If you're a computer science student who is thinking of using this, don't.
Don't use Copilot, Gemini, Cursor or any other code assisting tool for the several first years of your study or career. You will write code slower than others, sure, but what you'll learn and what you build will be a hundred times more useful for you than when you just copy and paste 'stuff' from AI.
Invest in fundamentals, learn best practices, be curious.
This is bad advice to people with the correct posture.
If you want to learn: don't use these models to do the things for you. Do use these models to learn.
LLMs might not the best teachers in the world but they're available right there and then when you have a question. Don't take their answers for granted and test them. Ask to teach you the correct terms for things you don't know yet, so you can ask better questions.
There has never been a better time to learn. You don't have to learn in the same way your predecessors did. You can learn faster and better, but must be vigilant you're not fooling yourself.
It's interesting you write this. I have a long experience and I use these auto complete on drugs now... I can't see myself writing all the damn code myself anymore.
I remember the days of using books, having to follow the code bits in the book as I typed them. I don't remember diddly squat about it. Same from years of stack overflow. I'd just alt-tab 12 times, read the comments, then read another answer, assess the best answer. Massive waste of time.
Use all the technology you have at your hands I say. But be sure to understand what you auto-completed. If not, stop and learn.
I agree, but I'll add that you can still use a standalone LLM window as a "teacher". If you don't know how to do something, ask it how to do it, and make it explain every piece of what's going on so you truly absorb it. But don't let it write the code FOR you, you should implement it yourself.
I think this is not a good idea or suggestion at all.
If i use google maps to find my way around, i'm faster by a lot. I also do remember things despite google maps doing the work for me.
Use Code assistent as much as possible but make sure to read and understand what you get and try to write it yourself even if you just write it from a second window.
In this age and pace, writing code will change relevant in the next few years anyway
I tend to agree. But will extend beyond computer science students and say especially people who are self-learning. When I was getting started, I actively tried to minimize the number of packages, and abstraction tools I used. Consequentially, I was able to properly and deeply understand how things worked. Only once I was able to really explain, and use a tool, would I accept an automated solution for it.
On the flip side, I've now found that getting AI to kick the tires on something I'm not super well versed in, helps me figure out how it works. But that's only because I understand how other things work.
If you're going to use AI in your learning, I think the best way you can do that is ask it to give you an example, or an incomplete implementation. Then you can learn in bits while still getting things done.
I just interviewed someone for a Senior position who's been using these AI copilots for 1.5 years as a contractor. In the interview I politely said I wanted to evaluate their skills without AI, so no Cursor/Copilots allowed. They did not remember how to map through an array, define a function, add click/change handlers to input, etc.
Don't use garbage collection or high level dynamic typing when building web servers. It's important to understand what the machine is actually doing at a low-level. Implementing REST API's in C++ will write code slower than others, sure, but you'll gain so much in your fundamentals of how memory management and OS processes work.
If you're a student who is thinking of not using LLM's, don't.
You put yourself at a significant disadvantage by not availing yourself of an infinitely patient, non-judgemental, and thoroughly well read tutor/coach.
I think there is a lot of room to leverage it, though resisting the temptation to have it do your work.
You can get it to provide feedback on code quality, suggest refractors and its reasoning (with the explanation rather than the full solution), basically treating it as an always available study group.
There is probably room for a course or book on a methodology that allows students to engage in this practice, or models with prompts that forbid straight completion and just provide help aimed at students.
I made my career investing in fundamentals, but started many decades ago. I can't in good conscience recommend it today. We will still be need some to do fundamental things (and they will be self-motivated and know who they are), but I don't think that's where most of humans will be in the stack. We should be at the top directing the machines, not competing with them.
Same sort of advice as don't copy verbatim to write your essays - ie for you to learn it has to flow through your brain.
However the above advice for essays doesn't include not looking at textbooks or papers - just not to blindly copy.
So perhaps you should use coding assistents - but always in a mode where you use as a source to write yourself rather than cut and paste/direct editing.
