House committee approves bill requiring new cars to have AM radio

[nis0s]

I am unconvinced that requiring AM radio in new cars is just “fan service” or outdated.

Emergency scenarios often require a PSA (public service announcement), and it’s easy enough to envision a scenario where communications degrade in succession, such that you can get a PSA on how to use AM transmissions in case other communications go down. So if other networks are degraded, then at least people have AM to fall back on.

This house bill may sound like a bad idea to anyone who doesn’t work in disaster preparedness, or doesn’t have a paranoid security mindset, but it totally makes sense for someone who red teams emergency comms.

[cogman10]

This doesn't convince me.

For starters, FM broadcasting is hardly more complex than AM broadcasting and any vehicle built in the last 50 years with an AM radio also has an FM radio.

I can't imagine a scenario where FM broadcasting is somehow unavailable, but AM is. But further, if AM is the last line of communication, we are in a VERY bad situation indeed, like apocalyptic. One in which I doubt any survivors are listening to the radio in their cars.

But even further, in an emergency, it's highly likely that car drivers aren't even listening to the radio. Like, unless it's something that everyone is made aware of with communications other than through AM radio. But if those lines are open, then why wouldn't communication be broadcast through those lines?

You may as well argue that we should make sure all homes have land lines or telegraph lines. After all, that's also a line of communication that could be used in an emergency.

[b112]

Especially since the tech is already there, and everywhere. It's madness to lose a capability so easily kept.

[zamadatix]

I've never found the idea of an emergency radio itself as unconvincing but I've remained relatively unconvinced requiring them to be built into cars was a particularly reliable, useful, or efficient way to go about ensuring access to such radios in disaster scenarios. It seems a lot more like a "well that's the only place I know of that still has an AM radio today so it should stay that way!" regulation than a "AM radio access" regulation.

[EasyMark]

It’s also cheap as hell to keep in cars. Sometimes you just have to push back against the bean counters.

[superkuh]

As a happy side effect they will actually have to address the incredible amount of low frequency near-field electromagnetic interference that electrical cars typically generate. The reason manufacturers stopped putting AM radio in cars is that the cars themselves are so electrically noisy the entire AM band is washed out with static.

[lupusreal]

I understand car manufacturers want to ditch AM radios to reduce their part count, or so they can cheap out and use noisier electronics in the rest of the car, or whatever.

What I find a bit odder is the vehemence with which some online commenters also want them gone. I don't use either radio in my car, but their presence doesn't get me hot under my collar either. People say AM radio is useless and obsolete, but the same could probably be said for FM too, since everybody pairs their phones for music anyway. Why does AM have a target painted on it when nobody online seems to have an axe to grind with the equally useless FM radio? Is it just because there are a lot of conservative talk shows on AM? Is that the angle here? The bill to keep AM radios evidently has bipartisan support in Congress, and yet for some reason these discussions usually have people complaining about Republicans.

[rurp]

Conservative talk shows could be part of it. I think electric vehicle cheerleading is another factor, especially since Tesla is one of the more visible manufacturers to not support AM. There are always folks willing to defend to the death anything that company does. There can also be a fair amount of indifference towards non-techies on HN and other tech communities, even if we're talking about something regularly used by millions of people.

[RF_Enthusiast]

If the real motivation for people wanting AM radio gone is due to conservative talk, people are likely overestimating the ratings these stations bring in. It’s the exception, rather than the rule, for one of these stations to perform well. Most conservative talk stations barely attract local advertising, except in a few limited categories like “guns.” I know of more conservative talk stations that are struggling to stay afloat than those that are not.

[tcmart14]

Due to safety concerns and the ability to get the message out, every home, building, bridge, mountain top, or structure must maintain a a pile of logs on top and a flame at the ready in the event of a national emergency so that way word or warning may be spread like beacons of Gondor.

