You have the opinion that Musk's gesture was perfectly innocent. Others don't think so. It's your opinion, and it's a valid hypothesis. But the other opinions are as valid as yours. They are implying that Musk is not nice and don't give him the benefice of the doubt. You are implying that people criticizing Musk are not nice, and don't give them the benefice of the doubt.
The parallel with "democrats doing Nazi salute" is pretty poor: of course people will not assume it was the intention for someone who has, by the ideas they defend and by their acts, demonstrated they are strongly opposed to the Nazi ideas. But it is not the case here.
On my side, I think it is very difficult to believe that Musk has done it 100% innocently. Musk is a troll, and it was a perfect opportunity to "trigger" people while pretending he did it innocently. I'm not sure how sympathetic he is with Nazi ideas (but I would not be surprised he would be sympathetic to the core concepts, he is promoting the same family of ideas grounded in the same roots), but I think it is very much plausible that he don't consider the Nazi salute dirty enough, so that he can use it to troll with despite the consequences (think of the message it sends to real Nazi sympathizers), which is already pretty bad. The views he has expressed otherwise (support to AfD, conspiracy theory, ...) just reinforce the idea that "100% innocently" is unlikely.
> The parallel with "democrats doing Nazi salute" is pretty poor: of course people will not assume it was the intention for someone who has, by the ideas they defend and by their acts, demonstrated they are strongly opposed to the Nazi ideas. But it is not the case here.
You have to prove that. You cannot just randomly keep saying it as a starting position because you hope nobody will call that out. He has shown support for free markets, reducing regulations, reducing taxes/gov. spending (within budget and small at that) and for limited government in general. How is that support for the National-Socialists?
> I'm not sure how sympathetic he is with Nazi ideas (but I would not be surprised he would be sympathetic to the core concepts, he is promoting the same family of ideas grounded in the same roots),
Again, you have to prove this. Be concrete: which ideas precisely? Which "concepts", which "family"?
Musk is too ignorant of it to support or not support "Nazi Germany", flat out. But he's constantly boosting actual Neo-Nazis, agreeing with the white replacement stuff, endorsed the AfD -- again, without knowing what that means -- and now he's snarling, and saluting the audience and Trump.
> Georgios Katidis (Greek: Γεώργιος Κατίδης; born 12 February 1993) is a Greek professional footballer who plays as an attacking midfielder. He is best known for performing a Nazi salute after scoring a game-winning goal in 2013, which led to his permanent suspension from every level of the Greece national team and his suspension from AEK Athens for the remainder of the 2013 season.
Note how the article doesn't even mention what he thinks about "NAZI Germany", because it doesn't matter. It's a Hitler salute.
And that's a soccer player, not someone rambling about fake news on a platform they bought where they also constantly say "hmm, interesting" to the most vile, demented nazi bullshit, and now running a "department of government efficiency". This deserves a LOT more scrutiny, at the inauguration of a President who once said he could shoot people in broad daylight on Times Square, and his supporters wouldn't mind.
> This is one of the many reasons Democrats lost. This type of propaganda will not work anymore.
What "kind of propaganda"? That you keep repeating I claim Elon Musk "supports Nazi Germany", which doesn't exist since 1945? What are you on about? This is why people come to the realization that some people are really just defending this shit on autopilot and we must not wait for their approval to resist fascism.
cauch|1 year ago
The parallel with "democrats doing Nazi salute" is pretty poor: of course people will not assume it was the intention for someone who has, by the ideas they defend and by their acts, demonstrated they are strongly opposed to the Nazi ideas. But it is not the case here.
On my side, I think it is very difficult to believe that Musk has done it 100% innocently. Musk is a troll, and it was a perfect opportunity to "trigger" people while pretending he did it innocently. I'm not sure how sympathetic he is with Nazi ideas (but I would not be surprised he would be sympathetic to the core concepts, he is promoting the same family of ideas grounded in the same roots), but I think it is very much plausible that he don't consider the Nazi salute dirty enough, so that he can use it to troll with despite the consequences (think of the message it sends to real Nazi sympathizers), which is already pretty bad. The views he has expressed otherwise (support to AfD, conspiracy theory, ...) just reinforce the idea that "100% innocently" is unlikely.
rofo1|1 year ago
You have to prove that. You cannot just randomly keep saying it as a starting position because you hope nobody will call that out. He has shown support for free markets, reducing regulations, reducing taxes/gov. spending (within budget and small at that) and for limited government in general. How is that support for the National-Socialists?
> I'm not sure how sympathetic he is with Nazi ideas (but I would not be surprised he would be sympathetic to the core concepts, he is promoting the same family of ideas grounded in the same roots),
Again, you have to prove this. Be concrete: which ideas precisely? Which "concepts", which "family"?
computerthings|1 year ago
> Georgios Katidis (Greek: Γεώργιος Κατίδης; born 12 February 1993) is a Greek professional footballer who plays as an attacking midfielder. He is best known for performing a Nazi salute after scoring a game-winning goal in 2013, which led to his permanent suspension from every level of the Greece national team and his suspension from AEK Athens for the remainder of the 2013 season.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgios_Katidis
Note how the article doesn't even mention what he thinks about "NAZI Germany", because it doesn't matter. It's a Hitler salute.
And that's a soccer player, not someone rambling about fake news on a platform they bought where they also constantly say "hmm, interesting" to the most vile, demented nazi bullshit, and now running a "department of government efficiency". This deserves a LOT more scrutiny, at the inauguration of a President who once said he could shoot people in broad daylight on Times Square, and his supporters wouldn't mind.
> This is one of the many reasons Democrats lost. This type of propaganda will not work anymore.
What "kind of propaganda"? That you keep repeating I claim Elon Musk "supports Nazi Germany", which doesn't exist since 1945? What are you on about? This is why people come to the realization that some people are really just defending this shit on autopilot and we must not wait for their approval to resist fascism.