[MKoberger]

This was such a fascinating read—it really resonated with me. A few years ago, my girlfriend and I started a small coffee shop in Hanoi as a fun side project, and I was struck by the parallels between Vietnam's coffee history and the issues you outline here about Kenya.

Vietnam, like Kenya, emerged from a coffee industry shaped by colonial-era inequities. Yet through reforms, robust state support for smallholder farmers, and a focus on infrastructure, Vietnam has positioned itself as a global coffee powerhouse. While the initial focus on robusta was quantity-driven, there’s now a shift toward quality, which is helping Vietnamese coffee expand into new markets.

Kenya’s situation feels similar yet distinct. It has an unparalleled coffee heritage, and with thoughtful reforms—empowering smallholders, encouraging direct trade, and finding the right balance between quality and disease-resistant hybrids—it could reclaim its standing on the global stage.

The article beautifully captures the systemic challenges and the hope for transformation. I really believe Kenya’s coffee can rise again, stronger and fairer, just as Vietnam is starting to do. It’s inspiring to see how coffee connects people and places across the world in such unique ways!

[charlysl]

It was the DDR who developed the modern Vietnamese coffee industry, collapsing before it could benefit.

Beginning in 1975, largely parallel with the coffee crisis in East Germany, the production of Robusta coffee began in Vietnam. Robusta plants grow faster, contain more caffeine, suit the climate of the Vietnamese Central Highlands, and lend themselves better to mechanized harvesting.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_German_coffee_crisis

[alephnerd]

It was a horrible time in Gia Lai at the time.

My in-laws were part of the generation of displaced Vietnamese who were resettled in the Central Highlands for coffee cultivation back in the 70s-90s, but this mass migration of ethnic Vietnamese pissed off the indigenous Jarai and other Hmong+Khmer ethnic groups, which led to a sustained insurgency and a lot of horrid human rights abuses.

The current GenSec of Vietnam (To Lam) is notable for his career as the butcher of Gia Lai during his tenure there as part of the MPS.

[paulette449]

> A few years ago, my girlfriend and I started a small coffee shop in Hanoi as a fun side project

Did it end up being the fun side project you expected?

[dehrmann]

The standard insight is there's a difference between liking coffee, liking hanging out in a coffee shop, and running a coffee shop. Running a coffee shop is 98% HR, accounting, and customer service, and 2% coffee.

[dyauspitr]

Having done something similar in India I can say it definitely was fun. What makes it fun is there are next to no regulations so you can plop down in a place one day and just sell food.

[MKoberger]

Haha, so…

My girlfriend manages several Airbnbs around Hanoi, and many of these buildings have ground floors designed for small businesses—something that’s very common in Vietnam. In 2019, we decided to turn the ground floors of her rental locations into coffee shops and finished setting them up just in time for December that year!

Of course, as luck would have it, COVID-19 wasn’t exactly great for either Airbnb rentals or coffee shops. Since then, we’ve both shifted focus to other projects, but we’re definitely planning to give it another shot in the future when the timing feels right!

[retinaros]

All the vietnamese coffee that I tried in europe (even in hype shops) tasted like american “french” roast aka burnt bad coffee. Could you recommend ways to try nice coffees from vietnam?

[a012]

> All the vietnamese coffee ... “french” roast aka burnt bad coffee

You're describing traditional Vietnamese coffee for ca phe sua or ca phe den, it's close to burnt coffee because the sourced coffee beans are shit so they have to roast close to charcoal that's why we have to add a lot of sugar or condensed milk.

If you want to have coffees that taste close to specialty coffee then there are some local shops that colab or have their own farms that grow quality beans, but Idk if there's exporting roasted coffees.

I've seen a Vietnamese coffee brand from Amazon with fancy branding but my bet is still shitty coffee. Then the recommended way would be traveling to Vietnam, maybe?

[bryananderson]

“Go to Vietnam” is maybe not the most practical suggestion for grabbing a cup of coffee, but that’s where I found the best Vietnamese coffee.

As others have said, Vietnamese coffee was traditionally cheaper robusta beans, tended to be lower-quality, and was dark-roasted as a result. More recently, as Vietnam has gotten wealthier, there has been a craft coffee scene developing. I had great coffee in growing regions like Da Lat and Khe Sanh, and in specialty coffee shops in Hanoi like Dream Beans.

[csomar]

Sounds like you got a real Vietnamese coffee. All kidding aside, my experience drinking coffee here (Vietnam) is that most of the coffee shops have bad coffee. I am not sure if it's the beans, the machines or the culture. There is, maybe, 1 in 7 coffeeshop that will do the coffee kinda okay. I don't think the locals care too much (basing on google reviews).

Either way, I'll take this over any other SEA or Asian country where it's a hassle to find coffee outside metro hotspots. Cafes and Coffee here is available everywhere and usually within a 30 seconds walk.

[loloquwowndueo]

Find another roaster that doesn’t burn it?

Most coffee is shipped in raw bean form and roasted at the destination. So bad roasts are not the fault of Vietnamese coffee per se.

[charlysl]

The moka is pretty good though (and much more expensive)