For anyone curious, if you made a similarly sized gas-powered pickup with an i4 engine, it would be penalized more than a full-sized pickup for being too fuel inefficient, despite likely getting much better mileage than an F-150 because, since 2011, bigger cars are held to a lesser standard by CAFE[1].
The US is falling way behind in electric vehicles. If BYD could sell in the US, the US auto industry would be crushed.[1]
What went wrong is that 1) Tesla never made a low-end vehicle, despite announcements, and 2) all the other US manufacturers treated electric as a premium product, resulting in the overpowered electric Hummer 2 and F-150 pickups with high price tags. The only US electric vehicle with comparable prices in electric and gasoline versions is the Ford Transit.
BYD says that their strategy for now is to dominate in every country that does not have its own auto industry. Worry about the left-behind countries later.
BYD did it by 1) getting lithium-iron batteries to be cheaper, safer, and faster-charging, although heavier than lithium-ion, 2) integrating rear wheels, differential, axle, and motor into an "e-axle" unit that's the entire mechanical part of the power train, and 3) building really big auto plants in China.
Next step is to get solid state batteries into volume production, and build a new factory bigger than San Francisco.
I LOVE it! THIS is the kind of truck I'd be looking at to replace my 1998 Ford Ranger.
Here is what could be potential deal-breakers:
- Lack of a mobile app. Minimalist design is great, but I still want an app to manage charging and be alerted to any vehicle issues.
- Lack of good charge management and battery conditioning. Either that, or a cheap and easy to replace battery pack. I'd really like both!
- Comparable hauling and towing capacity to the 1998 Ford Ranger. Those numbers aren't exactly impressive, but I do use the truck as a truck, and I occasionally need the hauling capacity (weight).
- Bucket seats. I need a bench seat so I can take my wife and dog. Think weekend glamping trips. Picture 8 shows a bucket seat. It doesn't look like that would work.
If anyone from Slate is reading this, this is how I'm looking at this truck. FYI, I'll be comparing this to the Ford Maverick.
This is extremely refreshing. I think that it would be possible to make something like this in the US for under $15K even. Cars and trucks are so over-engineered and come with tons of low value options intended to drive up the price.
For a case in point, consider that headlights that turn on and off automatically in response to darkness (or rain) are not a standard feature on many cars, yet they include a manual switch that costs more than a photosensor only because of the trim-level upgrades.
Cars could include a slot for a tablet but instead come with overpriced car stereos and infotainment systems that are always light years worse than the most amateurish apps on any mobile app store.
As should be very clear by now after the 2008 US auto industry bailouts and the 100% tariffs on Chinese EVs, the US auto industry is heavily protected and faces virtually no competition, which is why a common sense vehicle like the one in the article sounds revolutionary, though I imagine BYD could deliver something a lot more impressive for $10K if allowed to compete in the US without tariffs.
It's a $20k, street-legal, EV modding platform. Sounds like you can mount your own infotainment system. Just an electric motor, battery, and chassis, and the rest is up to you. Isn't this what we've been asking for?
I like it. My wife runs a riding academy and we use a Honda Fit the way some people would use a pickup truck: we can fit 10 bales of wood shavings in the back. [1] We’re dreading when it fails because they don’t make the fit anymore and compact hatchbacks seem to be on the way out. Recent experiences have made me a bit of a Buick enthusiast and I can see driving a 2005-ish sedan except that I won’t get those sawdust bales into the trunk. We are also thinking of fitting in EV into the fleet, so far the used Nissan Leaf has been the main contender but this is a pickup truck I could get into.
[1] We were profitable from day one because we didn’t buy a $80,000 pickup on day one the way everybody else does.
As a car audio enthusiast, the biggest obstacle to putting a system into a new high-tech car is bypassing the deeply-embedded infotainment system while retaining decent aesthetics and steering wheel controls. The idea of getting an electric drivetrain and new-car safety with a 90's-style blank canvas for audio is amazing.
I hope that the noise isolation and intended speaker mounting locations are good!
Its a cool car, but forgive me for not getting Lucy-Footballed again by an electric car startup claiming to be able to "change the game" while never actually getting any cars sold.
I loved the Saturn plastic doors. The salesdroids were conditioned to call them "polymer panels" and I got corrected when I bought my SL2 back in the day, but I was sold when in their own showroom he kicked the door in, it visibly dented, and then popped itself right back out with no damage to either the paint or the pla, uh, polymer.
That SL2 went from California to Maine, down to Georgia and back to California. It never had any dings and had only a few scratches in the paint. My Civics seem to get dinged if you look at them wrong.
