[tra3]

In the style of cheap tiktoks: "There are two types of people...". My wife loves listening to her phone on max volume, but it sounds so bad compared to half decent speakers.

Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

Also why are people using speaker phones in public places at max volume. The speaker in your phone is designed to deliver the sound directly to your ear, probably at higher fidelity.

I'm loving the fact that battery technology will eventually eliminate weed wackers.

Sorry if I sound cranky, I find loud noises challenging.

[yesfitz]

It's not unreasonable to expect certain behavior in a shared space.

I'm really not sure where some of the other people replying to your comment are coming from. Forcing every human and animal you come across to listen to what you're listening to is selfish. Full stop. And not doing it costs $0, which preempts any question of resources.

[dd8601fn]

Sometimes I would really rather not have the outside world isolated or noise cancelled while I'm listening to music... so I sorta get it?

But also, for all the reasons described, I just use transparency modes if I want that. That way nobody else has to hear my poor taste in music.

[mrexroad]

You touched a nerve for me — folks hiking with Bluetooth speakers. My god that grinds my gears. I can see an argument for playing music (at reasonable volume) while relaxing at a camp site, but on the trail it’s as aggravating as a dirt bike or snowmobile ripping along near by.

[mlfreeman]

In potentially-dangerous-animal country (e.g. grizzly bears, mountain lions, etc), it could be a safety mechanism...I was told repeatedly you need to make some kind of distinctive noise regularly so they won't get startled by you rounding a bend.

[dylan604]

I've heard many people say the cannot stand they way earbuds feel. Just like many people said they could not breath wearing a mask.

[robotburrito]

I think it’s cultural to do this or something.

[maerF0x0]

I'm with you. IMO sound pollution is no different than 2nd hand smoke. IMO It should not be anyone's right to impose upon others, especially when there are lower externality options. Wear headphones.

"Not everyone owns headphones" is such a dumb response because 1. This entertainment is purely optional (not needed for survival) and 2. There are $4 headphones on amazon making me believe in cheaper/poorer markets you could get them for about 1/2 that.

[socalgal2]

Go to SF. people carrying 24inch speakers on their back blaring music walking down market street

Or the DJ school at 20th and Mission playing music outdoors every Friday

[sneak]

Secondhand smoke is toxic and physically damages your body and enters your bloodstream.

Someone playing music is annoying and does not physically harm you in any way.

These are not remotely the same thing. There is a clear bright line between them.

[baxtr]

I find it absurd that music in cafés and restaurants has become so loud that it’s hard to have conversations with the people on your table. Sound pollution is a real thing.

[barbazoo]

I bet it's by design. If you actually make things pleasant you might accidentally create a third place and no one can profit from that!

[jiehong]

I find that sound design is famously awful in most public spaces!

For example, train stations tend to have high ceilings, so announcements are loud and full of echoes and reverbs. [0]

I think of sound a bit like WiFi: it’s better to have tons of low power speakers everywhere delivering a clear and non aggressive sound, than a handful of screaming speakers in a tight space: if you’re next to it it’s too loud, and far away it’s drown in reverb.

My guess is that architects and everyone else either don’t know or don’t care.

[0]: like the new Munich Main Station under construction, slide 2: https://entdecken.muenchen.de/en/station/26-4/

[m463]

"with this music we are a happening trendy place!"

(and nobody will notice during slow times that we donn't actually have that many customers)

[nephihaha]

The night clubs I went to in the nineties had loud music and low lights so talking to anyone was a challenge.

[dylan604]

hey, it's hard for the employees to enjoy their muzak over the din of all of your conversations!

[SoftTalker]

It's because they don't want you sitting there for any longer than it takes to eat your meal. They deliberately have tile floors and hard walls to amplify the noise.

[ecshafer]

> I'm loving the fact that battery technology will eventually eliminate weed wackers.

I've moved to all electric lawn equipment. Snow blower, lawn mower, weed wacker, leaf blower. They all work great, are quieter, and I don't have to deal with carburetors and oil ever again.

[officeplant]

Side benefit: Our electric push mower has enough LED lights on it for some reason that I can mow after sunset. I've mowed the grass at 9pm without disturbing anyone and its magic.

[zdragnar]

I only moved halfway. I had some electronic failure in one of my more expensive battery powered purchases, and the thing was just dead. There's no servicing it for any reasonable cost. For more important things, I'd rather have a two stroke engine I can work on myself. For everything else, battery operated is the way to go.