[wwweston]

Not sure I see a problem with that, really. Emergency response contributions are about as compelling a reason for social obligations as is possible, not everyone will benefit from them but anyone could need them. And since property exists and is maintained as a social construction, it makes sense it might come with some social obligations. About the only thing to quibble with is whether burning logs specifically fit a good set of requirements for relay comms, which might be the point of your comment beyond amusement, and I suppose it accomplishes both, though it starts to wear thin at the point where if you make a list of desirable features, AM radio starts to look pretty good.

[TeMPOraL]

Well, it's good to have that alternative when your modern emergency broadcast app refuses to work because your year-old phone is no longer supported by the vendor, and fails the remote device attestation check needed by the ad platform that's used to monetize the app. Not that having a newer phone would do you any good, as the app login servers on the other side of the planet are no longer reachable.

Seriously though, AM radio is a very good compromise: it has the best set of features for emergency use, and none of the commercial lock-in and ad cancer bullshit that's consuming modern technology.

[dotnet00]

This was passed 45-2, from a committee with 29 Republicans and 23 Democrats, so it's interesting to see a bunch of comments here acting like this is just a Republican thing.

[EasyMark]

I think it’s definitely more of a republican “issue” because their constituency of older Americans which lean pretty heavily republican are in up in arms over it. Democrats are more ho-hum about it, but probably see it as a net positive rather than a “you shall not pass!”moment

[ChrisArchitect]

S.1669 – AM Radio for Every Vehicle Act of 2023

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41585397

[tonetegeatinst]

I predict a Jeff Geerling video about this.

He has one where he talks about the lack of radio in cars and mentions the possibility of a bill but i can't remember if he said anything specific.

[zoklet-enjoyer]

I used to have a car with a broken AM radio and it was really annoying and sometimes stressful because all the traffic alerts were broadcast on an AM station

[snakeyjake]

The public safety argument is bullshit.

If lawmakers ACTUALLY cared about public safety, they would fund the distribution of hand-cranked AM radios that could be stored in emergency kits.

This is just legislation purchased, incredibly cheaply, by iHeartMedia, Audacy, and the like cloaked in the delusion that people who failed to evacuate before a hurricane when all other infrastructure was operational will go out to their submerged or destroyed car to listen to the radio.

[dullcrisp]

I’m not buying your argument. I doubt you can devise and pass legislation that’ll cause more people to have emergency kits with hand cranked AM radios than cars, even if you distributed them for free, and there are scenarios that require emergency communication that don’t involve all cars being destroyed.

That said I’m not saying that the public safety argument is genuine, but you can’t just propose something else you prefer to discredit it.

[superkuh]

Yes. It should be the FCC enforcing their regulatory duties against specific car models not the house legislating in general. The amount of interference on the low frequency bands that some electrical cars produce prevents reception of AM. And that was already very illegal. You can't do that but car manufacturers were/are too big to care. The public safety aspect of it is entirely secondary.

[rychco]

If they actually cared about public safety, they would pursue legislation to require analog controls & eliminate touchscreens in vehicles.

[FireBeyond]

> Conservatives are also worried about losing a lucrative platform for right-wing news and media.

You are guaranteed the right to free speech. You are not guaranteed that other people are obligated to carry that speech for you, at a cost to them.

Cry me a fucking river. (The same would equally apply to left-wing media, for perfect clarity).

[Vecr]

Congress is really just addressing a market failure, if you want to put it like that. It's not just that the car does not come with an AM radio, the car's electronics are jamming AM reception inside the car, even if you try to buy your own.

It's "okay" for the government to do this because they're already making entry into the mass-produced car market very hard.

[JB_Dev]

In an actual emergency, cell towers may not function. AM has significantly further range too and is pretty easy to standup as a backup for an area.

It’s also incredibly common for road conditions to still be shared over AM - you see this a lot while driving with all the “advisory - tune to …. AM” signs everywhere.

[gaudat]

A part of me really wants to push this and see how far it would go. Why stop at AM? Add in shortwave radio and let us listen to stations on the other side of the earth.

[RF_Enthusiast]

Shortwave doesn’t work well as a mobile, moving medium. It is weak-signal reception (by design) and is likely to be compromised every time your car turns in a different direction.

[tcmart14]

Why not we just have a system like the beacons of Gondor?