[bennyelv]

Unfortunately you cannot discount the “sponsor effect” here. Wheel manufacturers have been pushing wider rims because it helps them sell another set of wheels to everyone.

In the days of rim brakes a wheel had a finite life (the length of time it took to wear down the braking surface). Then shimano and the frame builders pushed everyone to disc brakes, so the wheels now last for ever. What do you know, 2 years later all the wheel manufacturers are claiming “wide is better” and flogging everyone new wheels.

I’ve not seen any clear evidence that they’re right, and there’s lots of intuitive reasons to think that wider tyres will be slower (aerodynamics!). I remain sceptical, but genuinely hopeful that someone who thinks that wider is faster can provide me with some solid evidence…

[mariusor]

I feel that any marketing strategy that relies on the niche of a niche formed of the people that would buy the cutting edge cycling gear just because it's presented as an improvement over the status quo, would hardly bring any benefits to any wheel maker.

I am 100% sure that in this age of "marginal gains", the pro tour teams would not go for anything that doesn't give them it unless severely hamstrung by sponsorship deals. And I doubt that the wheel sponsors don't have multiple sizes available.

And I think you're severely overestimating wheel life span for modern models, at least due to the fact that carbon is more brittle than more pedestrian materials. Just look for Pogacar's fall earlier last week in the Giro to see how a simple flat tire makes the whole wheel a risk.

[bennyelv]

>And I think you're severely overestimating wheel life span for modern models, at least due to the fact that carbon is more brittle than more pedestrian materials. Just look for Pogacar's fall earlier last week in the Giro to see how a simple flat tire makes the whole wheel a risk.

My experience is personal, but I get 50,000km out of a set of rim brake carbon wheels ridden in all terrains and conditions and through northern european winters. At that point you're also starting to lose spokes/nipples to corrosion, but the rim could be rebuilt with new spokes and a new hub if it didn't need a brake track. That riding includes racing, crashing, potholes, punctures.

Pogacar rides on Enve wheels, which are now hookless and therefore a puncture is much more likely to result in damage. Another innovation that makes life worse for the consumer and better for the manufacturer.

[303uru]

You're kidding yourself if you think Pogacar would run 30mm tires at 55 PSI at the detriment of speed to please his sponsors. Cyclists are notorious for re-badging stuff they don't want to use and being super finicky with their gear. You're talking about guys that hardly celebrate a win with a $250k purse because they want to make sure they stopped their ride right on the finish line on their headunit.

[bennyelv]

I don't share your optimism about the strength of the scientific method in pro-cycling :) It's not too long ago (admittedly in the pre-disc brake era) that climbers would have their bike built up to sub 6.8kg and then add weight to it to bring it up to the limit rather than use deeper wheels.

If you look at TT equipment all team members use the same helmet regardless of the fact that helmet performance varies massively from rider to rider.

The 2016 S-works Venge is 5w faster than both the SL7 and SL8, so on flat stages all specialized sponsored teams are riding it... aren't they?

Why is nobody wearing a TT Helmet and visor on a normal road stage?

[seadan83]

As for evidence, here you go: https://www.renehersecycles.com/why-wider-tires-are-not-slow...

The aero drag of wider tire is not a lot. It is more the wider tires are not slower. Wider tires allow: more air volume in tire, lower PSI. In turn those help ride quality.

[bennyelv]

The aero drag is the elephant in the room here. By this study’s measurements there wasn’t much difference, but what was the width of the rim they used with the narrow tyre?

A narrow tyre on a wide rim is a wide tyre. They don’t explain or address this issue. I suspect they would have used a wide rim with all the tyres, which is notionally a sensible thing to do, but in reality it’s completely flawed.

What are the results if you used a narrower rim with the narrower tyre so that the frontal area was actually reduced as much as it could have been?

[alephxyz]

> Wheel manufacturers have been pushing wider rims because it helps them sell another set of wheels to everyone.

I think the push to wider tires and lower pressures on road setups is actually because hookless carbon rims are much easier to manufacture than clinchers, and hookless tires can't handle 80+ psi.

Clincher carbon wheels are basically considered a niche product by big manufacturers

[bennyelv]

You could be right about that. Hookless is an awful idea that benefits nobody...

[pandaman]

I think you might be transposing the cause and effect. Mechanical rim brakes had been limiting the wheel width because of physics of leverage, disc brakes opened demand for wheels of any width and users naturally migrated to the wider wheels.

[bennyelv]

It can't work like that in the world of mass produced equipment. You can only buy what the manufacturers are making, and as far as I'm aware there haven't been any wheels that are offered in different widths that the consumer can choose from.

It's always: this is the latest model, it has these features, thanks.