[monetus]

Indefinite royalties on Spotify are one thing, but how are they supposed to work in neural nets? Dividing equal share based on inputs would require the company to potentially expose proprietary information. Basing it on outputs could make sense as well I suppose, but would take some slightly ridiculous work for an arguable result.

Your point remains, but the problem of the division of responsibility and financial credit doesn't go away with that alone. Do you know if the openAI lawsuits have laid this out?

[johnnyanmac]

>how are they supposed to work in neural nets?

It can be as simple as "you cannot train on someone's work for commercial uses without a license", It can be as complex as setting up some sort of model like Spotify based on the numbers of time the LLM references those works for what it's generating. The devil's in the details, but the problem itself isn't new.

>Dividing equal share based on inputs would require the company to potentially expose proprietary information.

I find this defense ironic, given the fact that a lot of this debate revolves around defining copyright infringement. The works being trained on are infringed upon, but we might give too many details about the tech used to siphon all these IP's? Tragic.

>Do you know if the openAI lawsuits have laid this out?

IANAL, but my understanding of high profile cases is going more towards the "you can't train on this" litigation over the "how do we setup a payment model" sorts. If that's correct, we're pretty far out from considering that.

[martin-t]

I admit, rewarding work fairly is very difficult with perfect information, much more with proprietary models and training data.

With code, some licenses are compatible, for example you could take a model trained on GPL and MIT code, and use it to produce GPL code. (The resulting model would _of course_ also be a derivative work licensed under the GPL.) That satisfies the biggest elephant in the room - giving users their rights to inspect and modify the code. Giving credit to individual authors is more difficult though.

I haven't been following the lawsuits much, I am powerless to influence them and having written my fair share of GPL and AGPL code, this whole LLM thing feels like being spat in the face.