[gengwyn]

Sometimes this translates even down to the individual level. I've watched a lot of police bodycam videos and it's surprising how many people make their situation worse by being loud obnoxious tightwads when calmly answering questions and handing over your license would have you on your way in 5 minutes.

[deanCommie]

I get what you're saying, but being an obnoxious tightwad isn't actually against the rules, and it's not OK that there are some societies in the world where being an obnoxious tightwad towards a force ostensibly tasked with PROTECTING their fellow citizens (including the obnoxious one) will take this as a cue to 1) violate your civil liberties/rights, and/or 2) commit bodily harm to your person, and then 3) get away with it primarily without consequence.

I am scared of the police. In the rare times I have to interact with them I am overwhelmingly polite and cautious because I know that they have the ability to fuck up my day, and maybe my life.

But that's a HORRIBLE status quo. That is a bug in our society that needs to be eradicated.

Plus, I've got basically every privilege that exists under the sun, so luckily I have to encounter this problem only very rarely. I can't imagine what it must be like if you have the misfortune of being born in the wrong place or looking the wrong way, such that you have automatically tense/hostile encounters with the police continuously. At some point it must be exhausting to try to maintain this composure the entire time.

[poincaredisk]

>I am scared of the police. In the rare times I have to interact with them I am overwhelmingly polite and cautious because I know that they have the ability to fuck up my day, and maybe my life.

What are you doing to justify feeling like this? Is it just out of abundance of caution? When I interact with police it's usually for boring reasons - like I broke some petty law and they justifiably question me about it (and more often than not just let it slide, but they don't have to -after all they're just doing their job).

[vasco]

> being an obnoxious tightwad isn't actually against the rules

Growing up or re-evaluating ideas you got when you were 14 is also not against the rules.

[lcnPylGDnU4H9OF]

> people make their situation worse

I'd still be more likely to say the officer is making their situation worse. Take away the false dichotomy of loud and obnoxious vs calm and compliant and consider someone who doesn't answer irrelevant questions and is waiting for the officer to do their job (calm and not compliant). That person might have their situation worsened by the officer who thinks the person they're talking to is obligated to answer to the officer's whims.

(Based on what I've seen of police body camera footage.)

Anyway, I'm not really familiar with Kim Dotcom's case. It sounds like he's been more on the "loud and obnoxious" side and the authorities involved are not city response officers; it's hard to draw a parallel. Just pointing out that "you're just making it worse for yourself" is something a schoolyard bully would say to the kid who's too small to defend themself but refuses to comply.

[sushisource]

This kind of exactly misses the point the comment you're replying to is making. The point isn't that just complying and handing over your info is the ideal goal. The point is that, pragmatically speaking, it's a lot easier to just do that and move on with your life than making a big scene about standing up for your ideals - because A) You're not going to change shit in that situation anyway and B) It's just going to make it harder for you.

> Something a schoolyard bully would say to the kid who's too small to defend themself but refuses to comply.

Yeah, probably right. But, also, yeah, easier sometimes to just appease the bully and move on with life.

[troad]

"Obnoxious tightwad" is in the eyes of the beholder. Asserting your Fourth and Fifth Amendment rights won't make you popular with the police, and yet you're far safer asserting those rights than getting overly talkative and compliant with the police. [0]

The tricky thing about a principled stand in favour of civil liberties is that you spend a lot of your time defending scoundrels, because it's their civil liberties that are most in danger from the mob and government. And once their rights go, yours are sure to follow.

[0] If you disagree, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE