I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are.
Nothing is less fun than cross-shopping products and there are a bunch of arbitrary brand differences. "Precisions are their portable workstations. Latitudes are their ultrabooks. Duh! XPS is their premium consumer laptop!".
Marketing departments tend to get addicted to the smell of their own farts. But I don't think consumers care about particular sub-brand names. We already saw this a decade ago in the automotive space where manufacturers ditched their unnecessary marquees (Pontiac, Mercury, Oldsmobile, Saturn). And I think we will see this trend continue into more industries (like hotel chains).
Product names make no sense. Some web sites make a "product selection tool" where you answer a bunch of questions and it tries to direct you to models that will suit your needs.
I was recently buying a Seasonic power supply. What is the difference between Prime, Vertex, Focus, or Core series? Then there is Prime TX, Prime PX, Prime GX. I have no idea what all this is. I ended up just picking something in the 800W range with the modular power outputs that I needed.
Marketing departments tend to get addicted to the
smell of their own farts.
That's not necessarily why they do it.
Pontiac, Mercury, Oldsmobile, Saturn
So part of the reason they do it is simply to flood the market. Imagine a world where GM has Saturn, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Geo, Chevy, GMC, etc. And Ford just has... Ford.
To a casual, who doesn't know or care that six of those brands are just GM nameplates, they just see seven options for a sedan. And if I'm GM, I certainly like the odds that they'll pick a GM even though I'm essentially just designing one or two sedans and then advertising them six different ways.
A simpler example (that somebody else mentioned down below) is toothpaste. There are like, ten different varieties of Colgate on the shelf. The point isn't that they expect me the consumer to know or care about the differences, or that they are so "addicted to the smell of their own farts" that they think there's a meaningful difference between brands of Colgate.
The point is that they want to consume shelf space, crowd other brands out, and send the message that they are the default, safe choice for toothpaste. We can say that's dumb, but I suspect the sales figures would tell us they're having some success with that.
> I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are.
Sure, but I find this branding even more confusing.
"Dude, you're getting a Dell!"
"Oh, neat! Is it a PC or laptop?"
"It's a Dell Pro... laptop."
"..."
At least with XPS, Latitude, etc., consumers were able to easily distinguish between models, after getting familiar with the product line. Naming all products "<company name> [Pro,Pro Max]" will always be clear as mud. Not to mention that "Pro Max Premium Plus Ultra" is dumb, in that Apple way. Apple is notorious for naming all their products the same, so consumers have to use launch years to distinguish them.
Apple has its share of naming problems but not attempting to artificially split their laptop product line between consumer and "enterprise" is something they should get credit for.
I kind of like the way Apple does it - when the M1 came out you could get the air or the pro and that was it. And the difference was simple - basically the pro was chunkier with a fan and a bit faster. With Dell I'd have no idea which one to get and what was good.
I feel like the headline is burying the lede here: every Dell sub-brand is going away expecting for the new “Pro” and “Pro Max”. Reminds me a lot of how Apple in the late 90s got rid of their Performa/Centris/Quadra/etc. for more obvious, matter-of-fact names.
I'm not sure if it's just me or a common feeling, but XPS laptops from the last few years (at least 2020 onward) felt really poor quality for "professional" computers. Especially regarding their main competitors (mbp & thinkpads). All the XPS we had at work had issues and particularly bad battery life even before the one year mark.. For those who didn't have their battery swollen.
I wouldn't have thought that such a recognizable brand as the XPS line would fade for "AI PC" BS but heh
XPS was never their professional product line. Latitudes were their workplace fleet devices that mostly went head to head with ThinkPads.
This is probably good evidence that they needed to simplify their branding. Having their halo consumer product compete for market mindshare against their professional products is counterproductive. Especially when everyone wants to cross shop against MacBooks.
In contrast, ThinkPad's X1 shares almost nothing with the rest of the Thinkpad's professional line, but it sits there adding prestige to the brand.
I had a 2021 model. It was pretty poor in all aspects. Slow, laggy on the desktop just clicking around. Loud when doing anything resembling work. Very poor audio. Bad keyboard. 4 hour battery.
I switched to a new M1 MacBook Air and it was like going from a Cessna 150 to an F-15. Everything on the M1 MBA was decades ahead of the XPS.
Everyone and their brother now sells a much better product than XPS, and often for nearly half the cash. I picked up an Asus Vivo last year. Very nice product, half the cost of the XPS they had on offer, but with the same specs and screen.
It feels like it was engineered as a unit, much like the MBA. The XPS in comparison is a parts bin special.
>Especially regarding their main competitors (mbp & thinkpads)
I dont think XPS is a business / professional line? But I think I have heard similar complains from Thinkpad user as well. The only good PC hardware surprisingly came from Microsoft their Surface line. But most business dont use it.
XPS always felt like an unloved brand. I’ve owned some and they never felt like they fit into either the powerhouse segment or the everyday user segment. And the strange revisions to keyboards and things over time made it less and less attractive to power users. Dell has far too many models and it’s hard for anyone to understand what the reason is to buy any of them. It’s certainly not for the everyday user either - in every single way it is worse than the cheapest Apple laptop.
As for AI PC - unfortunately Microsoft has forced this on everyone. They used their influence and power to force Intel to agree to this branding and the conditions for it to be met (things like having a Microsoft specific “Copilot” button). And all the OEMs have to come along or face repercussions for these partnerships. It’s just another example of big tech having too much market share, capital, etc.
I always felt like a lot of these computer sub brand names were rather confusing. Inspiron? Presario? Precision? XPS? ProBook? EliteBook? zBook? Envy? What are the real cross comparisons here?
Personally, I'm OK with these computer manufacturers cleaning up their product line.
"They’re replacing all of these old brands with Dell, Dell Pro, and Dell Pro Max, and within each of these, there will be three tiers: Base, Plus, and Premium."
I am a Lenovo guy myself, however I like what they are trying to do. If they actually do a good separation, that would be great. If they only do 9 level of computers, that would be a good change.
Kinda ThinkPad T, X, P. But more clear. And again, I only use ThinkPads T, P, or Xs.
I had one with I think a 7th gen Intel processor, and while it ran Linux pretty well the coil whine was enough to drive me absolutely batty. I made it about a year before I traded it in.
I got an XPS 13 Developer Edition around 2019 I think.
I still have it. It was a good machine.
Most things worked correctly out of the box but occasionally WIFI didn't wake from sleep properly and the battery life was always a bit rubbish compared to any MacBook Pro.
I think that Dell have had too many models forever. Simplifying their line up is a good idea.
If it makes easier to describe which are the low end, and which are the high end, that's fine, I guess? I just hate when terms get shoved together like that..."pro max"? What's the next flagship going to be? "Pro Max Ultra"? Then the "Pro Max Ultra+"? Then the "Platinum Pro Max Ultra+ Plus"? Then the ELITE SERIES Platinum Pro-Maximus Ultronic+ Plus Performance"?
It's all just smushing a bunch of words for "really good" together and pretending like it means something different or unique. If something is maximum, it is the maximum - A maximum grade exceeds a "professional grade" the way an "enterprise subscription" is larger than "team subscription".
In an ideal scenario, it would simply be: "Basic, Advanced, and Maximum". I get the issue though. Sales want to be able to move products, and its an issue if people don't want to feel poor by buying the "basic" one, but can't afford the higher models. Fine! If the want to use more market-y terms, why not something like: "Quality, Premium, and Luxury"?
I would also presume that that would be specific to consumer grade. A business-grade line would be much easier. Keep the model names clear and obvious for Purchasing & Logistics people: "Basic, Performance, Executive". Basic is for grunt work who need internet access for a WebApp, but not much else. Performance is for finance, or whoever deals with a lot of wear and tear. Executive is thinner and fancier looking, but about as weak as basic model but can open Excel and PowerPoint.
I once heard a repair tech say that XPS stands for “eXpensive Piece of Sh*t” and now that always comes to mind, although it never totally made sense to me as I didn’t think they were particularly expensive. I have an XPS and I did replace the battery at one point, but other than that I think it performed fairly well for my simple needs. I think I paid $499 for it around 2018.
I've had a number of Dell's in the past and IMO their "consumer" and "professional" lines might as well be different brands that happen to share the "Dell" name.
Their consumer laptops are all garbage IMO, mainly cause I find they try to max out specs so it looks good on paper and skimp on really basic things like the hinges, batteries, etc.
