[harikb]

There is a simpler explanation - HVAC jobs are directly influenced by the push to covert everything to heat-pumps. And good heat-pumps are expensive. So when you install a $15K to $25K, installation fee also goes up. I am surprised Solar isn't up there. Panels are cheap, install is what we pay for 10 years+

[bradlys]

It's not even that. It's that rich people are the only thing the trades are catering to now. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qT_uSJVCYds

Example of a solar install that was under $20k via DIY - maybe took this guy 1-2 weeks of full-time work. But he was quoted $90k and he did most of it himself - only hiring a backhoe operator to move some dirt around.

We're at the point where the trades are only going to cater to rich/desperate people because the margin they'd make on a job that is DIY-able (and charged a fair price) is not worth it to them. Why do 5-6 low margin jobs when you can do 1 high margin (rip-off) job? Your only competition out there is someone with the will to do it. Builders in CA are massive ripoffs as well.

I think the only way you bring costs from trades down is by having all your workers in-house - which is only doable for corporations. Your average homeowner is just fucked and is gonna have to youtube everything.

[Gigachad]

What I'm seeing is trades workers basically don't want small one off jobs because you waste so much time on the overheads unrelated to the actual work. If someone has a hole in the wall they need patched, you're spending time answering the phone, estimating the price, driving there, billing the customer, etc. And a lot of jobs are very one off and difficult to evaluate the price.

Why even bother when you could just work for a mass build and plaster up hundreds of walls in a single job on a new apartment building or housing development.

So as an individual it's almost impossible to get someone over to do a small job, and your only realistic option is to do it yourself.

[hexbin010]

> It's that rich people are the only thing the trades are catering to now.

This is my gut feeling too. I've known so many rich people who just accept whatever number a tradesperson quotes. There is no way that hasn't had a mass effect

[turtlebits]

Good mini splits aren't expensive. They're expensive because HVAC installers are fleecing US consumers.

A majority of mini splits are made in China and are inexpensive and reliable because they're so pervasive in Asia. Most are rebadged Midea or Gree.

You can get a decent mini split for <1.5K and install it yourself for $200 in tools.

[trollbridge]

I acquired a minisplit for $450 or so (labelled "For export only - not for sale in US or Canada", because it contained R-410 and doesn't meet the current efficiency standards) and installed it myself.

Getting a similar system installed would have been north of $10,000, and before anyone says "well, that would be a licenced HVAC installer", no it wouldn't - it would be a barely-trained person who is simply "supervised" by a licenced HVAC technician.

[s1gsegv]

If it was so lucrative, wouldn’t more people set up shop undercutting the current offerings? Why not become an HVAC installer and make millions, if you’re really able to make $15k profit on a job you can turn out in a day.

The truth is probably more that the various money sinks in our society are starting to add up, things like healthcare, legal protection, licensure, compliance, rent (business or personal), even just having appropriate work vehicles, fueling them, compensating people for the time spent sitting in traffic to come across town to your house. Somehow you’re paying for all of that when someone’s livelihood is installing your mini split. A lot of those costs have grown faster than wages, if you try to point to a reason why it’s different today than 20 years ago. More people looking to make a quick buck without doing any work or providing any real value, and more people succeeding.

[jonway]

It is expensive, but I think you're underestimating the costs.

If the AC catches fire because your electrician skills are bad, what happens? I guess you can rent a ladder if you need one, but they're at least $200 if your split is on the second floor and ladders can be deceptively tricky, and load ratings must be considered. Condensation can kill you and be an extreme cost with mold. Your first mini split is going to take a real long time to install, I promise, assuming you size it right. There is a non trivial risk to life and limb.

This is one of those "Reality has a surprising amount of detail" things.

[cake-rusk]

An AC is a heat pump too.

[korhojoa]

I don't know what the deal is about people saying heat pumps are expensive. They used to be a little pricier than AC units, but it's just a 4-way valve in addition to one.

I just looked it up, and I can buy a heat pump for 200-400 euros (depending on desired output), installation is ~400 euros. Why are you paying 20-30x for something identical? This sounds like a price difference created by government behavior, like with solar panels and related hardware which seem to be significantly overpriced in north america.

[bhhaskin]

A Heat pump is just AC with more valves.