[lbrito]

>Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

I'm baffled by this too, but I think some people get accustomed to just having a soundtrack around them at all times, like they're living in a Hollywood movie. It gets to the point where they actually sleep with something always on (in the old days that would be a TV, not sure today. Probably a podcast)

[runjake]

> what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

Finally, it's my time to shine. OK, so I do this. Granted, I hike spots where I rarely run into other people. I listen to music out in nature because:

- I enjoy it and it creates a mood.

- I don't wear headphones because I want to be comfortable but I also want to hear the environment (for safety and enjoyment reasons).

- It also lets bears and cougar know I am around.

Finally, nature isn't new to me. I've spent significant amounts of time in the remote woods alone -- even living in the woods for some time. Not that it's boring by any stretch, but it's also not a novel experience to me.

But yeah, it'd be rude to be doing it where other people are trying to enjoy nature.

[dystopiandevel]

I can appreciate the reasons you have for wanting it. The only problem is when it affects my hiking experience. It annoys the crap out of me to hear it coming loudly from down the path when I just want to listen to nature.

Like the other commenter posted, you can use open earbuds, which I use as well for the same reasons.

As far as wild cats go, they are already pretty good at knowing you are there already without a speaker. Where I live there are many mountain lions and bobcats but I have never seen one close up, same in the California Sierra. In terms of bears, if they aren't black bears then yeah although it depends on where you are hiking. If it's in the backcountry, please pause it when I come by.

[Wurdan]

I've recently started trying open ear phones for other reasons and I've found the current state of the art pretty good in terms of sound quality. I use Nothing's open ears, but I'm sure there are many others that are equally good. They won't act as cougar alerters, but if you want to listen to both music and the environment where others are around, the tech is ready

[kelnos]

> But yeah, it'd be rude to be doing it where other people are trying to enjoy nature.

Right, so you are a hiking music-player, but also a person who is sensitive to the experiences of others and not a douche. I think this thread is about the douchey people who do this in much more crowded spaces than you're used to. Maybe they have the same justifications as you have when you're alone, but they just don't hold water for me when there are other people around.

[martinpw]

> Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

Washington Department of Natural Resources recommended bluetooth speaker playlists for hiking:

https://unofficialnetworks.com/2022/08/20/washington-roasts-...

[vondur]

> Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker.

Boy, that one really gets to me when I'm on the trail. Both hikers and mountain bikers are guilty of that. Also, the people with their AirPods in oblivious to anything going on around them...

[sneak]

So, people playing music around them is bad, and people playing music just to themselves is also bad?

[eddyg]

At least AirPods have an excellent transparency mode

[jszymborski]

> Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

I've not done this, and I don't think I would ever do this, but I can sympathize with having the idea that they don't want to be so isolated from nature so as to have headphones blocking out the sounds of the world around them dampened, but also feel like it would be super sweet if they could listen to Bowie right now.

It's also been shown that having music reduces the feeling of loneliness, having similar effects to having had a conversation recently, so if a person is hiking along perhaps it offers them companionship?

_If_ I ever did this (I wouldn't) I'd probably have it down to a whisper such that you would hardly be able to make it out unless you were right beside me.

[mancerayder]

What are you doing out in nature if you need to be around music and feel lonely? Stay in the city, leave the country to people who want to actually get a break from the city for their mental health.

In my case, listening to other people's music damages my mental health. If I encounter someone on a trail with music (this has not happened here in the northeast to me yet) they'll encounter a string of direct to-face insults from me.

[prmoustache]

When you are hiking there is actually a ton of noise/songs to listen to. Especially birds.

[Pxtl]

I've a smallish lawn so I've just been using wired yard tools my whole life. Have to be careful to mind the extension cord but it's dead simple and zero-maintenance. My lawnmower is just about old enough to run for President. Just make sure you get the right cable gauge for your mower, since you're dealing with long-enough runs that resistance loss in the cable is substantial and Home Depot just wants to sell you 100 foot 16 gauge thing that probably shouldn't be anywhere near a proper lawnmower.

[dpc050505]

I've found myself wishing I had a bluetooth speaker crossing meadows in bear country. It gets old singing Yellow submarine's chorus for the 35th time. Bears will hide if they hear you, if you surprise them and they get scared you might have a bad time.

