[idoubtit]

That's my experience. I'm not a Python developer, and installing Python programs has been a mess for decades, so I'd rather stay away from the language than try another new tool.

Over the years, I've used setup.py, pip, pipenv (which kept crashing though it was an official recommendation), manual venv+pip (or virtualenv? I vaguely remember there were 2 similar tools and none was part of a minimal Python install). Does uv work in all of these cases? The uv doc pointed out by the GP is vague about legacy projects, though I've just skimmed through the long page.

IIRC, Python tools didn't share their data across projects, so they could build the same heavy dependencies multiple times. I've also seen projects with incomplete dependencies (installed through Conda, IIRC) which were a major pain to get working. For many years, the only simple and sane way to run some Python code was in a Docker image, which has its own drawbacks.

[lexicality]

> Does uv work in all of these cases?

Yes. The goal of uv is to defuck the python ecosystem and they're doing a very good job at it so far.

[prox]

What are the big offenders right now? What does uv unfuck?

I only work a little bit with python.

[aeurielesn]

That's giving way too much credit to uv.

[simonw]

> IIRC, Python tools didn't share their data across projects, so they could build the same heavy dependencies multiple times.

One of the neatest features of uv is that it uses clever symlinking tricks so if you have a dozen different Python environments all with the same dependency there's only one copy of that dependency on disk.

[zahlman]

Hard links, in fact. It's not hard to do, just (the Rust equivalent of) `os.link` in place of `os.copy` pretty much. The actually clever part is that the package cache actually contains files that can be used this way, instead of just having wheels and unpacking them from scratch each time.

For pip to do this, first it would have to organize its cache in a sensible manner, such that it could work as an actual download cache. Currently it is an HTTP cache (except for locally-built wheels), where it uses a vendored third-party library to simulate the connection to files.pythonhosted.org (in the common PyPI case). But it still needs to connect to pypi.org to figure out the URI that the third-party library will simulate accessing.

[runjake]

I would not be putting up with Python if not for uv. It’s that good.

Before uv came along I was starting to write stuff in Go that I’d normally write in Python.

[QuercusMax]

Coming from a mostly Java guy (since around 2001), I've been away from Python for a while and my two most recent work projects have been in Python and both switched to uv around the time I joined. Such a huge difference in time and pain - I'm with you here.

Python's always been a pretty nice language to work in, and uv makes it one of the most pleasant to deal with.

[kristianbrigman]

That's partly because python has a very large installed base, and ease of entry (including distribution). This leads to people running into issues quicker, and many alternative solutions.

Unlike something like Rust, which has much fewer users (though growing) and requires PhDs in Compiler Imprecation and Lexical Exegetics.

Or C++ which has a much larger installed base but also no standard distribution method at all, and an honorary degree in Dorsal Artillery.

[whimsicalism]

uv solved it, it’s safe to come back now.