Their professional laptops are much better, my parents just got rid of a Dell Latitude that I passed down to them after college, and when I bought it for college it was already 5-6 years old so all in all it had a service life of more than a decade. Specs might be down compared to the consumer line but everything else IMO is much better built (chassis, battery, hinges, etc)
The base model XPS laptop was ~$999 at the time (vs $1299 for a 2023 model). Which sadly doesn't feel all that expensive today even though I would absolutely still call a $1000 laptop expensive.
Haha, what an end to an era on the brand. Some 16 years ago, my parents bought me the only XPS laptop I'd own: an XPS M1330 [0]. I've still got in a closet here, but I used it for eight years or so. Six years after purchase, it looks like it was still a pretty good machine[1] and had near perfect Linux compatibility. The real wonder for me was that the bootloaders for the Power button on that laptop and the MediaDirect button were separate, so I actually had it set up so that if I hit the MediaDirect button it would go to Ubuntu and the Power button would send it to Windows!
Pretty neat trick. The only thing is that something about the way the video framebuffer was set up when you hit the MediaDirect button made the GRUB interface laggy. After that, the kernel resets everything and all is well!
This particular laptop was part of the infamous batch of bad G84 series of Nvidia graphics chips. The BGA soldering on the GPUs would crack under thermal stress, but you could reflow it with a heat gun or using the oven (crazy for a semi-plastic device!). In my case, it happened early enough that XPS support replaced my motherboard a few times. They actually met me wherever I was with the part to replace the board and the tech would do it for me at home. Overall, that was the finest customer support experience I ever had. I'm a fickle guy, though. It wasn't enough to keep me with the brand and I eventually ended up with a Macbook.
It's funny. After posting this I googled my name and XPS M1330 and found a post where I was trying to boot off the SD card. I was fascinated by this idea back then that I could just carry my OS on an SD card and then people couldn't see any of my stuff unless they had that specific SD card: https://www.dell.com/community/en/conversations/laptops-gene... . Sadly the XPS M1330 didn't work for that, but I think I did it with a USB stick (which is unfortunately more noticeable - back then they were bulky!).
The first computer I ever owned was the original XPS laptop, circa 2004. It weighed as much as a corgi, was as thick as a Chicago deep dish pizza and gave out first-degree burns if your shorts rode up too high. The top outer panel was a beautifully garish noise pattern of deep green and purple ribbons, and the screen was so heavy that the hinges shattered within a year and the screen was ever after held up by two duct-tape suspenders, which thankfully didn't impede the keyboard much since the thing was as wide as a city block.
So when I buy a Dell laptop now (won't happen), I need to ask for Dell Pro Premium package and make sure that the seller doesn't mistake it for Plus version or Base. Why would you go for "easier" names and go for 3 subcategories with the same name within 3 other categories. Just sell Dell/Dell Pro/Dell Pro Max (even the names are copied from Apple) with different specs, why give them subcategories
I got a refurb XPS from the Dell store on eBay. Its problems are numerous, but not fatal. I do appreciate that it has a 17" display. I'm not sure anyone(?) does large screens on laptops anymore.
To be replaced with "Dell," "Dell Pro", and "Dell Pro Max"... Those tiers seem oddly familiar. They also throw away what I thought, as a proud long-time Dell Precision owner, was decent branding of their different lines for various market segments. But maybe it's a good thing - most major brands seem to offer too many laptop choices.
Shopping for a laptop recently has left me, ironically, running for Mac. The experience on most windows laptop vendor sites is awful:
- Dell's sales page focuses on proprietary names like "ExpressCharge TM", "Stealth Mode", "ComfortView TM", "Cryo-Tech TM", etc, that mean nothing to me [0]. It also gave me a pop-up when I went to a specific laptop's page.
- HP has way too many categories on the landing page [1]. I mistook "Elitebook Ultra" for their top-of-the-line, but then discovered they're $3000 lightweight notebooks with Snapdragon chips and Qualcomm GPUs. The first and second laptops shown appear to have identical specs, but differ in price by $2000 [2]. Trying my luck elsewhere, going to "ProBook" gives me no less than 53 options to read and sort through [3].
- Lenovo is actually decent [4]! The product lines are named well and properly explained. The UI isn't as pretty as HP's, but it's a lot more functional.
- Asus overall [5] isn't great (more proprietary names like "SmartHinge" and aesthetic-focused product descriptions). However, the Asus ProArt site is done fairly well [6].
Almost every windows laptop feels like it's trying to sell me on everything that isn't specs. "SmartHinge". "Stealth Mode". "Youthful" aesthetics. Weird proprietary bloatware and extended warranties.
And, even on the sites that don't give me confusing marketing, I'm left to figure out whether I need Windows "Pro" or "Home", what the hell Copilot+ is (a $20/mo upsell [7] that I'm guessing the laptop will forever beg me to add, like OneDrive used to), and if I a guide to get rid of spyware, bloatware, ads, auto-installed candycrush, and other anti-consumer jabs once I actually buy the thing (like I did with Windows 10 when it first released). And then fight every month or two when it inexplicably can't find the license for Office I pay monthly, for and locks me out of all of my documents.
With a Macbook, contrarily, I know I can actually research the silicon, figure out the specs, and actually get what I ordered / expected. I also know I won't have to fight the OS nearly as much, even if Apple has its own upsell attempts, anti-consumer warranty/repair problems, etc. I never would've expected to feel that way. Especially not 10-15 years ago.
But maybe Dell's rebrand helps them move back in that direction a little.
If all you want is a thinkpad maybe. But then you click the thinkpad link and have to figure out whether you want a T, P, L, E, C or X thinkpad (they don't make Ws anymore, right?) Oh and some also have "s" suffix. And they differ from non-s quite a bit
My experience is similar to yours, and I went to a Macbook Pro during the M1 launch and am pretty happy with the decision, though I would prefer Linux. I take myself to be a tech enthusiast, but I did not have the patience to wade through hundreds of opaque product pages to find what it was they were really selling.
For a time Microsoft had a relatively clean Surface lineup, but a quick check reveals that it's significantly more difficult to shop than it was.
legitster|1 year ago
Nothing is less fun than cross-shopping products and there are a bunch of arbitrary brand differences. "Precisions are their portable workstations. Latitudes are their ultrabooks. Duh! XPS is their premium consumer laptop!".
Marketing departments tend to get addicted to the smell of their own farts. But I don't think consumers care about particular sub-brand names. We already saw this a decade ago in the automotive space where manufacturers ditched their unnecessary marquees (Pontiac, Mercury, Oldsmobile, Saturn). And I think we will see this trend continue into more industries (like hotel chains).
lizknope|1 year ago
I was recently buying a Seasonic power supply. What is the difference between Prime, Vertex, Focus, or Core series? Then there is Prime TX, Prime PX, Prime GX. I have no idea what all this is. I ended up just picking something in the 800W range with the modular power outputs that I needed.
JohnBooty|1 year ago
To a casual, who doesn't know or care that six of those brands are just GM nameplates, they just see seven options for a sedan. And if I'm GM, I certainly like the odds that they'll pick a GM even though I'm essentially just designing one or two sedans and then advertising them six different ways.
A simpler example (that somebody else mentioned down below) is toothpaste. There are like, ten different varieties of Colgate on the shelf. The point isn't that they expect me the consumer to know or care about the differences, or that they are so "addicted to the smell of their own farts" that they think there's a meaningful difference between brands of Colgate.
The point is that they want to consume shelf space, crowd other brands out, and send the message that they are the default, safe choice for toothpaste. We can say that's dumb, but I suspect the sales figures would tell us they're having some success with that.
imiric|1 year ago
Sure, but I find this branding even more confusing.
"Dude, you're getting a Dell!"
"Oh, neat! Is it a PC or laptop?"
"It's a Dell Pro... laptop."
"..."
At least with XPS, Latitude, etc., consumers were able to easily distinguish between models, after getting familiar with the product line. Naming all products "<company name> [Pro,Pro Max]" will always be clear as mud. Not to mention that "Pro Max Premium Plus Ultra" is dumb, in that Apple way. Apple is notorious for naming all their products the same, so consumers have to use launch years to distinguish them.
xnx|1 year ago
tim333|1 year ago
Lio|1 year ago
Having loads of random product numbers is really no better than named ranges.
If you only have 3 product lines then people will learn the names and can understand the differences when shopping.
InvisibleUp|1 year ago
unethical_ban|1 year ago
Should I get the "Dell Pro Max ", the "Dell Pro Max Plus", "Dell Pro Plus", or the "Dell Premium"?