I wish I could have said the same about the Saturn's stickshift, though. That actually fractured when I was in Gilroy. I mean, the shaft literally snapped.
Absolutely love this. Love brands taking the SLC (simple, lovable, complete: https://longform.asmartbear.com/slc/) approach - minimalism is an absolute delight in a world where everything is crammed with unnecessary/unused feature bloat.
(That said, I'd love a stereo - even if it was just a built in bluetooth speaker/aux-in, which feels like a perfect compromise!)
I put down $50 to reserve one. I grew up with an old car that I tinkered with endlessly. Mostly because it was simple enough for me to get my head around! This car reminds me of that time.
I'm hoping that they go with a lot of "off-the-shelf" electronics and mechanical parts. Standards are a blessing.
It feels like they're going with a different business model to traditional car manufacturers. AFAIK most manufacturers make a lot of their money via servicing. I'd love to take a look at what their long-term business strategy is.
Very exciting! Electric vehicles have the ability to be very simple, much simpler than an ICE.
Although electric can't be 100% analog, I miss the old days when a car has no software updates, no telemetry, no privacy issues, no mandatory subscription for features.
>The rather extreme omission of any kind of media system in the car is jarring, but it, too, has secondary benefits.
>“Seventy percent of repeat warranty claims are based on infotainment currently because there’s so much tech in the car that it’s created a very unstable environment in the vehicle,” Snyder says.
I'm totally cool with them not having an infotainment screen or even a stereo itself. But speaker management might be a pain.
I really hope they decide to either include speakers to which you connect to your own infotainment system or at the very least, have the space or brackets where you can bring your own speakers and install them without cutting.
Having a bluetooth speaker take care of all the sound is just too bulky and cumbersome for those of us who need to live with constant music in the car. Plus, I don't want to leave a $150 bluetooth speaker in my car all the time and encourage break-ins.
However I wonder about the overlap between people that need a truck and this particular truck. I have only owned trucks when I needed to go out in the middle of bumfuck nowhere with a payload, in places with poor access to electricity. If I need to go in bumfuck nowhere without payload then there is no need for the truck, and if I need a payload in the city it's just way way cheaper to have it delivered when you factor in depreciation of even a cheap truck.
Would really love to see something like this with a simple 4 cylinder motor. Like the old s-10 / ranger. Until then the solution I have found is to just tag a trailer on small passenger vehicle, since it is now impossible to find a compact gas truck.
I'm quite excited about this. Ticks all my boxes for "low" tech, simple, moddable, useful, and cheap. I'm hoping my aging Pontiac Vibe holds out long enough to upgrade to one of these, if they succeed. I put in a preregistration!
> It only seats two yet has a bed big enough to hold a sheet of plywood.
Not really the point of the article, but, does it? This[0] says the bed is 60 inches long and 43 wide, and plywood is 96x48 inches. Is it like, any vehicle fits plywood if you cut it to the size of the truck or stack it on top?
Perfect. Instant buy for me if they can deliver on their promises. No other car in recent memory has spoken to my minimalist frugal engineering mind like this one. Hope my 2000 4runner lasts until the Slate gets delivered to my door!
The issue with this is they claim the cost savings came from not having a screen and other silly features, but that’s not where money is spent.
The real cost savings came a tiny, 150 mile battery. It could easily be <100 miles loaded up after a few years of use, which means there are very few use cases for this truck, and it certainly doesn’t make sense without the tax credit. Cool idea, but there’s no getting around the price of batteries
So basically they are doing the simple "BEV can be cheap if you don't try to size the battery for long distance driving" but leave out lots of other things that don't meaningfully contribute to the lower price, as a distraction.
That might be just the thing that had been missing for bootstrapping the market of short haul electric (think of all those trips that are done in a car because they are almost but not quite walkable/bikeable!). Reminds me of how the Tesla roadster and then S bootstrapped the market of luxury electric.
> The simplification goes simpler still. Slate will make just one vehicle, in just one trim, in just one color, with everything from bigger battery packs to SUV upgrade kits added on later.
Makes me wonder if, once "normal" features are added, cost and reliability will be a problem?
In contrast, I could see this really helping the dealer model work because dealers could compete with different customizations.
That being said: At least when it comes to the battery, efficiencies come from a single large battery instead of a modular battery. I suspect they'll need to offer a larger battery at the factory.
This should really be mainstream car manufacturing. I can't wait for the day when we have choice of cheap cars, with DiY upgrades and no fucking tracking mechanisms built in and something that works without a phone. I wish them all the success and for the first time in my adult life, I'm excited about technology in cars again!
