Baltic countries disconnect from the Russian power grid

[RvdV]

On Saturday (8th of Feb), Baltic countries will disconnect from the Russian power grid and synchronise with the Continental European electricity system. They will operate in "island mode" for 33 hours, and then synchronize with the European grid frequency.

The frequency is a key parameter of the grid. If there is too much load, it goes down, and if there is too much production it goes up. A lot of critical grid infrastructure relies on the frequency being in the 49.5-50.5 Hz range.

I built a tool together with some colleagues to track the grid frequency in real time during this operation over the past few days to follow this process in real time!

If you're curious for more details, there is also a great post on the Estonian TSO's website about the process: https://elering.ee/en/synchronization-continental-europe

[foobarian]

I am endlessly fascinated that the grid frequency across an area the size of entire countries/continents gets driven, at the end of the day, mechanically by countless titanic sized spinning machines that slow down when more load is offered, and vice versa.

[adolph]

For other folks who find grid identity as a shared frequency fascinating, this week's Complex Systems podcast won't disappoint.

https://www.complexsystemspodcast.com/episodes/electricity-g...

[1970-01-01]

Off-topic;

Why does America use 60Hz? I've never found a satisfactory answer.

[bz_bz_bz]

Surprised this isn’t already available. Does Estonia only publish 5 minute frequency data?

[mrweasel]

The interesting bit is that this includes Kaliningrad. See: https://www.kyivpost.com/post/46628

[samf]

Very cool! I couldn't tell from the article if Kaliningrad will remain on a grid with the Baltics or become its own island.

[mchannon]

I like the site.

Unfortunately for this American, having a different set of standards for mathematical notation tripped a "don't these people know the difference between Hz and kHz?" impulse in my brain.

To illustrate: When an American sees "50,000 Hz" we process it as you would process "50 000 Hz". This misunderstanding could be corrected by using two or four significant figures after the decimal. That's too much to ask though, probably requiring a large number of hours to accommodate someone not even from there.

Your site is fine, it's our brains that are more appropriately adjusted. A little disclaimer link or something would help a number of us understand. A large number of otherwise intelligent and educated Americans don't realize this difference in notation and this would be a great opportunity to educate them.

[bramhaag]

The site is confusing, even as a European: both periods and commas are used as decimal separators.

[johnisgood]

I am European and I dislike the use of comma, too, and I use dot everywhere. I see it as "50 000" as well, as a non-American. :P

[RvdV]

Yes good point! We only had the idea of making this site a few days ago so the UI could use some tweaks. Thanks for the feedback.

UPDATE: made a small PR and fixed it. For now it's most consistent to just use dot separators everywhere.

[HPsquared]

Especially when the number format on the dial doesn't match the number format on the chart.

[regnull]

AFAIK it's entirely possible to adjust it based on the browser's locale

[ChrisArchitect]

Earlier:

Estonia to disconnect from the Russian-run electricity network on Saturday

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42971959

[Hnrobert42]

Gosh I love these electricity grid posts. As someone with almost zero knowledge about the subject, I am fascinated by what I learn. The last one I saw was when Ukraine switched away from Russia days before Russia invaded them.

[rossdavidh]

I don't know that this will happen, but it does open the door more for Ukraine to target Russia's grid, without worrying about taking down the grid for Baltic NATO members who they would not wish to anger.

[IndrekR]

This info is also used for time-stamping audio recordings in forensics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_network_frequency_a...

[lysace]

The "Map of European Transmission System Operators" at the top of this page shows relevant geographical context:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronous_grid_of_Continenta...

Note how Denmark is split between two separate synchronous grids.

There are lots of high-voltage DC connections between the grids in this map.

[albiinics]

On the other thread someone wrote that the Baltic countries pay over 20 cents per kW, while Russian electricity is just 5 cents.

[nagisa]

What is the point you're trying to make with this? Majority of the cost of electricity in the Baltics come from taxes and distribution fees – these well exceed 5 cents by themselves – just like elsewhere in the EU. None of the Baltic countries actually trade electricity with Belarus or Russia for quite some time either, so if there is an effect on prices due to synchronizing with the EU infrastructure, it is going to be minimal. In fact the spot market price already follows the capacity in Sweden & Finland quite closely.

As another data point, the electricity price was already ~16 cents/kWh 10 years ago and ~12c/kWh in 2009. High despite trading with Russia being a thing back then.

[dzhiurgis]

Those 5 cents are enough to murder thousands of people in Ukraine and put target on yourself.

Baltics are next if putin isn’t destroyed.

[skeletal88]

And? So? Do you think we should want to be part of russia now?

We will happily pay a bit more to get as far away from russia as possible.

Also, our prices include taxes, subsidies for renewables, the co2 scheme payments and so on.

[londons_explore]

Did they consider connecting to both grids at the same time making a bigger 'supergrid'?

If there is insufficient connectivity between the grids and the connections all disconnect due to overload, you just end up back in the two-grids situation that they have planned anyway.

[sidewndr46]

The goal of this is to economically and politically isolate Russia and prevent anything in Russia from affecting the Baltic states

[lvlvlv]

BRELL ring is a tool to manipulate the baltics energy system and pressure them politically. Namely, it is used as a “last resort” balancing system where fast response river Volga cascades are able to eat the surplus (stop producing) or provide enough in case of shortages. Balancing energy is the most expensive and there is really no good way to bound/hedge the costs. Hence a tool to manipulate the baltics. In addition to that, this will allow the baltic countries to finally move onto more liquid and cheaper 15min day-ahead, intraday markets.

[pjc50]

The political situation is not favourable to that.

[amenghra]

This would require both grids to be exactly synchronized.

[casenmgreen]

This is very interesting, and the web-site is very nicely done.

[zachrip]

What does it actually mean to disconnect? Is there some physical connection being broken? How is that done?

[yuliyp]

Yes it's some physical connection being broken. It's not unusual to adjust the ways in which the electrical grid is connected. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Q-aVBv7PWM from Practical Engineering which talks about some of the nuances of building switches which can break connections between different parts of the grid safely.

[RvdV]

Yes, they are already keeping the link at 0MW transferred for a while and will now disconnect it. You can read more on Elering's website: https://elering.ee/en/synchronization-continental-europe