[tcbawo]

Is it really true that ICE has been stable? Cars seem to have been getting many innovations, especially with power, torque, and reliability. We probably don't hear much about it because it is low profile stuff and a mature product.

[everdrive]

> and reliability.

The newest vehicle reliability advances are _less_ reliability via:

- cylinder deactivation

- ubiquitous turbos

- gasoline direction injection

- more computers

- generally higher cost of repairs (eg: if a car from 2023 needed a headlight it would cost much more than a car from 1998 needing a headlight, and even if they both had the same failure rate the reliability of the new car would be worse from cost alone)

[topspin]

This is well informed and correct. Understand this if you buy a new ICE vehicle: the drive train is uneconomic to repair out of warranty: do not imagine you'll keep it long term or hand it off to a kid or whatever.

[dave78]

also:

- tons of sensors with limited lifespans

- more complicated transmissions with more gears

- auto start/stop

Pretty much all of these reliability reducers are manufacturers trying to eek a little more MPGs by throwing lots of complicated technology at the problem, which introduces a lot more failure points.

Headlights and taillights on my current vehicle are supposedly around $1500 each, mostly due to a bunch of sophisticated sensors being built in.

Back in the 80s headlights were standardized (in the US at least) - you either had rectangular or circular. They were available at every auto parts store. Now they're a special order item from the dealer.

[prerok]

Not even mentioning that you cannot change the headlight by yourself.

[trashb]

Actually ICE has improved significantly in the last 20 years, even though progress was held back by emission and safety regulations. In the year 2000 a sports car would have around 200/250hp while these days any sports car that wants to boast power has around 500hp or more.

Perhaps you're not into cars much but if you compare top cars on track days etc. you will know there have definitely been huge changes. Though during the last 20 years repairability and reliability also took a hit.

[tim333]

>500hp or more

But are they fun? My main experience of powerful cars is you hit the speed limit or a traffic jam within about 10 seconds.

I have more fun on my 1/3 hp ebike than my 200 hp car which suffers from the above.

[everdrive]

>200/250hp while these days any sports car that wants to boast power has around 500hp or more.

And it'll only weigh 4,500 lbs.

[xnx]

> held back by emission and safety regulations

How so? Are those not improvements?

[tim333]

I'm not sure they've improved that much. Comparing my 1990 miata/mx5 with modern cars I prefer not having electronic screens and bleeping things all over the place. The only thing I'd chose to modernise is engine efficiency which is maybe a bit better now.