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Debian's Challenge When Its Developers Drift Away

69 points| cuechan | 25 days ago |phoronix.com

23 comments

order

karteum|25 days ago

I am not native english so maybe it's just me, but I think the title is misleading because it suggests that Debian could be struggling with a situation where developers would massively drift away (my first reaction was "what ?? is there really a significant amount of devs that are leaving Debian now, and why ?"), while actually it's more a discussion on how to bring awareness to a team and encourage developers to better communicate with colleagues when they have a life change that would lower their commitment (which can happen to anyone, and in any project), so that the project can better handle when a developer "drifts away".

variaga|24 days ago

I am a native English speaker, and it's not just you.

csb6|24 days ago

It is a good way to see which commenters read the article instead of just the headline.

gg582|24 days ago

I believe the problem with Debian and many open source projects is that communities outside the US, Greater China, India, and some advanced European countries are relatively weak, making it difficult for project leader-level figures to emerge. I was born and raised in South Korea, a virtual open-source wasteland. Listening to testimonies from developers working here, many say, “I was captivated by the GNU spirit and wanted to contribute, but the Korean community's operations were poor, and clique-based territorialism was severe.” Ultimately, many open-source projects paradoxically miss out precisely because of their idealism and open management culture. I'd like to summarize it this way:

- Combining open source developers outside the core development regions and major cultural spheres could potentially secure roughly as many contributors as the entire US. - Funding shortages for non-profit foundations are deeply entrenched. Denying or attempting to fix this immediately becomes greed. - It is possible to manage language barriers, cultural barriers, and guidelines for distant countries without becoming a greedy for-profit entity. - This does not mean holding DebConf in every country. However, if the awareness is simply that ‘there used to be no borders, but now it's different from the 90s’ regarding the shortage of personnel, then improvements should be more proactive. - The 2020s are no longer an era of romanticism where one flies from Angola to Germany just for the sake of romance. - Especially as Debian has established itself as an invisible system, becoming the backbone of countless cloud services, there is less room for romanticism to intervene.

I've used Debian since 2015 and have had no complaints during that time. Korea also had ‘administrators’ who spared no expense on plane tickets for GNU since the 90s, but most have now stepped down due to age, or, exhausted from trying to salvage communities torn apart by toxic members, have turned around and declared ‘BSD was right’. However, the project's sustainability deteriorating due to a ‘lack of administrators’ is definitely something that needs to be considered. If sufficient people cannot be recruited, and given that we cannot extend the freeze cycle like Slackware at present, communication between upstream and downstream and the active recruitment of multinational developers are important to resolve the complaints of ‘dependent families’ like Ubuntu.

calmingsolitude|24 days ago

The challenge outlined by the article is the lack of communication regarding the change in availability of Debian volunteers themselves. TFA doesn't mention issues regarding recruitment of new developers.

massysett|24 days ago

Try making the term as a developer time limited, such as for a two-year period. The developer must actively renew the term. The point wouldn’t be to kick developers out after two years; there would be no limit on renewals and no requirement for approval. Rather, it makes the commitment a limited rather than unlimited one and forces the developer to periodically think: do I still want to do this? Then, passively taking no action causes the commitment to end, rather than the developer having to actively say “I don’t want to do this anymore.” This takes the shame out of it.

ksk23|23 days ago

Not too bad!

rurban|24 days ago

I once got rms himself reaching out to me, when my mails got stuck. Gmail probably dropping spam from unknown GNU accounts. That was quite a challenge! Hope it never happens to you.

MuffinFlavored|24 days ago

[deleted]

seanhunter|24 days ago

It’s two sentences for goodness sake. Why on earth should anyone spend their time reading your “thoughts” when you don’t think it’s worth spending your time to write them?

More substantively, I don’t believe it is true, but hypothetically why would “the real” problem be having 100 distros on distrowatch with little to choose between them? The benefit of open source for the individual is supposed to be the opportunity to learn by doing and to have the freedom to do things however you want, and the benefit to the community is this extreme Darwinian process where lots of crazy people try all sorts of things and the community as a whole picks results they like. All of these benefits arise precisely because there are a lot of projects, many of which don’t achieve mass adoption.

ThePowerOfFuet|24 days ago

>Letting Claude summarize my thoughts for me on this:

Please don't. If you want to contribute, contribute your own words.

calvinmorrison|24 days ago

Debian's Data Protection Team was established back in 2018 for dealing with European data protection legislation like the GDPR.

perhaps nobody would waste their life volunteering on such crockery. this is not a task for a developer but a mindless apparatchik

jonway|24 days ago

Hahaha

Dude I play eve online! We compete for these unpaid space jobs where you have to read reports and click a button on a website without even logging into the game.

Heck I play with at least one ports commit guy from a bsd

charcircuit|24 days ago

When Debian is making decisions to abandon social media accounts which give them reach outside of their own bubble from the 90s consisting of mailing lists and irc it is hard to see there be a sustainable future for the project.

notepad0x90|24 days ago

I'm confused, are you saying Debian shouldn't abandon social media accounts? Are there people following distros on social media to where it's that relevant?