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emurillo510 | 2 years ago

proof of stake is efficient but not decentralized in design. the rich get richer in proof of stake

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viraptor|2 years ago

Proof of work is converted into proof of stake trivially all the time. You stake by buying lots of mining hardware and power. The more you spend (the richer you are) the more you gain. The work part is just a wasteful, unnecessary step.

It's even worse, because with $1k I can barely afford one miner locally. With $1M, I can afford to buy many (and better ones) and put them in an efficient location with a custom energy plan, etc. This means the actual PoS has linear gain, but PoW is closer to exponential. (The more you have the better the RoI % you can afford for yourself)

everfree|2 years ago

This centralizing effect is actually much more powerful in proof-of-work than proof-of-stake.

Anyone can stake and earn the same % rewards, regardless of how much they have. But if you're bankrolled with hundreds of millions of dollars, you get a much higher mining % return than the little guys because you can design and manufacture your own silicon (or get bulk discounts), colocate next to power generation, and buy electricity in bulk.

0x64|2 years ago

The minimum staking amount is very close to zero. Of course, directly participating in consensus by having the opportunity of building blocks requires 32 ETH (≈$75k), or 16/8 ETH ($37k/$18k) if you run a pool for other people through e.g. the trustless Rocket Pool system.

The minimum cost to acquire an ASIC so that you can even _contribute_ to the consensus is very high (thousands), and to be profitable you have to have close to free electricity. The ironic thing is, that in PoW the "rich get richer" is abstracted away into a combination of economies of scale, and access to free/very cheap power. Plus all the e-waste and wasted power, whereas PoS runs on e-waste people run in their closet, pulling as little as sub-10 watts.

Zambyte|2 years ago

> the rich get richer in proof of stake

Also true for proof of work. And basically any economic system that exists in the wild AFAIK.

rozap|2 years ago

If I was rich I could hire a security contractor to steal Bitcoin keys. Or hire a mobster to hit someone with a $8 wrench until they give me the keys. Or hire underlings to create a scam investment vehicle to steal Bitcoin. The opportunities around!

In fact, I'd wager that the majority of opportunities for the rich to enrich themselves exist outside of the pure economic simulation world that bitcoiners use to motivate the existence of Bitcoin.

doubled112|2 years ago

> a $8 wrench

Last time I looked it was a $5 wrench. Inflation hit them too?!

treyd|2 years ago

The rich get richer in real life too. Oh the humanity.