I could imagine this being popular for company and fleet trucks, but I can't imagine it being popular for personal vehicles with the general public. The people I know who drive personal pickup trucks want the absolute biggest one they can find and have zero interest in actually doing any truck activities with it. They drive their Raptors and 2500s to work and to burger king and that's it. If they do any customization, they might take it to a shop and pay them to put a louder muffler on it.
If this can’t compete head to head (no tariffs or other import restrictions) with BYD and the like, then I don’t know why one would get excited. Feels like an expensive consolation prize with tons of compromises. I want competition.
The fact that it’s so bare bones (no stereo, etc. unless you put one in) makes me really hope that it doesn’t phone home with a firehose of telemetry like pretty much every other new car. If so, they’ve got my interest
~$30k for a manual-window, slow-charging truck? Will anybody in the US actually want one?
It's a cool concept... looks good to my eye, small trucks are neat, etc. But, I'd want push-button windows, up-to-date charge controller/battery tech, and the normal EV integrated app. Maybe if it was really a $20k truck (they're advertising the price after incentives, many of which are either going away or vanish for higher income earners).
I see this and I don't see it as an every day, driving-on-my-commute style vehicle. As someone who (previously) drove a 2014 honda civic, cheaper cars leave a lot of comfort for longer drives. I can't imagine this barebones vehicle being fun to drive for any extended period of time, or any extended distance, unless you'd spent considerable time customizing it to those needs (at which point, you've probably spent more than buying something off the shelf).
I do see this being great for short utility trips (think running errands, picking something up, etc), and as a utility vehicle (would be nice to be able to have an 8ft bed).
It would be really interesting to me to see a fleet of vehicles like this that are ultra-rentable; think a Bird/Lime scooter, but a utility truck.
I'm looking for a vehicle which doesn't track my location, and doesn't have complex software controlling vehicle functions which could kill me. Maybe this is for me.
Some comments were deferred for faster rendering.
aidenn0|10 months ago
1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_average_fuel_economy...
Animats|10 months ago
What went wrong is that 1) Tesla never made a low-end vehicle, despite announcements, and 2) all the other US manufacturers treated electric as a premium product, resulting in the overpowered electric Hummer 2 and F-150 pickups with high price tags. The only US electric vehicle with comparable prices in electric and gasoline versions is the Ford Transit.
BYD says that their strategy for now is to dominate in every country that does not have its own auto industry. Worry about the left-behind countries later.
BYD did it by 1) getting lithium-iron batteries to be cheaper, safer, and faster-charging, although heavier than lithium-ion, 2) integrating rear wheels, differential, axle, and motor into an "e-axle" unit that's the entire mechanical part of the power train, and 3) building really big auto plants in China.
Next step is to get solid state batteries into volume production, and build a new factory bigger than San Francisco.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_BYD_Auto_vehicles
taylodl|10 months ago
Here is what could be potential deal-breakers:
- Lack of a mobile app. Minimalist design is great, but I still want an app to manage charging and be alerted to any vehicle issues.
- Lack of good charge management and battery conditioning. Either that, or a cheap and easy to replace battery pack. I'd really like both!
- Comparable hauling and towing capacity to the 1998 Ford Ranger. Those numbers aren't exactly impressive, but I do use the truck as a truck, and I occasionally need the hauling capacity (weight).
- Bucket seats. I need a bench seat so I can take my wife and dog. Think weekend glamping trips. Picture 8 shows a bucket seat. It doesn't look like that would work.
If anyone from Slate is reading this, this is how I'm looking at this truck. FYI, I'll be comparing this to the Ford Maverick.
resters|10 months ago
For a case in point, consider that headlights that turn on and off automatically in response to darkness (or rain) are not a standard feature on many cars, yet they include a manual switch that costs more than a photosensor only because of the trim-level upgrades.
Cars could include a slot for a tablet but instead come with overpriced car stereos and infotainment systems that are always light years worse than the most amateurish apps on any mobile app store.
As should be very clear by now after the 2008 US auto industry bailouts and the 100% tariffs on Chinese EVs, the US auto industry is heavily protected and faces virtually no competition, which is why a common sense vehicle like the one in the article sounds revolutionary, though I imagine BYD could deliver something a lot more impressive for $10K if allowed to compete in the US without tariffs.
dogline|10 months ago
PaulHoule|10 months ago
[1] We were profitable from day one because we didn’t buy a $80,000 pickup on day one the way everybody else does.
blt|10 months ago
I hope that the noise isolation and intended speaker mounting locations are good!
flustercan|10 months ago
classichasclass|10 months ago
That SL2 went from California to Maine, down to Georgia and back to California. It never had any dings and had only a few scratches in the paint. My Civics seem to get dinged if you look at them wrong.
