[caust1c]

If you find the OP interesting, you might find Project Kamp more interesting:

https://projectkamp.com/mission.html

The OP seems like the academic approach to what project kamp is learning by doing: They're attempting to build a community that's eventually completely self sufficient on a fairly limited land space, and documenting the whole process.

[drooby]

I like Project Kamp and have been following them for years. However, I feel they’re moving quite slowly and often making mistakes on problems that have already been solved. For example, it took them a while to figure out their composting toilet, and even now it’s not a great solution.

They tend to have what are essentially interns do a bit of “research” and then piece together a solution. That said, I do applaud their efforts. It’s very entertaining to watch, and they seem to be hiring people lately who are more knowledgeable in their fields.

So, I very much appreciate this open-source-ecology “academic approach.”

[cbdevidal]

I’ve been following Open Source Ecology for years and they too are moving quite slowly. One part of the website points to a 2014 presentation. I’ve seen very little progress in the last ten years. Sad, because it’s a great idea.

[buovjaga]

That's more or less the critique OSE got back in 2013. Ie. if you're going to raise money, why not hire professional designers?

[Cthulhu_]

I wonder if they try to reinvent the wheel on purpose (the "first principles" thing people on HN often mention). Using off-the-shelf products can feel like cheating if your objective is to protest society / capitalism.

[vasco]

Efficiency I get, self sufficiency I don't get. Self sufficiency is net terrible as impact to the globe. It's obvious that specialization+trade gives us much more efficiency, be it in raw material usage, power usage, you name it, to create whatever product. Even space usage requirements balloon if everyone wants to be self sufficient.

If people want to optimize for self sufficiency they will need to hoard more stuff, they will need to produce and duplicate a lot, use more land and for sure they won't have any good stuff like doctors with a surgery room.

[Telemakhos]

Self sufficiency is usually a goal for those who want to avoid a systems collapse. When everyone is highly specialized and dependent on one another, failure in one part (especially if that part is logistical) cascades throughout the whole. For example, if the town’s petroleum distributor burns down, how long will residents be able to convey food home or products to market? If global shipping failed today, how long would it take for other nations to run out of food and pharmacological needs and silicon? If China destroyed the chip fabs in Taiwan by accident during an invasion, how long does it take the rest of the world to recover? During the pandemic we saw how vulnerable economic systems are to supply chain shocks, so it’s not unreasonable for people in the wake of that experience to seek a world with less exposure to that risk.

[lukan]

"and for sure they won't have any good stuff like doctors with a surgery room."

Depends how big the project/village is.

Also the basic idea is to be as self sufficient as possible. Not as a dogma.

And the benefit once it runs is, you don't have to go make war around the globe, because your economy is threatened. You can just stay at home minding your own buisness.

[yourapostasy]

Maybe this maxim within our software world might help: "Be loosely coupled, tightly cohesive".

Decoupling (the kind of self-sufficiency you are envisioning) is only a distant goal for interplanetary colonization. Loose coupling is fine as baby steps. As long as within their community they are tightly cohesive, they will do fine.

The intent is sustainable resiliency baked into our systems.

[bckr]

I think any serious countries of the future will spend substantial resources planting self-sufficiency caches every so many kilo acres. Students should be taught the basics of booting and sustaining a self-sufficient pod.

It shouldn’t be about isolationism / anarchy, but about limiting the blast radius for any given disaster.

Finally it also serves as a center for rehab, starting from scratch, and community service. The ultimate social safety net.

[modo_mario]

>Self sufficiency is net terrible as impact to the globe. It's obvious that specialization+trade gives us much more efficiency, be it in raw material usage, power usage, you name it, to create whatever product. Even space usage requirements balloon if everyone wants to be self sufficient.

I think you forget that the alternative hides a ton of externalities. For example those massive agri corporations are vaaaastly more efficient than me or my grandpa working our own gardens. But we aren't spraying or the like to contribute to insect population collapse. We're being rather damn space efficient, yet we don't use any fertilisers from gas and mining. We don't compact the soil or lose topsoil. and what we do produce is less deficient in micronutrients.

And as someone else already said. It really just means more self-sufficient.

[aa-jv]

Project Kamp would definitely benefit from opening up a new workshop on site with the sole purpose of building some of the Open Source Ecology tooling .. it'd help them immensely with tractor scams and .. especially of course .. defeating the neverending onslaught of Spikey Booshes ..