Ye you probably want to get grip on the fundamentals. My old college still have the students write some programs by hand with paper and pencil on exams to enforce this.
But, exercise pressure in courses will probably increase to recalibrate for the difficulty level. I feel LLMs would make you make assignments so much faster I don't think you can not use it.
If your goal is to become a fundamentally sound computer scientist, this may be good advice.
However, if - like 99% of software developers in the workforce - your goal is to work on software until you earn enough that you no longer have to, then ignore this awful advice and focus on learning the tools that are becoming ubiquitous and mandatory is most roles.
Otherwise you are pre-assigning yourself to irrelevance, equivalent to programmers refusing to use operating systems, compilers, runtimes, etc.
I think only for those editors. Google does also give a free API Key (aistudio.google.com) for the underlying models (though not the coding fine-tuned one) But IMO the free tier is rate limited a bit too much to build your own extension out of it for free.
As usual for Google services, where other providers just make you sign in & you're set, Google requires you to create a specific "Cloud project" and then makes you look through the menus to specifically enable the "Gemini Code Assist" feature.
I don't believe that this is the future of computer programming, all those coding assistants feel like companies trying to make mechanical horses and caravans when the combustion engine was invented.
IMHO they should be inventing cars, planes and trains.
Why? Because they write code using tools made to accommodate people and when you are taking out people from the loop keeping those is useless. It's especially evident when those AI tools import bazillion of libraries that exist only to help humans tot reinventing and spending time solved problems and provide comfort when coding.
The AI programming tools are not like humans, they shouldn't be using tools made for humans and instead solve the tasks directly. IE, if you are making a web UI the AI tool doesn't have to import tons of libraries to center a div and make it pretty. It should be able to directly write the code that centers that and humans probably shouldn't be looking at the code at all.
When is the last time you tried Cursor? It definitely doesn't import libraries. It can if you prompt it to but you have control.
I find it works great it you prompt it one step at a time. It's still can be iterative but it allows you to tighten up the code as you go.
Yes you can still go yolo mode and get some interesting prototypes if you just need to show someone something fast but if you know what you're doing it just saves time.
That would be the case of this were actually AI. But LLMs actually do procedurally generate language in a fairly human way, so using human languages makes sense to me.
Particularly, "Data excluded from training by default" is not available in the free and first paid tier.
Google was obviously irked that Microsoft got all this juicy training data since everyone is on their walled git garden, and tried to come up with a way to also dip some fingers into said data.
_mitterpach|1 year ago
Don't use Copilot, Gemini, Cursor or any other code assisting tool for the several first years of your study or career. You will write code slower than others, sure, but what you'll learn and what you build will be a hundred times more useful for you than when you just copy and paste 'stuff' from AI.
Invest in fundamentals, learn best practices, be curious.
ndr|1 year ago
If you want to learn: don't use these models to do the things for you. Do use these models to learn.
LLMs might not the best teachers in the world but they're available right there and then when you have a question. Don't take their answers for granted and test them. Ask to teach you the correct terms for things you don't know yet, so you can ask better questions.
There has never been a better time to learn. You don't have to learn in the same way your predecessors did. You can learn faster and better, but must be vigilant you're not fooling yourself.
keyle|1 year ago
I remember the days of using books, having to follow the code bits in the book as I typed them. I don't remember diddly squat about it. Same from years of stack overflow. I'd just alt-tab 12 times, read the comments, then read another answer, assess the best answer. Massive waste of time.
Use all the technology you have at your hands I say. But be sure to understand what you auto-completed. If not, stop and learn.
Drakim|1 year ago
BLubliulu|1 year ago
If i use google maps to find my way around, i'm faster by a lot. I also do remember things despite google maps doing the work for me.
Use Code assistent as much as possible but make sure to read and understand what you get and try to write it yourself even if you just write it from a second window.
In this age and pace, writing code will change relevant in the next few years anyway
icepat|1 year ago
On the flip side, I've now found that getting AI to kick the tires on something I'm not super well versed in, helps me figure out how it works. But that's only because I understand how other things work.
