my grandson when he graduates college in around 20 years and he can pass it down to his grandkid when he is done with it.
We needed very durable backpacks when I was in high school because our books were so heavy, and my school had no lockers (so you were carrying 4-5 textbooks at all times). But as students have shifted to online learning platforms, wouldn't they have less of a need for extremely sturdy/roomy backpacks? I recently spoke to a college grad who said that all of his learning in HS was online, meaning he never needed to carry any textbooks. Do they not use online learning materials as much in Japan? Or is this a cultural phenomenon that will change slowly, even though the need has changed?
In college a friend had a leather school bag, which, I recall, he described as used by primary school students in Holland. Same sort of concept. It’s meant to last for your primary schooling. Made from leather, in the shape of a briefcase with shoulder straps.
I think the idea is if you take care of it as a child, then at some point you transition from stiff shoulder bag to broken-in briefcase—or something like that. Symbolic of a transition to adulthood.
BTW-That video was really lovely. I liked the simple montage of the workers at the end.
Seems like a great way to ensure money is spent within the local economy.
The backpacks look amazing.
In Canada catholic high schools students still wear uniforms. The uniforms are made to last. And the Canadian company that makes them has been in business for 50 years.
> After a few rounds of bastardization, ransel became “randoseru” in Japanese.
I thought there was actually a formal transliteration system the Japanese use for foreign words? Like with cutlet becoming katsu retsu. Not quite “bastardization”.
There is a formulaic way to transliterate words based either on their roman lettering or their pronunciation in their native tongue. But loanwords aren't always mere transliterations, they often have some kind of adaptation or simplification. So like for example the word building would be nigh impossible to transliterate relying on its roman lettering alone. It would have to be pronounced something like buierujingu. Using its pronunciation in English would be a better starting point; transcribing that into Japanese sounds would be like birujingu. And what Japanese actually does is take birujingu and cut it in half, and thus the actual word for building is biru. (Well, not exactly. Biru is just talking about modern buildings, like concrete and/or steel construction. The word for "building" in general is tatemono.)
I don’t know if there’s a formal method, but there is a method – given an English word, I can almost always figure out how to say it as an English-to-Japanese loanword. Somehow. I think it’s just something that comes naturally once you understand the phonetics?
Interesting points about the nuances of a $450 bag that’s rather impractical when it’s more a story than a justification. I’m just here to comment that this was a lovely read, thanks for posting!
$450 for a custom, hand-made leather backpack is a pretty decent price. Leather bags last forever if taken care of and look better as they age. That could easily be a lifetime bag.
"That's ludicrous!", he says, as he avoids looking at the Filson bag next to his chair.
(Although, in fairness, I don't expect to ever have to buy another bag, and I'll take better care of this than I would've any bag my elders gave me as a child.)
metadat|2 years ago
I had a $60-in-1995 northface backpack that lasted through hauling 5+ periods of textbooks every day, walking and biking to middle school and highschool. It worked fine, in fact my dad still uses it (30 years later) to hold and transport teaching materials for a college course he teaches. Lots of kids got by with a single basic $25 Jansport.
Today, kids in the U.S. don't even tote many (or any) books, most of the content and schoolwork takes place on a lightweight Chromebook that stays in the classroom.
paxys|2 years ago
It's the same as trying to figure out why a tiny piece of abundant rock costs thousands of dollars when sold as an "engagement ring".
guessmyname|2 years ago
As the saying goes → 出る杭は打たれる “The stake that sticks out will be driven down.”
[1] https://tsuchiya-randoseru.jp
[2] https://www.seiban.co.jp
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randoseru
[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hāfu
wraptile|2 years ago
Can you imagine carrying 1-2kg empty backpack with you every day? Just because something took long to make doesn't mean it's superior in production or quality or even perception. It's pretty, fashionable and the tradition is wholesome but that's where it ends.
I got a free backpack with my new Thinkpad laptop recently. It's light, well designed, mass produced, easy to personalize - would take this over the 450$ school bags any time of the year.
jerlam|2 years ago
Americans generally get driven to school. The backpack is worn only between classes at school and then moved from car trunk to home, not worn during those times.
I personally wore out a $100 Eddie Bauer backpack every other year or so during middle/high school. I walked to school every day for over a mile, rain or shine. The zippers would completely fail, or the shoulder straps would detach. Eddie Bauer had a lifetime warranty so they replaced the backpacks without question.
ummonk|2 years ago
atoav|2 years ago
I came from a family that could easily have afforded the 450 USD school bag. But that would have been ridiculous to me. If you are rich and want to teach your kid to treat money so they can survive without inheritance, you definitely should do the opposite of buying them the 450 USD school bag. A lot about a good person is about valuing the right things the right amount. School bags are cool, but bad ones are not that much worse than 450 USD ones.
