AI Avatars Escape the Uncanny Valley

[abxyz]

Setting aside the uncanny valley, my understanding is that people like seeing people not because they look like people but because it conveys effort and investment on the part of another human being. We want to feel like we're worth someone else's time, in every context.

We don't like to interact with people just because that's the only way we can interact but because humans are human. AI avatars are the exact opposite: a statement of disinterest. If you don't care enough about my business to be on a sales call with me, why would I bother speaking to an AI avatar you send in your place? What's a thank you message without a human being actually taking the time to record it?

AI avatars seem a lot like crypto: they're a neat technology solving the wrong problem. The "inefficiency" of humans interacting with humans is the fundamental component of communication. I guess it's a lot like LLMs: instead of producing less content that is more valuable / thoughtful per unit, we're producing a lot more content that is much less valuable / thoughtful per unit. AI avatars will create more vacuous communication, not enable our communication to be more thoughtful.

Maybe human behavior will change because of this, maybe the next generation that grows up interacting with AI avatars won't have this same feeling that speaking to an actual human means something.

[powvans]

Spot on. There's something instinctual about this. My kids (13,10,8) all love making art. When I show them AI tools that they could use to generate art or riff on existing art, they are actively opposed. They tell me that AI art is not real art, that AI tools for doing this sort of thing are gross, and they want nothing to do with it.

As a technologist I think "omg this is so cool" and it has been genuinely surprising to see how they actively rebuff it.

[gigatree]

That’s why I disagree with the idea that salespeople will be the first to be replaced by AI. If anything, they’ll be the last to be replaced.

[jmathai]

I want to interact with a computer like it's a computer. Clicking, dragging and cursing.

Who wants to interact with a computer as if it were a human?

[xnx]

So far the largest applications I've seen of AI avatars are deepfake-ish Musk videos on YouTube trying to scam people with some shitcoin, and pornography (as always).

> We expect this space will give rise to multiple billion-dollar companies,

The most miraculous thing about this wave of AI is how democratized it is and how resistant it has been to anyone making money of it.

[asdfgjkl]

So it's another case of "let's make a solution for nonexisting problem" in the world of AI?

We all hear promises of how AI will save the world and bring about technological innovation and solutions for hard problems, and what we get is replacement for a job that can be done much cheaper by a human being.

I am getting major crypto vibes here, promises of greatness and bringing nothing but unnecessary fluff.

[geodel]

> I am getting major crypto vibes here, promises of greatness and bringing nothing but unnecessary fluff.

This is A16z. Calling it unnecessary fluff would be rather polite. I think they are going hard core on to their next scam. Of course crypto vibes is no coincidence here.

[NewJazz]

What kind of ai might change your mind?

[bitbasher]

The more AI stuff I see makes me want to purchase a cabin somewhere in remote Montana and start writing a journal.

[NewJazz]

A16z will find you and put you in a work camp sooner or later.

[ycitm]

Doesn't seem to be any discernable improvement on the Zoom Cat Lawyer.

[wellthisisgreat]

I am not a cat

[entrepy123]

From TFA:

> Can’t you just generate an image of a face, animate it, and add a voiceover? Not quite. The challenge isn’t just nailing the lip sync — it’s making facial expressions and body language move in tandem. It would be weird if your mouth opened in surprise, but your cheeks and chin didn’t budge!

Starting here:

- "generate an image of a face, animate it, and add a voiceover?"

Tried this at [0]. Here's an example visual output:

- https://visualmic.com/example-animation-4.gif

Judge for yourself. You can see the mouth and eyebrows move in response to voice volume, and the eyes shift and blink according to settings. But no cheek movement, no head tilt, and no face shape change.

I think TFA is sort of right.

I'm not sure that face cap and AI are 100% needed, and most of the tools for making great VR models seem either pretty complicated or sort of privacy invading. But, better translating voice input into face changes does seem sort of needed.

There's "virtual Youtuber" (vtuber) software too, but that too seems some combination of complicated/clunky, resource intensive, and/or in signup-required land. [EDIT: Surely, there is a good front end at OpenLive3D [1], but making the .VRM model for it, e.g., with VRoid Studio [2] is where things seem start to get a little more time/energy-intensive.]

I'm not against pseudonymous avatars, but is there a third path? It should be easy and open, no? Gonna have to trawl through the suggestions of a16z on this one.

  [0] https://visualmic.com
  [1] https://openlive3d.com
  [2] https://vroid.com/en/studio

[voidUpdate]

Just to your point on vtubers, I agree that sometimes the software is a bit clunky, but my girlfriend was able to make herself an avatar and get it responding correctly quite easily. I had to help her with a couple of things, but that was mostly because she didn't know what she needed to look for. Plus, I think the final aim of this is different. VTubers, to me at least, are all about expressing yourself as something you want to be, not just... re-animating your own face? Not entirely sure what the purpose of this is

[bpt3]

When can we escape a16z ramming worse than useless concepts down our throats and telling us how great they are in a sanctimonious fashion?