If you're going to use AI in your learning, I think the best way you can do that is ask it to give you an example, or an incomplete implementation. Then you can learn in bits while still getting things done.
prismatix|1 year ago
reducesuffering|1 year ago
xnx|1 year ago
You put yourself at a significant disadvantage by not availing yourself of an infinitely patient, non-judgemental, and thoroughly well read tutor/coach.
kace91|1 year ago
You can get it to provide feedback on code quality, suggest refractors and its reasoning (with the explanation rather than the full solution), basically treating it as an always available study group.
There is probably room for a course or book on a methodology that allows students to engage in this practice, or models with prompts that forbid straight completion and just provide help aimed at students.
karmakaze|1 year ago
DrScientist|1 year ago
However the above advice for essays doesn't include not looking at textbooks or papers - just not to blindly copy.
So perhaps you should use coding assistents - but always in a mode where you use as a source to write yourself rather than cut and paste/direct editing.
rightbyte|1 year ago
But, exercise pressure in courses will probably increase to recalibrate for the difficulty level. I feel LLMs would make you make assignments so much faster I don't think you can not use it.
unknown|1 year ago
[deleted]
pinoy420|1 year ago
[deleted]
closewith|1 year ago
However, if - like 99% of software developers in the workforce - your goal is to work on software until you earn enough that you no longer have to, then ignore this awful advice and focus on learning the tools that are becoming ubiquitous and mandatory is most roles.
Otherwise you are pre-assigning yourself to irrelevance, equivalent to programmers refusing to use operating systems, compilers, runtimes, etc.
xnx|1 year ago
https://blog.google/technology/developers/gemini-code-assist...
smallerfish|1 year ago
This says nothing about Google's use of the data. Anybody have a better link?
graphGL|1 year ago
Data included in their training by default. You’ll need to opt-out.
terminalbraid|1 year ago
WithinReason|1 year ago
pdimitar|1 year ago
(Zero analogies to drug dealers. Wink wink.)
So can this be used standalone or must you use JetBrains / VSCode / Firebase / GitHub with no other option? I am not seeing any.
FergusArgyll|1 year ago
TiredOfLife|1 year ago
tokai|1 year ago
sachinjain|1 year ago
[0]: https://sachinjain.substack.com/p/ai-coding-assistant-gemini...
skerit|1 year ago
hahn-kev|1 year ago
infecto|1 year ago
mrtksn|1 year ago
IMHO they should be inventing cars, planes and trains.
Why? Because they write code using tools made to accommodate people and when you are taking out people from the loop keeping those is useless. It's especially evident when those AI tools import bazillion of libraries that exist only to help humans tot reinventing and spending time solved problems and provide comfort when coding.
The AI programming tools are not like humans, they shouldn't be using tools made for humans and instead solve the tasks directly. IE, if you are making a web UI the AI tool doesn't have to import tons of libraries to center a div and make it pretty. It should be able to directly write the code that centers that and humans probably shouldn't be looking at the code at all.
dmalik|1 year ago
I find it works great it you prompt it one step at a time. It's still can be iterative but it allows you to tighten up the code as you go.
Yes you can still go yolo mode and get some interesting prototypes if you just need to show someone something fast but if you know what you're doing it just saves time.
darkerside|1 year ago
croes|1 year ago
MonkeyClub|1 year ago
Particularly, "Data excluded from training by default" is not available in the free and first paid tier.
Google was obviously irked that Microsoft got all this juicy training data since everyone is on their walled git garden, and tried to come up with a way to also dip some fingers into said data.
You should see the reviews in the JetBrains plugin page: https://plugins.jetbrains.com/plugin/24198-gemini-code-assis...
People are all so "shut up and take my money", but the bloody thing won't even sign them in.
But it's still in beta, right? Perhaps it'll start working in a couple more months.
ChrisArchitect|1 year ago
JoshTriplett|1 year ago
barotalomey|1 year ago