"The primary value proposition of Mozi (today) is simple: It lets you know when you’re going to be in the same place (city or event) as someone you know."
This is fairly shortsighted. How many people actually travel from city to city. I bet the vast majority of people have a 3km bubble around their house and work and that's as far as they travel 90% of the time. Additionally, it tracks when you are going to an event. At that point, you are already out of the house around other people.
I like the idea of an app that is "private. Non-performative. No public profiles. No public status competitions. No follower counts. No strangers." but I think it doesn't need to hinge on always going out and traveling. It should simply prompt you to check in with friends (not in the mental health status way) but simply "Hey, you haven't chatted with Sarah recently, say Hi" or "Steve's birthday is coming up, wish him a Happy Birthday". Simply just connecting with friends will perhaps result in "IRL" connections, but basing the whole app on connecting after those plans are made seems a bit "cart before the horse".
Makes me think back to Foursquare - it didn't tell anyone anything in advance but it did tell you who else was at your exact location.
Depending on your permissions and if you would let it know about Facebook events, calendar events, etc. then you might get notifications or see when someone is going to be going to the same restaurant, etc. I think events is the key, while you're focused a bit on city. They do specify event so that's something, perhaps.
To me, this looks like a fantastic idea, and something that could be really useful in a niche, but I think it's going to fly over the head of a lot of folk because it's fairly obviously targeted at highly mobile, maybe HNWI's who do a lot of travel - it's not going to be useful for "most" people.
Similar vibes to lawmakers that have public hearings with airline execs and talk about air travel issues as if it's an issue American voters frequently think about.
Most Americans travel 0-2 times per year. About half don't fly at all.
In the live-aboard sailboat cruising niche we have Sea People https://seapeopleapp.com which has a similar basic value prop but many features specifically for that lifestyle.
This kind of reminds me of the original version of the app called Color, where you'd see social posts organized by geo coordinates. Imagine being in a coffee shop and seeing a feed of every post and photo posted from within the coffee shop. The benefit being you could make friends in your area.
Does anyone else remember this app? It came out around the same era as Path.
I remember the handwritten note taped to the door of Color's office in Palo Alto, across the street from the hamburger joint. It had something to do with the founder's principles or something.
At that point I realized it wasn't a serious company.
The last time I walked by the building it was "The Institute for the Future."
Must have been from a more innocent time.. It sounds super cool until you think about the privacy nightmare it could be? I'm thinking about how people managed to triangulate users locations from grindr, or the cesspit of bullying that YikYak was.
I wish you the best with your social app, but I'd like to offer a cautionary tail.
Barq, a furry fandom-focused app, has some of the same features. It's primarily for local meetups or seeing when your friends are in town for a convention. Unfortunately, Barq's location data has been used to dox and harass people before (even though they implemented a system that returned "fuzzy" GPS results).
If the primary value of the app is "know when person A is at location X", think through all of the ways this information could be used to hurt people. Even contrived and silly ways. And then try to safeguard it as much as possible.
I recently shared a blog post about how BlueSky could implement "limited audiences" without changing their current infrastructure. (Spoiler: It involves state-of-the-art cryptography.) It may be worth reading.
>For example, I just got back from Miami. Before going, I put my plan (just the city and what days) into Mozi. This information was shared just with my contacts (minus any I wouldn’t want it to be). So, even before going, I was able to see both the people I know who live there and other friends who were visiting at the same time, so we could meet up and make plans.
>Mozi also helps you decide where to go. “Events” on Mozi (currently a beta feature) lets you see who you know may be going—or considering going—to a conference or event before you go. (If you happen to be going to SXSW, join the Mozi event. I’ll be there too.)
Seems like more of a "networking" app as opposed to friends as it mentioned ...
An app that tracks your location (and future location), founded by a venture capitalist?
I'll pass thanks.
(I'd be interested to see it there is a way to build this in an e2e privacy-preserving way, perhaps built on tech used in Signal and the fediverse, where only you and your contacts ever see unencrypted data about your location and events?)
Huh. At the risk of being crude, this is already a feature of queer hookup apps, including recording your plans and seeing who else in your network will be attending an event or visiting your area.
It's pretty much the same problem set, I think? You have a relatively small social circle (as a percentage of the whole population) and your plans probably won't appeal to those outside of that group.