I understand cleaning up the model lineup, but jeez.
crooked-v|1 year ago
unknown|1 year ago
[deleted]
Oxodao|1 year ago
I wouldn't have thought that such a recognizable brand as the XPS line would fade for "AI PC" BS but heh
legitster|1 year ago
This is probably good evidence that they needed to simplify their branding. Having their halo consumer product compete for market mindshare against their professional products is counterproductive. Especially when everyone wants to cross shop against MacBooks.
In contrast, ThinkPad's X1 shares almost nothing with the rest of the Thinkpad's professional line, but it sits there adding prestige to the brand.
AmVess|1 year ago
I switched to a new M1 MacBook Air and it was like going from a Cessna 150 to an F-15. Everything on the M1 MBA was decades ahead of the XPS.
Everyone and their brother now sells a much better product than XPS, and often for nearly half the cash. I picked up an Asus Vivo last year. Very nice product, half the cost of the XPS they had on offer, but with the same specs and screen.
It feels like it was engineered as a unit, much like the MBA. The XPS in comparison is a parts bin special.
ksec|1 year ago
I dont think XPS is a business / professional line? But I think I have heard similar complains from Thinkpad user as well. The only good PC hardware surprisingly came from Microsoft their Surface line. But most business dont use it.
blackeyeblitzar|1 year ago
As for AI PC - unfortunately Microsoft has forced this on everyone. They used their influence and power to force Intel to agree to this branding and the conditions for it to be met (things like having a Microsoft specific “Copilot” button). And all the OEMs have to come along or face repercussions for these partnerships. It’s just another example of big tech having too much market share, capital, etc.
geodel|1 year ago
vel0city|1 year ago
Personally, I'm OK with these computer manufacturers cleaning up their product line.
legitster|1 year ago
Spivak|1 year ago
kwanbix|1 year ago
I am a Lenovo guy myself, however I like what they are trying to do. If they actually do a good separation, that would be great. If they only do 9 level of computers, that would be a good change.
Kinda ThinkPad T, X, P. But more clear. And again, I only use ThinkPads T, P, or Xs.
rs999gti|1 year ago
Hell yeah, Lenovo ThinkPad for life.
pjmlp|1 year ago
jhickok|1 year ago
Lio|1 year ago
I still have it. It was a good machine.
Most things worked correctly out of the box but occasionally WIFI didn't wake from sleep properly and the battery life was always a bit rubbish compared to any MacBook Pro.
I think that Dell have had too many models forever. Simplifying their line up is a good idea.
chrislongss|1 year ago
registeredcorn|1 year ago
It's all just smushing a bunch of words for "really good" together and pretending like it means something different or unique. If something is maximum, it is the maximum - A maximum grade exceeds a "professional grade" the way an "enterprise subscription" is larger than "team subscription".
In an ideal scenario, it would simply be: "Basic, Advanced, and Maximum". I get the issue though. Sales want to be able to move products, and its an issue if people don't want to feel poor by buying the "basic" one, but can't afford the higher models. Fine! If the want to use more market-y terms, why not something like: "Quality, Premium, and Luxury"?
I would also presume that that would be specific to consumer grade. A business-grade line would be much easier. Keep the model names clear and obvious for Purchasing & Logistics people: "Basic, Performance, Executive". Basic is for grunt work who need internet access for a WebApp, but not much else. Performance is for finance, or whoever deals with a lot of wear and tear. Executive is thinner and fancier looking, but about as weak as basic model but can open Excel and PowerPoint.
_DeadFred_|1 year ago
archero|1 year ago
_fat_santa|1 year ago
Their consumer laptops are all garbage IMO, mainly cause I find they try to max out specs so it looks good on paper and skimp on really basic things like the hinges, batteries, etc.
Their professional laptops are much better, my parents just got rid of a Dell Latitude that I passed down to them after college, and when I bought it for college it was already 5-6 years old so all in all it had a service life of more than a decade. Specs might be down compared to the consumer line but everything else IMO is much better built (chassis, battery, hinges, etc)
officeplant|1 year ago
The base model XPS laptop was ~$999 at the time (vs $1299 for a 2023 model). Which sadly doesn't feel all that expensive today even though I would absolutely still call a $1000 laptop expensive.
arjie|1 year ago
Pretty neat trick. The only thing is that something about the way the video framebuffer was set up when you hit the MediaDirect button made the GRUB interface laggy. After that, the kernel resets everything and all is well!