[nebula8804]

Hopefully the rest of the world will eventually follow the Netherlands attempts to limit noise in cities by design

[1]:https://youtu.be/CTV-wwszGw8?t=202

[ben_w]

I get you, I also prefer quiet.

But I have a question:

> I'm loving the fact that battery technology will eventually eliminate weed wackers.

Is this a non-sequitur, or a euphemism/figure of speech/etc. which I have never previously encountered?

[zdragnar]

I think the following line puts it into more context:

> I find loud noises challenging.

They're basically comparing other people's speaker music to noise pollution. Two stroke engines can be heard from a long way off, and I've got box fans that are louder than my electric weedwhacker.

[scythe]

I think he means that electric handheld lawn equipment should be much quieter than gas-fired lawn equipment which is an infamous nuisance

[dylan604]

Just unsolicited sharing of their own personal preferences with the rest of the forum readers

[devin]

I am with you on speakers on a nature hike, but I think the line blurs a bit in a city context. As long as it's not extremely loud, I find it slightly more difficult to hate on the person playing some music and moderate volume while trucks and loud motorcycles go by. If we had less of a car culture, I might feel differently about it, but there's so much noise already that in that context I kind of shrug my shoulders at it.

[kelnos]

In a city context it's still obnoxious. In my experience these people are playing their music loudly. Like you can hear it from 2-3 blocks away, even with vehicle noise.

And the vehicle noise is expected and "necessary", in that it's a street, and of course there will be noisy cars and motorcycles on it. The noise is also easier to treat as a background buzz and tune out. Loud music is not any of those things.

Cities are a delicate balance when it comes to noise: if you live in a city, you have to acknowledge that you're living in a densely-populated place with lots of other people around, and make your peace with the fact that there will be noise. But at the same time, each individual should also do their best to avoid polluting the air with unnecessary noise. And blasting music from a giant bluetooth speaker in a backpack is 100% unnecessary, rude, and selfish.

[lacoolj]

I don't think this is really the idea behind this post

It's about enclosed spaces (airport) or open, quiet ones (hiking)

[prmoustache]

TLDR it feels better to announce yourself with some (non aggressive) music than triggering a bell.

I wouldn't use that when hiking but it is true that I sometimes use a bluetooth speaker when riding my bicycle in the city.

I don't put it at full volume but a lot of pedestrians and their dog seem to be attracted by dedicated bicycle lanes when they are built on the same level as the sidewalk. It is a good way to warn people of my presence without using a bell. Using a bell sometimes sounds a bit rude because people associate it to the use of the car horn which has become a proxy for insults instead of the warning device it used to be.

[1] I used to think pedestrians were doing it to annoy cyclists on purpose but judging by their often suprised reaction. I think it is just an unconscious behavior. Apart from bicycle lanes which aren't well marked, it is probably because the bicycle lanes are usually a smoother surface and thus more agreeable to the feet than the sidewalk thus people tend to walk on them natually.

[Tade0]

I spent a good part of the summer weekends in the mountains which are an hour's drive from my place.

Every minute someone in the distance would be flooring whatever loud vehicle they were driving/riding - mostly motorcycles, but I've heard a few cars.

Their enjoyment is everything, screw everyone else.

[Izikiel43]

> Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

Wife is concerned about bears

[m463]

I was in downtown seattle recently and these homeless people play music on giant bluetooth speakers.

It was kind of surreal - sketchy looking person playing high-pitched voice female vocals (imagine k-pop).

[autoexec]

Every person is just a few missed meals and showers away from being a "sketchy looking person" even k-pop lovers. The majority of Americans are precariously close to ending up homeless.

[bradleyy]

I used to work in Pioneer Square, and there was a guy with a "portable" (think desktop PC in a milk crate, bungie corded to a foldable dolly) gaming pc playing on the regular. Granted this is back a bit.

Seattleites are a resourceful lot.

[shrx]

If I'm hiking or cycling alone through the woods with high bear populations, I will often play some music to alert them to prevent an unpleasant encounter.

[ipv6ipv4]

> Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

I used to hold this same opinion. Unfortunately, times have changed and now everyone is constantly in their phones, isolated in their own universes, typically with earbuds or headphones. At least the obnoxious speaker dude is present; in a shared physical reality with the world around him. A lesser evil.