Unless they engineer it so they do not have any data to sell, sooner or later someone's gonna sell that data.
They've weasel-worded their privacy policy to allow this, the buyer of the data just needs to pretend to be a potential investor or buyer:
"We may disclose personal information in the context of actual or prospective business transactions (e.g., investments in Mozi, financing of Mozi, public stock offerings, or the sale, transfer or merger of all or part of our business, assets or shares), for example, we may need to share certain personal information with prospective counterparties and their advisers."
Look, you and Jacky are in town, both of you are close to Margo's Restaurant, you should meet up there. Here is a 5% discount.
or
Both Jacky and Margo are going on this weekend to Ulaanbaatar for a fancy snack, flying Fred Flintstone airlines. They have great rates this weekend and you are just sitting on your couch watching reruns. Why not get a flight on Fred Flintstone airlines (here is the link), you might even sit next to one of them!
the monetization hopes are mentioned in the FAQ on the website: https://www.mozi.app/faqs
(tldr: freemium)
ev also does mention in the NYTimes article, for those that have NYT subs
"They shared stories about reconnecting with old friends via the app — moments that seemed valuable enough that customers might pay for it, he said. Mozi is free, but plans to charge for premium features it develops."
Exactly my question too. It seems a little disingenuous not to talk about it. Is it going to try to sell me travel and accom? Venues to meet up with people?
I have no interest unless I see a sustainable, unshitified business model.
There are so many challenges with building a social app, especially around contacts... I'm not sure how they'll mitigate all this stuff, but fun to think about it and hope they do succeed in doing so anyway.
A few considerations off the top of my head:
- relationships are extremely fragile and can exist in all sorts of awkward middle states, outside of just "friend enough to notify when I'm in town" vs not. the risk of creating awkward meatspace side effects is extremely high with this kind of thing, with very large downside risk that human beings are very attuned to. for example: exes, former bosses or colleagues gone sideways, people you said something weird to once at a party, stalkers, etc. are all people you might have in your contacts
- relatedly, contacts growing out of sync organically over time is actually a feature, not a bug. it's easy to let contacts die when they die by themselves without having to prune them -- and nobody's delicate feelings get hurt by letting this happen
- existing on a mobile phone while not being an attention-sucking nightmare cesspool -- while also not /creating/ another attention-sucking cesspool, despite having all the social data necessary to do so -- seems like an impossible challenge. how do you get people to remember your little app in a sea of Trending Flamebait notifications? (others have noted this related to funding model, but that part feels surmountable, especially as a passion project from a billionaire)
I would love for this to be a thing, but it’s always going to be super niche. There have been other similar tools, with limited success: Nomad List, Doppler, TripIt’s now-gone social features, Apple’s Find My. So far, the best way has just been to share travel plans in friend chat groups.
I just connected Mozi to my nearly 1000 contacts and it found zero matches, meaning I’m the first one in my network to use it. I suspect to be solo for a very long time.
Sending Christmas cards is old-fashioned, but it’s a pretty good indicator of who you actually know well enough to have their mailing address. (Or well enough to ask for it without it being weird.)
No special app needed, since it can be done with a spreadsheet.
Weirdly, AIM was a great social media application. Anyone on AIM was on because they wanted to talk. I actually miss AIM a good amount, now you can reach anyone but you're always interrupting their life.
I have thought about this problem a lot in the past and I feel the older you get the harder it becomes to make new friends. If you have moved to a new place then you loose all those connections slowly and it's a challenge to make new friends. At least that's what happened to me. And on top of that your financial status that defines who accepts you as a friend. Also how much you can afford and are willing to invest to make and keep a friend. Something more than can fit in an app and a problem that a business can solve for you. But I am glad someone is trying to do something about it.
> I feel the older you get the harder it becomes to make new friends.
While that's true, at least for me you also end up with some deep deep friendships that easily survive years or even decades apart, which are closer and more meaningful than most of the friendships with people you see daily/weekly.
Not bad, but, please, don't display kids DOBs - just the age. Also, marriage should have an anniversary date to be social per the bold claim. Parents and other relatives should also be added, and each related person should have an invite link that links their name to the future profile. No usernames? That's refreshing, but I really hate when companies at usernames late and I can't grab my usual one on time, because I missed their emails, etc.