I wish I could have said the same about the Saturn's stickshift, though. That actually fractured when I was in Gilroy. I mean, the shaft literally snapped.
iamben|10 months ago
(That said, I'd love a stereo - even if it was just a built in bluetooth speaker/aux-in, which feels like a perfect compromise!)
brad0|10 months ago
I'm hoping that they go with a lot of "off-the-shelf" electronics and mechanical parts. Standards are a blessing.
It feels like they're going with a different business model to traditional car manufacturers. AFAIK most manufacturers make a lot of their money via servicing. I'd love to take a look at what their long-term business strategy is.
swagasaurus-rex|10 months ago
Although electric can't be 100% analog, I miss the old days when a car has no software updates, no telemetry, no privacy issues, no mandatory subscription for features.
thekevan|10 months ago
>“Seventy percent of repeat warranty claims are based on infotainment currently because there’s so much tech in the car that it’s created a very unstable environment in the vehicle,” Snyder says.
I'm totally cool with them not having an infotainment screen or even a stereo itself. But speaker management might be a pain.
I really hope they decide to either include speakers to which you connect to your own infotainment system or at the very least, have the space or brackets where you can bring your own speakers and install them without cutting.
Having a bluetooth speaker take care of all the sound is just too bulky and cumbersome for those of us who need to live with constant music in the car. Plus, I don't want to leave a $150 bluetooth speaker in my car all the time and encourage break-ins.
ty6853|10 months ago
However I wonder about the overlap between people that need a truck and this particular truck. I have only owned trucks when I needed to go out in the middle of bumfuck nowhere with a payload, in places with poor access to electricity. If I need to go in bumfuck nowhere without payload then there is no need for the truck, and if I need a payload in the city it's just way way cheaper to have it delivered when you factor in depreciation of even a cheap truck.
Would really love to see something like this with a simple 4 cylinder motor. Like the old s-10 / ranger. Until then the solution I have found is to just tag a trailer on small passenger vehicle, since it is now impossible to find a compact gas truck.
thederf|10 months ago
SamuelAdams|10 months ago
https://www.consumerreports.org/electronics/personal-informa...
JackC|10 months ago
Not really the point of the article, but, does it? This[0] says the bed is 60 inches long and 43 wide, and plywood is 96x48 inches. Is it like, any vehicle fits plywood if you cut it to the size of the truck or stack it on top?
[0] https://www.thedrive.com/news/the-slate-truck-is-two-feet-sh...
Rover222|10 months ago
I get that it's a bargain price, so that's the tradeoff. But a pretty bad one.
guynamedloren|10 months ago
guywithahat|10 months ago
The real cost savings came a tiny, 150 mile battery. It could easily be <100 miles loaded up after a few years of use, which means there are very few use cases for this truck, and it certainly doesn’t make sense without the tax credit. Cool idea, but there’s no getting around the price of batteries
usrusr|10 months ago
That might be just the thing that had been missing for bootstrapping the market of short haul electric (think of all those trips that are done in a car because they are almost but not quite walkable/bikeable!). Reminds me of how the Tesla roadster and then S bootstrapped the market of luxury electric.
gwbas1c|10 months ago
Makes me wonder if, once "normal" features are added, cost and reliability will be a problem?
In contrast, I could see this really helping the dealer model work because dealers could compete with different customizations.
That being said: At least when it comes to the battery, efficiencies come from a single large battery instead of a modular battery. I suspect they'll need to offer a larger battery at the factory.
pelagic_sky|10 months ago
Definitely something I would consider if they can make it happen.
nelblu|10 months ago
iZSJERil|10 months ago
patagonia|10 months ago
water-data-dude|10 months ago
alistairSH|10 months ago
It's a cool concept... looks good to my eye, small trucks are neat, etc. But, I'd want push-button windows, up-to-date charge controller/battery tech, and the normal EV integrated app. Maybe if it was really a $20k truck (they're advertising the price after incentives, many of which are either going away or vanish for higher income earners).
nrmitchi|10 months ago
I do see this being great for short utility trips (think running errands, picking something up, etc), and as a utility vehicle (would be nice to be able to have an 8ft bed).
It would be really interesting to me to see a fleet of vehicles like this that are ultra-rentable; think a Bird/Lime scooter, but a utility truck.
AlexCoventry|10 months ago