[stokedmind]

As an American living in the Netherlands with a larger family (especially by EU standards, with 4 children!), I think I see a slightly different perspective.

Here, owning a car is extremely expensive - perhaps one of the most expensive in Europe. This price goes up considerably when you get a larger vehicle, both because fuel costs are very high but also because you are taxed quarterly for CO2/weight of the vehicle.

With a larger family, you are squeezed into an uncomfortable position since you are outside of the <= 2 child norm. Many 7+ seater vehicles (French cars, etc) are extremely impractical to the point of me thinking that they are not actually designed for more than 5 seats in use, as there is comically low cargo room and the 3rd row is extremely cramped (try fitting a stroller or anything besides people...ha!).

I ended up picking up a Chrysler Town & Country import from the USA for my family, because it was the only vehicle that I could find for a reasonable price that checked all of the boxes, and am paying dearly for it (400+ euros every quarter just to have the privilege of registering it!).

Before you say anything about us having a "kindercrusher" we also have 2 bakfiets cargo bikes and use them regularly, but public transit and bikes don't scale well to large families for anything more than a short distance ride (school, groceries, etc).

Large families are being squeezed out of existence here.

[bgnn]

I can agree with the most of this, but the large families being pushed out of existence is plainly wrong. How much the school is costing you? Healthcare? How much do you save by being able to cycle with 4 kids to short distances, where most of your daily travel comprised of?

Sure, car ownership is expensive here, but this is necessary to discourage car-centric culture.

Oh, I would have bought a VW transporter in your case, but that's a personal preference matter.

[stokedmind]

> I can agree with the most of this, but the large families being pushed out of existence is plainly wrong. How much the school is costing you? Healthcare? How much do you save by being able to cycle with 4 kids to short distances, where most of your daily travel comprised of?

Oh I love cycling. I know it's hard to find even remotely comparable cycling-friendly locations in the States, even if growing up (also in a large family) we were fortunate enough to live walking distance to schools in a suburban area.

But for education and health, health care isn't "free" in the Netherlands. We pay hundreds per month for the whole family for health insurance on top of the high taxes that support the "system". Public education is also tax-supported in the USA for K-12, although indeed higher education is more expensive.

I'm more referencing policy that is intentionally "squeezing" everything to make it all smaller and more frugal in a way that makes a <5 family size far more practical. It is not the same in the States.

[iolo]

I feel like a vw transporter 7 seater would suit your use case, maybe a vw caddy if you want something physically smaller.

[stokedmind]

I looked at transporters, they are about the same size (although less space in the "trunk"/back) but much more expensive to purchase. Almost exclusively diesels are available (with some rare exceptions), and their taxes are even higher than mine! Don't get me started on the VW Multivan or similar - beautiful cars, but extremely expensive.

VW Caddy we looked at and almost bought, but we had many bad encounters with dealers and instead bought from the private market.

[seany]

We just did this in the States. Family of 5 with a malamute that likes to road trip to places and do active things (read as, we need luggage space). In the "not crazy expensive" range was some mini vans, and suburban sized vehicles. Ended up with a Ford excursion max.