As someone coming from one of the richer families in my schools I always was the guy using what was there. My brothers old bag, some rucksack that wasn't in use anymore, a shopping bag. I certainly never looked rich. If I wanted anything more I had to buy it using my own money, and that was slimmer than the money of some of my poorer peers. If I made my case well and long enough in front of my parents they would support what I was trying to get with a fraction of their money. And there was always birthdays/christmas. I was one of the few kids in school not playing the game of defining yourself via branded cloths and I had a convinced stand on that. Nobody that I truly cared about gave a damn about this anyways, quite the opposite: Many had respect for me not playing these games and having the convidence to do it. To
My parents not just buying me every shit was one of the best educational things they ever did (and they did a lot of good).
450 USD is a lot of money for any bag, the only kind where this kind of money makes sense is specialized hiking gear (if you hike enough to justify the expense). But sometimes not spending 450 USD on a bag is the lesson you need to teach your kid.
addicted|2 years ago
It just points out that these bags do need to last 6 years so they aren’t throwaway items.
In fact, towards the end it points to how some schools are managing to achieve the same with $60 bags “ran-bags”.
I think you’re reading too much into it if you think the article is trying to justify the cost.
It’s trying to explain the cost, which is driven by the fact that these are hand made and have a ton of parts and also need to last many years.
selcuka|2 years ago
I don't think it does. The emphasis is on being a hand crafted item:
> A randoseru can have up to 200 die cut parts and polyurethane back plates, and are mostly assembled by hand, making it an expensive item to produce.
It even says that cheaper bags are even better:
> Unlike the randoseru, these cost a much more affordable 8,000 yen (57 USD), are lighter, and just as durable.
hnbear|2 years ago
And their Chromebooks are not the tiny svelte high end ones. They're the chunky cheap and heavy ones too. And they're Middleschool, so can't leave them in one classroom, they get toted around, and back to home for homework every day.
Rudism|2 years ago
This may be a regional thing, because my kids have to lug heavier loads back and forth to school every day than I ever had to when I was a kid, and that's on top of their Chromebooks and sometimes an instrument for band. They also don't get lockers big enough to store anything substantial so they've got to carry everything all the time. We pretty much go through a new backpack each year for each kid because they get so worn down from having their capacity continuously stretched to the limit.
dmamills|2 years ago
Likely a disrespect for a living wage for a common craftsman, and a misunderstanding of what quality goods actually are.
Certainly a lot of kids here survived on cheap $25 jansports, but did the people making them?
GuB-42|2 years ago
Not in Japan, according to the article.
rokkitmensch|2 years ago
Doxin|2 years ago
Mine did that, and has since been lying out in the rain in the back yard holding firewood. It's a decade+ later and the thing is still perfectly fine other than being a bit dirty. Bet a good wash would get it back to being perfectly usable as a backpack.
soultrees|2 years ago
The unfortunate thing is I was in the market for a new bag and went to the north face store of course and the only bag they had in the whole store was some shoestring style bag. Quite disappointing to see north face forget their roots.
rascul|2 years ago
Those zippers never lasted long for me.
option|2 years ago
- a disastrous mistake.
kizunajp|2 years ago
- Why is it so expensive?
You can definitely buy cheaper randoserus made in China and these are giving lower-end Japanese manufacturers a run for their money. For example, https://www.amazon.co.jp/-/en/dp/B09H5RLGQF is around 45 dollars.
Even off-the-shelf Japanese randoserus are cheaper than the customized ones.
For an example of the well-thought out design of randoseru, this video does a good job: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/WtWiuWBU9r8
Some basic reasons for the high cost are: materials (leather, fake leather) are expensive, there are many parts, manual assembly, and the variations and customizations don't lend themselves to scale.
This article lists some reasons Japanese randoseru are so expensive: https://rand--torisetu-com.translate.goog/kakaku?_x_tr_sl=au... .
- What happens after 6 years?
Randoseru often last longer with good care, and are in fact passed down. Many organizations also collect and donate used randoseru to the less privileged. There are also businesses that will recycle the high quality materials into other accessories: See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHcgol5i7gs
marak830|2 years ago
My son just received his first randoseru and the company that made it offers to "minify" using almost all of the original key parts from his, in the future.
kstrauser|2 years ago
martyvis|2 years ago
csa|2 years ago
Definitely not the same, unless I don’t understand the English usage (I’m American, but I’ve spent a lot of time around Brits and British English).