[MrGinkgo]

This is why god invented bone conducting headphones

[sefk]

I also sound cranky a lot lately when complaining about loud or unwelcome sounds in public spaces. So this project (and your comment) resonates with me.

Also yes, hiking with a bluetooth speaker is particularly galling. you're in nature! For that reason I've been considering buying (or building) a portable bluetooth jammer. I wouldn't do all the time, no reason to punish someone using wireless earphones respectfully. It'd need to have a trigger for JIT intervention.

[pvtmert]

there are many sibling/child comments here touching the bluetooth speaker topic.

obviously there are numerous people blasting those in public places in waay too high volume.

sometimes when I ride bicycle in non-car road (cycle/hiking paths around luxembourg) i put not-too-loud music playing on phone speaker (about 70% volume) both for vibes and also for safety. -- as there are people walking which may be obstructed by the bushes or other oncoming cyclists.

for the vibes part, i am really hoping smart-glasses or similar equipment to be more common, as i got echo frames last year, i am quite happy about the vibe it adds when i play background music (just to myself) in different occasions. (even though quality is not great)

many people mentioned headphones & earbuds, but i do not see them as the solution for nature/hiking related situations;

- (partial) blocking of external sounds, even if there is no noise cancellation, it dims outside sounds like bike bells, engine sounds, other people yelling at you because you are in danger, ie. may cause accidents

- comfort & compatibility issues with other equipment. like hearing aid (maybe that's the reason some people blasting away such high volumes? -- maybe never hearing loss haven't diagnosed properly!). if you have a helmet, over-head headphones usually dont work, stuck with ear-buds. fit and comfort of these are quite difficult. even if you use over-head ones, cushions usually go bad quite fast due to mild sweating or contact with external air & humidity.

i really hope price of bluetooth-speaker or bone-speaker glasses will go down significantly in the future. this way, you don't obstruct external sounds, not add heavy or squishy things to your ear while adding your theme song on a moment.

---

obviously i mention these as a reasonable human being, who keeps their phone in silent 7/24, and all videos muted all the time (i also mute my laptop, as i hate hearing other people's zoom/chime calls constantly ringing throughout the day!)

[kelnos]

The way I look at it when it comes to the comfort bits: if you aren't comfortable using headphones to listen to your music in a public place (for fit or safety or whatever reasons), then you don't get to listen to your music. It's just basic common courtesy. I find it mind-blowing that there are so many comments in this subthread supporting this sort of behavior.

I guarantee you that your 70% volume music while cycling is audible to people much farther from you than you think, and that many of those people are probably annoyed by it.

[barbazoo]

> Also what's up with the people hiking (by themselves) with a bluetooth speaker. You're by yourself, in nature. If you want to listen to music wear headphones!!

Maybe they don't know of or don't have access to bone conducting earphones. Whatever they're listening to, that way they'd also still hear their environment.

[fsckboy]

>Maybe they don't know of or don't have access to...

Maybe they don't know of or don't have any access to any sense of boundaries, as if they skipped the infant stage of development where they should have learned that "mom" is another person with her own coequal set of needs. And anybody with the urge to push back on this notion, please cover the case where it might apply to you to.

[kelnos]

If you can't listen to your music without polluting the noise landscape around you, then you don't get to listen to your music. The excuse you present is a selfish one.

[pixl97]

Yea, with you on that one. Headphones are great at the house where I have a controlled environment. When I'm out and listening to things I'll typically only use one at a time because it's easy to miss very important, possibly deadly things.

[BeetleB]

Wearing headphones while hiking is uncomfortable, and wearing earbuds for any length of time is always uncomfortable - hiking or not. They also fall out.

As others have said - not really a big deal. Either get ahead of them and maintain a significant distance, or stay behind and do so.

[gensym]

It is a big deal. It means for a lot of people there's nowhere they can go to actually enjoy the sound of nature. The strategy of getting ahead or staying behind doesn't work when there are switchbacks or crowded trails. The strategy that does work is to get fit enough to go deep into the backcountry because the troglodytes that bring speakers to hikes lack the discipline to ever get that far.

[anigbrowl]

No. This is YOUR problem. If you want to play your own music on a speaker, you're making your problem everyone else's problem. Grow up.

[latexr]

https://shokz.com

There you go. Quite comfortable, don’t have to stick them inside your ears, and still allows you to perceive the sounds around you.

