[_gabe_]

That’s completely besides the point. I agree that working on an engine can be very fulfilling and round you out as a developer. But it’s not easy and I wouldn’t recommend that somebody who just wants to make a game go down that path. I’m pretty sure some of my favorite games like Hollow Knight would have never been made if they decided to just build the engine as well.

[adamrezich]

What is it specifically about Hollow Knight that makes you think it never would've been made without using someone else's engine? I didn't get too far into it myself but in terms of gameplay systems it seemed like a very standard 2D metroidvania platformer, except with a fantastic visual style.

Compare and contrast Salt & Sanctuary, which was uses FNA (which is a library, not an engine).

[_gabe_]

The fact that it’s a game that was developed by people that were self-proclaimed “non-coders”[0] using a plug n’ play game engine Stencyl (a no code engine) and then later switching to Unity. It seems to me the plug n’ play nature enabled them to gain traction with a prototype that led to the full fledged game.

This one quote on page 2 from the developers really hammers home this point:

> Those limitations aside, working in Stencyl has been fantastic. Ideas come together really easily and the tools are all intuitive. We definitely couldn't have come so far in such a short amount of time without it.

[0]: https://community.stencyl.com/index.php?topic=36539.0

[jsnell]

Because the people writing the game did not have infinite time and budget, and spent their resources on making the game rather than the engine. That allowed them to a) finish the game at all, b) make a game of bigger scope and higher quality. Maybe (just maybe!) they could have finished a game when rolling their own. But it would not have been the Hollow Knight we know.

It's great that you're enthusiastic about writing your own engine. I'm kind of in the same boat: I'm opinionated on software engineering and architecture, and my opinions don't line up with any of the existing engines. So I roll my own. But it's not actually an efficient use of my time, and as a result I don't write as many games as I'd prefer to, and the projects often end up down-scoped from the original vision just to finish them. It's a suboptimal way to work, but it's the one I have to use since any time I try using an engine I give up in disgust and get nothing done.

What's not so great is that you're ignoring the very obvious upsides of using an engine, pretending it's only downsides, and pushing your personal preference on other people as the obviously correct way to do things. Your bafflement on why anyone would use an engine is showing a distinct lack of empathy. Not everyone thinks like you, or has your priorities. You want to write a toolset and demonstrate your mastery of that toolset; some others just want to make a game. And you have no business telling them that their goal is invalid and they should instead copy your priorities.

[johnnyanmac]

>That’s completely besides the point.

I think it's a worthwhile thing to consider instead of dismmiss.

>But it’s not easy and I wouldn’t recommend that somebody who just wants to make a game go down that path.

Nothing is easy in game development. You can focus on whatever sector you choose, but don't expect an easy ride. That's why my honest first step to "how do I become a game programmer" is to fire up a terminal and write a Hello World in C or C#. I always approached concepts bottom-up, personally.

>I’m pretty sure some of my favorite games like Hollow Knight would have never been made if they decided to just build the engine as well.

Well, it sure is helping with Silksong, that's for sure.

But as a fun fact: Hungry Knight was made in Flash. I'm sure the devs would have found a way if they were determined enough if they didn't choose Unity. It could have been done in Game Maker or Construct or even good ol' Monogame (I believe Celeste used that).

[_gabe_]

I didn’t dismiss the point. My next sentence that you left out of that quote addresses it ;)

I also learn concepts bottom up, but thank God everyone isn’t like me. I’m just glad prebuilt tools like the game engines we have today exist so we can have artists creating awesome games.

Heck, even half life likely wouldn’t exist if Carmack hadn’t written the Quake engine and shared it with the Valve developers![0] Think of all the amazing games that have since been released by Valve that might never have been unless they had the kickstart that they got.

[0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/GoldSrc#:~:text=GoldSrc%20(p....