Pretty interesting idea - we really need more ways to nudge us to connect in real life. I actually created a fun little platform for people to try niche social networks together in a 30-day "cohort" and this seems like a great example of a social network that would be fun to discuss! Anyone can join at https://soshials.com/platforms/mozi
Name has no connection to the important Chinese philosopher Mozi[1] which was my first association. As for the value proposition of the app I personally don't see it. If I want to speak or catch up with friends - I message them and/or call them. I don't see how yet another app makes this easier.
It feels like the last social dating taboo is open time bidding. something like: "here's my instagram. I've got an extra seat at performance X, a reservation at restaurant Y, or lift tickets for resort Z. intro yourself if you want to be my guest, or bid cash for dutch"
it's like everyone's dancing around that as if they're above it somehow.
Definitely thought of that kind of thing. There are about 20 restaurants in Collegetown, it would be fun to try them all, even more fun if I could share the experience with other people who feel the same.
This is very similar to Dopplr.com - started in 2007ish and had a bunch of hype but not many people formed a habit of using it. It was acquihired by Nokia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dopplr
I’ve heard from some recent YC videos that people have been making these friend finder apps for something like 20 years. Is this true? And if it is, what are some previous apps that are similar to this one?
[+] [-] giarc|1 year ago|reply
This is fairly shortsighted. How many people actually travel from city to city. I bet the vast majority of people have a 3km bubble around their house and work and that's as far as they travel 90% of the time. Additionally, it tracks when you are going to an event. At that point, you are already out of the house around other people.
I like the idea of an app that is "private. Non-performative. No public profiles. No public status competitions. No follower counts. No strangers." but I think it doesn't need to hinge on always going out and traveling. It should simply prompt you to check in with friends (not in the mental health status way) but simply "Hey, you haven't chatted with Sarah recently, say Hi" or "Steve's birthday is coming up, wish him a Happy Birthday". Simply just connecting with friends will perhaps result in "IRL" connections, but basing the whole app on connecting after those plans are made seems a bit "cart before the horse".
[+] [-] neogodless|1 year ago|reply
Depending on your permissions and if you would let it know about Facebook events, calendar events, etc. then you might get notifications or see when someone is going to be going to the same restaurant, etc. I think events is the key, while you're focused a bit on city. They do specify event so that's something, perhaps.
[+] [-] naming_the_user|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] strict9|1 year ago|reply
Most Americans travel 0-2 times per year. About half don't fly at all.
[+] [-] nicwolff|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] Yhippa|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] bigiain|1 year ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] evbogue|1 year ago|reply
Does anyone else remember this app? It came out around the same era as Path.
[+] [-] hanspeter|1 year ago|reply
I just googled Path because I thought that was the one. But it was indeed Color I was thinking of. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_Labs
I recall they (claimed they) had some crazy tech that used the microphone to detect if you were in the same room as other users.
[+] [-] AlexandrB|1 year ago|reply
[1] Ah, it was a mere $350,000: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_Labs#Launch
[+] [-] gwbas1c|1 year ago|reply
At that point I realized it wasn't a serious company.
The last time I walked by the building it was "The Institute for the Future."
[+] [-] morkalork|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] quest88|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] ChrisArchitect|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] anttiai|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] tonystubblebine|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] some_furry|1 year ago|reply
Barq, a furry fandom-focused app, has some of the same features. It's primarily for local meetups or seeing when your friends are in town for a convention. Unfortunately, Barq's location data has been used to dox and harass people before (even though they implemented a system that returned "fuzzy" GPS results).
If the primary value of the app is "know when person A is at location X", think through all of the ways this information could be used to hurt people. Even contrived and silly ways. And then try to safeguard it as much as possible.
I recently shared a blog post about how BlueSky could implement "limited audiences" without changing their current infrastructure. (Spoiler: It involves state-of-the-art cryptography.) It may be worth reading.
https://soatok.blog/2024/11/29/imagining-private-airspaces-f...
[+] [-] duxup|1 year ago|reply
>Mozi also helps you decide where to go. “Events” on Mozi (currently a beta feature) lets you see who you know may be going—or considering going—to a conference or event before you go. (If you happen to be going to SXSW, join the Mozi event. I’ll be there too.)