In the spirit of fairness, I’ll also share the cons from my experience: First is battery life isn’t as good as headphones. That’s somewhat obvious as they’re much smaller, but they will still last you the whole day so not really an issue for hiking. Second one is that because they don’t block outside sounds, they’re not appropriate for audiobooks/podcasts while walking in the city. Again, not an issue for hiking.

[dylan604]

Yes, you are a crank, but you are not alone. Either way, we should at least acknowledge the crankiness.

Not everyone owns headphones. Some people might have received the speaker as a gift or decided on the speaker instead of headphones. How people spend their time outdoors is not up to you or I to decide. If they want to listen to music from a bluetooth speaker, that's what they want to do. There's a lot more outdoors for you to use as well so rather that stewing, just find more outdoors. Especially on trails. Just keep going. Or wait until they have kept going. I've never seen a bluetooth speaker that's big enough for someone to be on a trail with that doesn't "go away" after a minute or so.

I have discussed the speaker on trails issue with friends, and we've noticed that the louder one's speaker is the shittier the music it is playing.

[mythical_39]

> How people spend their time outdoors is not up to you or I to decide. If they want to listen to music from a bluetooth speaker, that's what they want to do.

What if it interferes with my desire to NOT listen to their music on their bluetooth speaker?

[LunaSea]

> There's a lot more outdoors for you to use as well so rather that stewing

There are also many deep caves in which you can listen to music on speakers. Why aren't you going to these caves?

The societal contract is that your freedom stops where your neighbours freedom starts. This also applies to the noise you produce.

[etc-hosts]

Often when I encounter a person loudly listening to music or videos on their phone in a cafe, it's because they are completely unaware of how loud they are or they obviously have some challenging psychological issues ( I live in SF ).

I have a lot of wired headphones I got off of Temu, I just give them a pair.

[anigbrowl]

How people spend their time outdoors is not up to you or I to decide.

If they're blasting music in a normally quiet place, they are deciding for me. You're literally giving priority to whoever chooses to be less considerate of others.

[tristor]

> Not everyone owns headphones. Some people might have received the speaker as a gift or decided on the speaker instead of headphones. How people spend their time outdoors is not up to you or I to decide. If they want to listen to music from a bluetooth speaker, that's what they want to do. There's a lot more outdoors for you to use as well so rather that stewing, just find more outdoors. Especially on trails. Just keep going. Or wait until they have kept going. I've never seen a bluetooth speaker that's big enough for someone to be on a trail with that doesn't "go away" after a minute or so.

I am very open to the argument of "you do you", which is pretty much my philosophy also. But I do think there are /some/ limits to this, because some behaviors are inherently anti-social. My philosophy is more than "you do you" should apply to policy and regulation, meaning that we should not criminalize or directly punish anti-social behaviors that don't cause direct and immediate harm. But that definitely does not mean that we should not shame people for acting in completely inappropriate ways, or directly inform them that their behavior is unwelcome, or otherwise seek to ensure that we act to exist in spaces devoid of anti-social behavior.

I've had this same exact scenario happen, and I simply spoke to the person and told them to lower the volume, use headphones, or stop altogether because they were scaring away the wildlife that I was there to see and photograph. They apologized, lowered the volume, and we both went back to doing our own thing. Most people are reasonable, and act in anti-social ways due to lack of awareness not malice. We are both sharing the trail, and we are both there to experience nature, and that very well might include many different modalities (including accompanying music), but if someone is acting in a way that completely prevents me from enjoying nature I definitely have the right to say something, to complain about it, and to complain about it after the fact, and "you do you" is not a valid argument in response to that.

[DoneWithAllThat]

This is probably the most perfect illustration of toxic empathy I have ever read.

[kelnos]

> How people spend their time outdoors is not up to you or I to decide.

Hiking trails and parks are public spaces, and we absolutely do get to decide how people spend their time there. I've seen parks and trails where the sign at the entrance/trailhead says no amplified music (among other restrictions). Selfish people of course ignore these signs and damage the experience for everyone around them.

[pkulak]

> How people spend their time outdoors is not up to you or I to decide.

Oh no, it absolutely is. Societies have laws, and even just social norms, that don't stop applying "outdoors". Unless you're in the ocean, I suppose.

Pack out what you pack in. Stay on the trail. No loudspeakers. Very simple.