[mola]

So you want Israel to cease to exist? Germany did the Holocaust, nobody said Germany can't exist. Russia attacks Ukraine in an emperialistic power move, no one suggest Russia shouldn't exist.

But Israel is a "project" that needs to end. More like a scape goat.

I'm israeli. This war is bad, my government is evil. But I deserve to have a nation to call home, so do the Palestinians.

If you disagree with me, think about it a bit and what it says about you.

[kennywinker]

> Russia attacks Ukraine in an emperialistic power move, no one suggest Russia shouldn't exist.

But people do suggest russia should give back the territory they’ve taken by force. That’s most (if not all depending on your take) of israel.

Historically - in my opinion in the wake of ww2 a jewish state should have been carved out of germany, rather than england giving away land that wasn’t theirs to give away. So in a sense Germany as we know it should have ceased to exist.

Just as now, i believe for there to be peace in the region israel as we know it must cease to exist. Either by radically changing and becoming a place where palestinians and jews live together in peace and shared governance, or by giving up a huge chunk of land they stole in ‘48 to create two states.

Opinions, obviously.

[mola]

I supportthe two state solution.

Alas hamas killed that one in The 90s when they decided to send suicide bombers to Israeli busses during the peace process that Israel initiated.

Also Israel accepted the two state solution in 1948, alas all Arab countries decided to attack the newly idndependent country.

Saying "we" stole the land is a bit odd. The arabs leaving in Israel didn't call themselves Palestinians until after 1948.

Israel is not in the Arab peninsula, arabs living here came from there, hence they are Arabs.

I still support their right to their national claim. But pretending it's some ancient construct that "we" stole from is not historical. Palestinian nationalism is a modern construct.

[Hikikomori]

Who has the right to exist in that area? The people that already lived there and their offspring, who are now refugees in Gaza. People do have the right to form their own states, but on land they already own legally and ethically, not when you colonize land already occupied by others.

I did not call for the end of Israel as a project, I do disagree with it's creation, considering how it turned out, especially since it was more or less the intention of Zionism as stated by it's founders.

I don't know how to solve it. But I do know that Israels actions since it was founded has worked against any kind of solution that is not a takeover of the area and the creation of their ethnostate.

[mola]

You are severely lacking in history.

You domknownthat Palestinians are mostly Arabs and not native to the region.

The Israeli founders accepted the UN partition resolution. all Arab countries attacked Israel to destroy and create their pan Arabian fantasy.

In the 90s Israel initiated the peace process and gave self rule to the Palestinians with an end goal to create a Palestinian state. Hamas decided to send suicide bombers to bomb Israeli busses killing thousands.

This caused a massive shift right in israeli politics. And gave power to those saying we can't afford to give land. I don't agree with them.

Your revisionism is abhorrent.

[esseph]

Hey, American here.

> This war is bad, my government is evil.

We have a lot in common

> But I deserve to have a nation to call home, so do the Palestinians.

Absolutely!!!

[int_19h]

If the only way that Israel can continue to exist is as an apartheid state where a large proportion of the population has to be forcibly kept in a status with no political rights, or else expelled or killed altogether, then yes, Israel doesn't deserve to exist.

Now, I don't know whether that is true. It seems to be the argument that the Israeli government and the right-wing majority of its population are making now - that if they give Palestinians actual freedom, Israel will just cease to be, so they have to starve people to death, bomb them etc. The more they do that, the stronger the argument that Israel should cease to exist.

If there is another option that allows Israel to continue to exist, that's great. But it's really up to Israel to come up with a viable option for that, because Israel is an alien entity that forcefully imposed itself on this territory to begin with.

Regarding Russia, I'm a Russian citizen, and the invasion of Ukraine did, in fact, made me reach the conclusion that Russia should not exist as a state. It's not that this particular war is especially damning; it's that Russia has a very long track record of imperialist wars, and, more importantly, it doesn't change - it keeps doing it. Arguably Russia as it exists today is inevitably imperialistic simply because it's a polity that is cobbled together and still largely held by force or threat of it - it never really fully de-colonized, and if it ever does, it'd be an order of magnitude smaller. So from that perspective it really cannot change - and if so, then yes, it should cease to exist.

[mola]

If Israel is alien to the region, so are Arabs which is what Palestinians are.

That's nonsense.

The Jewish people have a long (2000years) of calling Israel territory as home. Does it mean I deny the Palestinians national claim, no. But it sure as hell mean Jews have a claim atleast as much as Arab immigrants and conquerers