Seems like more of a "networking" app as opposed to friends as it mentioned ...
Still, I don't dislike the general idea.
[+] [-] bigiain|1 year ago|reply
An app that tracks your location (and future location), founded by a venture capitalist?
I'll pass thanks.
(I'd be interested to see it there is a way to build this in an e2e privacy-preserving way, perhaps built on tech used in Signal and the fediverse, where only you and your contacts ever see unencrypted data about your location and events?)
[+] [-] mintplant|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] griomnib|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] naming_the_user|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] trustinmenowpls|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] bigiain|1 year ago|reply
Unless they engineer it so they do not have any data to sell, sooner or later someone's gonna sell that data.
They've weasel-worded their privacy policy to allow this, the buyer of the data just needs to pretend to be a potential investor or buyer:
"We may disclose personal information in the context of actual or prospective business transactions (e.g., investments in Mozi, financing of Mozi, public stock offerings, or the sale, transfer or merger of all or part of our business, assets or shares), for example, we may need to share certain personal information with prospective counterparties and their advisers."
[+] [-] WaitWaitWha|1 year ago|reply
for example peer-pressure recommendations.
Look, you and Jacky are in town, both of you are close to Margo's Restaurant, you should meet up there. Here is a 5% discount.
or
Both Jacky and Margo are going on this weekend to Ulaanbaatar for a fancy snack, flying Fred Flintstone airlines. They have great rates this weekend and you are just sitting on your couch watching reruns. Why not get a flight on Fred Flintstone airlines (here is the link), you might even sit next to one of them!
[+] [-] julo15|1 year ago|reply
ev also does mention in the NYTimes article, for those that have NYT subs
"They shared stories about reconnecting with old friends via the app — moments that seemed valuable enough that customers might pay for it, he said. Mozi is free, but plans to charge for premium features it develops."
(disclosure: i work on the mozi app)
[+] [-] __d|1 year ago|reply
I have no interest unless I see a sustainable, unshitified business model.
[+] [-] taylorhughes|1 year ago|reply
A few considerations off the top of my head:
- relationships are extremely fragile and can exist in all sorts of awkward middle states, outside of just "friend enough to notify when I'm in town" vs not. the risk of creating awkward meatspace side effects is extremely high with this kind of thing, with very large downside risk that human beings are very attuned to. for example: exes, former bosses or colleagues gone sideways, people you said something weird to once at a party, stalkers, etc. are all people you might have in your contacts
- relatedly, contacts growing out of sync organically over time is actually a feature, not a bug. it's easy to let contacts die when they die by themselves without having to prune them -- and nobody's delicate feelings get hurt by letting this happen
- existing on a mobile phone while not being an attention-sucking nightmare cesspool -- while also not /creating/ another attention-sucking cesspool, despite having all the social data necessary to do so -- seems like an impossible challenge. how do you get people to remember your little app in a sea of Trending Flamebait notifications? (others have noted this related to funding model, but that part feels surmountable, especially as a passion project from a billionaire)
[+] [-] quinncom|1 year ago|reply
I just connected Mozi to my nearly 1000 contacts and it found zero matches, meaning I’m the first one in my network to use it. I suspect to be solo for a very long time.
[+] [-] skybrian|1 year ago|reply
No special app needed, since it can be done with a spreadsheet.
[+] [-] neogodless|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] tarboreus|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] srameshc|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] bigiain|1 year ago|reply
While that's true, at least for me you also end up with some deep deep friendships that easily survive years or even decades apart, which are closer and more meaningful than most of the friendships with people you see daily/weekly.
[+] [-] nikolay|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] nswizzle31|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] _hao|1 year ago|reply
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozi
[+] [-] losteric|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|1 year ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] motohagiography|1 year ago|reply
It feels like the last social dating taboo is open time bidding. something like: "here's my instagram. I've got an extra seat at performance X, a reservation at restaurant Y, or lift tickets for resort Z. intro yourself if you want to be my guest, or bid cash for dutch"
it's like everyone's dancing around that as if they're above it somehow.
[+] [-] PaulHoule|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] jamesshamenski|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] joshdavham|1 year ago|reply
[+] [-] yodon|1 year ago|reply