Tatemae can run deep in complexity and nuance.
grishka|2 years ago
shermantanktop|2 years ago
I have zero expectation of rationality from this type of thing. People will give reasons to buy a new one, just like you gave reasons to use an old one. But ultimately it is the cost/benefit of aligning behaviors with other people which will drive their decisions.
ekianjo|2 years ago
egypturnash|2 years ago
A new randoseru made of genuine or synthetic leather can carry a price tag of around 30,000–40,000 yen at a chain store/supermarket. Typically randoseru from department stores or traditional workshops will be priced in the region of 55,000–70,000 yen, with some models (particularly those branded with logos) reaching over 100,000 yen. Clarino, a synthetic material frequently used as a substitute, reduces the cost somewhat. Often randoseru are available on auction sites in new or used condition at much lower prices, particularly after the start of the Japanese school year in April. As of January 2012, the five top randoseru in order of popularity at Amazon.co.jp are in the range of ¥8,280–¥16,980 yen.
Translating those numbers to US dollars and rounding a bit, we get:
New one at the supermarket: US$ 210-280
Department store or traditional workshop: US$ 390-400
Prestigious logo: $700
Most popular on Amazon.co.jp back in 2012: US$ 60-120.
What the distribution of sales are between those $60 bags and those $700 bags is, and how much shit a kid carrying a $60 bag will get from the kids carrying the pricier ones, I dunno. It certainly seems that Mr. and Mrs. One-From-Nippon are definitely looking at some upscale-ass randoseru though.
1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randoseru
kraig911|2 years ago
bane|2 years ago
The free backpacks I get every so often from work are "ok". My employer gave me a <$100-ish pack I've also enjoyed for the last decade or so without trouble.
Unless that pack comes with a bit of gold in it, or part of a college degree, I have no idea what makes it worth it.
tkgally|2 years ago
This grandparent will be happy to pay for whatever my daughter wants for her son, though it’s likely that she will insist on paying for it herself.
dylanzhangdev|2 years ago
JohnBooty|2 years ago
1. A single high-quality $400 leather randoseru to last six years
2. A single high-quality $200-$400 ripstop nylon bag with high quality zippers, etc (essentially, GoRuck quality level) to last for life
3. Six years' worth of $50 Jansports that last maybe ~3 years each
4. Six years' worth of cheapass $15 Amazon Essentials level nylon bags that last ~1 year each under heavy daily use
paxys|2 years ago
peruvian|2 years ago
eru|2 years ago
irjustin|2 years ago
The problem that I have with this of course is families who cannot afford these really well made pieces of gear (touched on at the end of the article) and where children who can't afford it are ostracized because of it.
Growing up I was on meal plans due to our financial status and paying in physical tickets, made me and the others like me a small target of ridicule. Personally I don't think it was a lot, but naturally we banded together and became friends simply because we paid for lunches a particular way.
The social pressure is crazy and unnecessary and feel terrible for the kids who can't have it as well as the families who literally sacrifice for it.
ethbr1|2 years ago
Until they get to ~14+, they don't have any claim to having earned any of their family's wealth.
daguava|2 years ago
[deleted]
bombcar|2 years ago
https://saddlebackleather.com/tumbled-leather-drawstring-bac... is cheaper and more realistic, perhaps.
https://saddlebackleather.com/leather-backpack-lg is only 2 pounds and cheaper still.
kcplate|2 years ago
Amazing durable products from that company.
gnicholas|2 years ago
eru|2 years ago
(And, you could also just 'forget' your textbook, and nothing really happened.)
xtiansimon|2 years ago
I think the idea is if you take care of it as a child, then at some point you transition from stiff shoulder bag to broken-in briefcase—or something like that. Symbolic of a transition to adulthood.
BTW-That video was really lovely. I liked the simple montage of the workers at the end.
dukeofdoom|2 years ago
In Canada catholic high schools students still wear uniforms. The uniforms are made to last. And the Canadian company that makes them has been in business for 50 years.
paulmd|2 years ago
It turns out the broken window fallacy is not really a fallacy, under many economic conditions!
unknown|2 years ago
[deleted]
pfannkuchen|2 years ago
I thought there was actually a formal transliteration system the Japanese use for foreign words? Like with cutlet becoming katsu retsu. Not quite “bastardization”.
zuminator|2 years ago
pjscott|2 years ago
henearkr|2 years ago
bane|2 years ago
quickthrower2|2 years ago
elijahbenizzy|2 years ago
kizunajp|2 years ago
nunez|2 years ago
gbraad|2 years ago
webwielder2|2 years ago
kstrauser|2 years ago
(Although, in fairness, I don't expect to ever have to buy another bag, and I'll take better care of this than I would've any bag my elders gave me as a child.)
grogenaut|2 years ago
uptownfunk|2 years ago
Twflorane|2 years ago
unknown|2 years ago
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