This particular laptop was part of the infamous batch of bad G84 series of Nvidia graphics chips. The BGA soldering on the GPUs would crack under thermal stress, but you could reflow it with a heat gun or using the oven (crazy for a semi-plastic device!). In my case, it happened early enough that XPS support replaced my motherboard a few times. They actually met me wherever I was with the part to replace the board and the tech would do it for me at home. Overall, that was the finest customer support experience I ever had. I'm a fickle guy, though. It wasn't enough to keep me with the brand and I eventually ended up with a Macbook.
It's funny. After posting this I googled my name and XPS M1330 and found a post where I was trying to boot off the SD card. I was fascinated by this idea back then that I could just carry my OS on an SD card and then people couldn't see any of my stuff unless they had that specific SD card: https://www.dell.com/community/en/conversations/laptops-gene... . Sadly the XPS M1330 didn't work for that, but I think I did it with a USB stick (which is unfortunately more noticeable - back then they were bulky!).
0: https://web.archive.org/web/20150811070526/https://arjie.com...
1: https://web.archive.org/web/20150811065240/https://arjie.com...
kibwen|1 year ago
chad1n|1 year ago
unknown|1 year ago
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unknown|1 year ago
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hiharryhere|1 year ago
unknown|1 year ago
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unknown|1 year ago
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unknown|1 year ago
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xnx|1 year ago
mgaunard|1 year ago
AdmiralAsshat|1 year ago
LeftHandPath|1 year ago
Shopping for a laptop recently has left me, ironically, running for Mac. The experience on most windows laptop vendor sites is awful:
- Dell's sales page focuses on proprietary names like "ExpressCharge TM", "Stealth Mode", "ComfortView TM", "Cryo-Tech TM", etc, that mean nothing to me [0]. It also gave me a pop-up when I went to a specific laptop's page.
- HP has way too many categories on the landing page [1]. I mistook "Elitebook Ultra" for their top-of-the-line, but then discovered they're $3000 lightweight notebooks with Snapdragon chips and Qualcomm GPUs. The first and second laptops shown appear to have identical specs, but differ in price by $2000 [2]. Trying my luck elsewhere, going to "ProBook" gives me no less than 53 options to read and sort through [3].
- Lenovo is actually decent [4]! The product lines are named well and properly explained. The UI isn't as pretty as HP's, but it's a lot more functional.
- Asus overall [5] isn't great (more proprietary names like "SmartHinge" and aesthetic-focused product descriptions). However, the Asus ProArt site is done fairly well [6].
Almost every windows laptop feels like it's trying to sell me on everything that isn't specs. "SmartHinge". "Stealth Mode". "Youthful" aesthetics. Weird proprietary bloatware and extended warranties.
And, even on the sites that don't give me confusing marketing, I'm left to figure out whether I need Windows "Pro" or "Home", what the hell Copilot+ is (a $20/mo upsell [7] that I'm guessing the laptop will forever beg me to add, like OneDrive used to), and if I a guide to get rid of spyware, bloatware, ads, auto-installed candycrush, and other anti-consumer jabs once I actually buy the thing (like I did with Windows 10 when it first released). And then fight every month or two when it inexplicably can't find the license for Office I pay monthly, for and locks me out of all of my documents.
With a Macbook, contrarily, I know I can actually research the silicon, figure out the specs, and actually get what I ordered / expected. I also know I won't have to fight the OS nearly as much, even if Apple has its own upsell attempts, anti-consumer warranty/repair problems, etc. I never would've expected to feel that way. Especially not 10-15 years ago.
But maybe Dell's rebrand helps them move back in that direction a little.
[0]: https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-laptops/scr/laptops
[1]: https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/cat/laptops
[2]: https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/mdp/hp-elitebook-ultra-3074457...
[3]: https://www.hp.com/us-en/shop/vwa/laptops/brand=ProBook
[4]: https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/
[6]: https://www.asus.com/us/proart/laptops-home/
[7]: https://www.pcmag.com/explainers/what-is-microsoft-copilot
yread|1 year ago
If all you want is a thinkpad maybe. But then you click the thinkpad link and have to figure out whether you want a T, P, L, E, C or X thinkpad (they don't make Ws anymore, right?) Oh and some also have "s" suffix. And they differ from non-s quite a bit
jhickok|1 year ago
For a time Microsoft had a relatively clean Surface lineup, but a quick check reveals that it's significantly more difficult to shop than it was.
rbanffy|1 year ago
daft_pink|1 year ago