That will be the greatest advancement of the millennium for humankind.

[NewJazz]

Don't go on HN. This is pretty much the only place that gives this guy attention from what I've seen.

[ssalka]

This is besides the point, but the linked Monoverse / Unanswered Oddities videos are so good. Would definitely recommend, besides being hilariously funny it's a testament to what the average person can accomplish now if they actually want to put time into making good AI-based content.

[torginus]

This is just a personal preference thing - but I dislike any attempts at injecting artificial personhood - if they make an agentic personal assistant or whatever, I don't want to think of it as a person but a rather sophisticated tool. My phone uses AI to retouch the pictures it takes with its camera, but I don't have to exchange pleasantries with iPhone Clippy for it to do its thing - it just pretty much does.

I don't want artificial buddies, or servants or whatever except maybe in video games.

[ruffrey]

As exciting as the last couple years have been in the AI space, I totally agree.

There was an advertisement on Twitter a few years ago for Google Home. It was a video where a parent was putting their child to bed, and they said, "Ok Google, read Goodnight Moon."

It felt like a window into a viscerally dystopian future where we outsource human interaction to an AI.

[whiplash451]

« This has unlocked advertising for businesses that could never afford traditional ad production »

So glad to see SV focusing on first-order problems after all

[imaginationra]

I as an artist will be happy to see all these useless talking head "content creators" get replaced by AI Avatars-

So then only real artists and ai will remain- these "content creator" human avatar golems were always transitory anyway- software can chase algo's/trends better than any human so good riddance-

[bigyabai]

A16Z should rebrand as a ballistics company with the rate they've been shooting themselves in the foot recently.

[geodel]

Unless one drains out every last cent from these scammers. They keep coming up with new crap everyday.

[isawczuk]

Can you explain these statement? I'm probably out of the loop.

[teachrdan]

It will never stop being funny to me that these assholes self-righteously told government to step out of the way so that they (and by extension the rest of the Silicon Valley investor class) could show how they could build their way out of all of our social, economic, and political problems.

They even end this self-righteous screed with "There is only one way to honor their legacy and to create the future we want for our own children and grandchildren, and that’s to build."

This all sounds nice, if completely empty of all substance. And then what do these rich jerkwads actually build? AI Avatars! You can't make this up! They talk big about building tens more nuclear power plants and a replacement for the VA and the capacity for Harvard to teach a million students at a time. But when push comes to shove they are only capable of trying to make some easy money with more AI bullshit no one actually needs.

https://a16z.com/its-time-to-build/

[fullshark]

Hey they have Crypto and Anime funds too. The three pillars of a healthy society.

[klooney]

https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/w_1272,c_limit,f_webp,q_... they do have a bunch of hardware startups, mostly in socal.

https://a16z.com/american-dynamism-50-2025/ is their splash page, table is from https://www.construction-physics.com/p/reading-list-031525

[tempodox]

The high art of pumping rose-colored hot air! The more worthless the crap they sell, the higher their profits. We need helmets because they are so busy throwing this shit at every available wall to see whether it sticks.

[miltonlost]

Trying to put a human-face on AI annoys me to no end. Stop trying to make me empathize with a computer program. Stop trying to endear me to a company's choice to not hire humans.

I made a phone call to a cable company because I couldn't use their app or website to do what I needed. The bot that answered my call then proceeded to use fake keyboard typing sounds as they "look up my info". Let the bot be a bot. Don't try to trick me.

[rainm4n]

Watching that made me feel weird.

[localghost3000]

I wonder how long before someone figures out how to use this for tech interviews

[TheGrognardling]

It's encouraging to me that as AI becomes more lifelike, people are becoming more and more resistant to humanlike AI 'avatars' and the like - echoing Kevin Kelly's sentiments that widespread societal adoption of new technologies is usually slow, or even nonexistent in some cases. It seems like we're heading towards a crypto bubble scenario in many cases - and we'll find where AI is genuinely useful and where it's just bullshit.

[dgfitz]

LLMs != AI. I’ll die on this hill.

Building products for a non-existent thing is reminiscent of pets.com

[tempodox]

I am soo disappointed with these lame ideas. I was hoping for an AI that analyzes my personality with x-ray vision and then creates the coolest best possible avatar for me based on that. /s

[bigyabai]

Sometimes it's genuinely hard to convince myself that A16Z's employees aren't involved in one big elaborate troll on Marc and Ben. If I paid people to be this wrong all the time, I'd be put out of business years ago.

[palmotea]

> I would rather slam my dick in a car door. A16Z can fuck right off.

How dare you! You're a really bad person unless you treat the products of VCs with the same enthusiasm and naivete that people did in the 90s. You owe them optimism!

[NewJazz]

Seriously how was this even a problem to begin with. Maybe ai advocates should focus on more practical applications.