There's a lot of great material in this post, but as a recent YC alum myself, I have a number of problems with it.
1) "If you’re writing your Y Comb application and it takes you less than a month of work, you’re not trying hard enough."
No. You should not be spending that much effort on your application to YC -- or any accelerator. Should you have a few people read it over? Yes. Should you spellcheck? Yes. But not much more than that. Focus on building your product and building your business.
2) "no one’s video is under a minute."
Ours was. 50 seconds, to be exact.
3) "But my point is, if your company and team is solid, than you will get in."
This is the most dangerous statement in the post. This is simply not the case. Every successful entrepreneur was told "no" and turned down time and time again on their path to greatness. Facebook got "no's" from VCs. Airbnb's founders were told they were crazy. Many people outright laughed at Elon Musk's dream to build rocket ships. SendGrid was rejected from YC. If you believe in your team, and you believe in your idea, trek on. The YC partners are some of the smartest people I've ever met, but they're not infallible.
YC has been absolutely amazing for my team and my company, and we're very grateful for having gone through the program. But we likely wouldn't have been accepted and wouldn't have benefitted so much from the program if we weren't focused intensely on what matters -- building our product, talking to our customers, and staying healthy. Apply, hope you get in, but if you don't, carry on.
As a data point, I was rejected by YC 3 times. Once after the interview, once at the application, and amusingly enough the first time we applied for the last batch. We got in after applying again late with LightTable.
There is certainly no guarantee that with a "solid" team you'll get in. At the end of the day, it's all a matter of serendipity.
Couldn't agree more on all counts. What works for one team will not always apply to another.
I started filling out our application 2 hours before the deadline, and I am a slow writer. It worked out for us, but I wouldn't recommend this approach. Correlation is not causation.
Best applications consistently keep the video under 1 minute. Given the culture of conciseness in YC I wouldn't recommend intentionally going longer.
Surprisingly, I agree with my co-founder. "Hacking" the yc application process implies that the poster was able to put much less work into the application than others did through cleverness on the poster's part. The post sounds like he thoughtfully filled out the application in a way that highlighted his strengths and minimized his weaknesses, as everyone else does. He also put a lot more work and thought into it than we, and the other yc founders that I know, did.
Instead of building that application for a whole month, he should have been building his product and landing customers.
For #1, I know many YC founders who have gotten in just using half or day or so for the application (usually defying the deadline). We used only one Sunday afternoon for ours on the second run when we got in and I don't see the point of wasting time except getting few rounds of feedback and spellcheck.
Interestingly enough also many alumnus I know thought they failed the interview once walking out of the room. I sure did.
Edit: With the second comment I was referring to section "Once we got the Interview, we knew we were in"
I don't comment a lot here, but I did want to come on and make the same point, but you beat me to it Seth. The truth is that we had a quick write up. Our video actually took more than a couple takes because we didn't rehearse or script it and someone would say something silly and we would all laugh. The best way to get in is to have a strong team and understand your product and market. Building your company is the best way to understand your product and market. For the interview I would definitely recommend being rejected as much as possible before the interview so you can quickly and confidently answer any questions or concerns someone can come up with in a 10 minute span. You will find that getting rejected is pretty easy to do. It's just like with women (or men), if put yourself out there, you will get rejected. How you learn from the rejection and better yourself is important.
A month is not 730.484 hours on your application, it's spending a lot of time thinking and musing about your application and your business.
Our application process helped hone and focus our business in ways that nothing else has. I would argue that working hard on your YC application is working hard on your company.
As you've pointed out twice (#2,#3), there are always exceptions to rules.
If a company does not make it past a YC interview, then there was something that YC didn't like... it can only help that company to try to extract that issue and deal with it early on.
Hi sethbannon, idbknox, gleb, and lloydarmbrust, would it be ok to ask you guys for feedback on my YC app? I wanted to check with you first before I start spamming your inboxes :)
I live in Silicon Valley so everyone here is either going YC crazy right now, or absolutely clueless. It would be awesome to get feedback from someone objective but experienced.
I apologize if this wasn't the right place to ask, but with 4 YC alums in the same thread I had to give it a shot!
I went back and looked at their application to see what we liked about it. What we liked is that they really understood their domain. This was not random undergrads making up some idea about social shopping. These people clearly understood local newspapers.
Out of curiousity, do you find that a lot of people applying under RFS don't understand their domain? It seems to me that a lot of those things are things that are both clearly broken, and not yet fixed, which means you get a lot of people from the sidelines saying "Oh all you need to do to fix that is ..." not knowing that the exact thing has been tried and failed dozens of times.
Looks like they put a lot of effort in here and are excited about what they're doing. Congrats.
But, as an aside, can we please kill the abusage of the word "hacked" because, as far as I can tell, it's being used as a synonym for "did a lot of research and spent a bunch of time on".
Having deep industry knowledge, a product with paying customers and spending a lot of time preparing the application and video is not "hacking" the application process.
I typically think of the term in the way it's used in the question "Please tell us about the time you most successfully hacked some (non-computer) system to your advantage." I.e. something like finding a loophole.
It's too bad, this diverts the discussion on that post around the use of the word, whereas there is some good stuff in there.
I'm not sure if this is something good to admit or not, but I only spent about 2 hours writing my YC application, and we spent about 15 minutes planning and filming the video, no editing. The video got 2 views. We got asked to do an interview.
Seems like every "YC Application Advice" blog is about spending hundreds of hours doing an APPLICATION. To me this sounds absurd. If you're really using the time to figure out the direction you want to head, or where your product focus is, then fine. But then it's not really for your YC application, its for your company.
In the end we didn't get in. We didn't have a sound business strategy; our focus was on the product. Nieve, yes, but lesson learned. It was one hell of an experience.
Because when you start a company, everything is against you. Being a YC company, for the knowledge base and the connections, removes a lot of barriers and opens a lot of doors.
Plus, being two guys from the Midwest, we really didn't know what we were doing. After YC, our path was much clearer.
I'm 29. Since I finished my undergrad I've gone to grad school, done work for huge companies, small companies, universities, and worked at a startup. I think all of these first hand experiences will prove to be very valuable in my future entrepreneurial endeavors. As always, YMMV.
Yeah, I found the phrase "we were both pretty old (27)" to be equal parts amusing and depressing. Sort of like when an intern in the office (after a few beers) told us he was dreading the day that he turned 20. That got a lot of chuckles from those of us with a few grey hairs.
"Besides, getting in Y Combinator is easy: just be wicked smart, create a beautiful product, get millions of users, and build a revenue stream that grows 20% each month."
If your company's revenue stream is growing 20% each month on the backs of millions of users, why are you applying to Y-Combinator?
Insightful article that would have benefited from a less sensationalist headline. "Hacking the Y Combinator Application Process" makes a promise that you fail to deliver on.
To be fair, I said "How We..." Did it. Also, I made sure to clarify the point of the post with the beginning disclaimer.
Apologies if you felt mislead. LMK a better title and ill change it. Also, I hope there's plenty of stuff in there that demonstrates how to write a good application.
I can't imagine spending over a month writing your YC application is something PG would recommend, but I do love the idea of having a few random people explain your application back to you. That's great advice about being sure you're writing is clear in general.
I can't imagine "we're already making money" and the fact that you were doing it monetization journalism (an RFS and a tough one) didn't help you get in more than the clarity of your application though. That seems to be a proof point beyond anything you could have written, to me.
This is a good read. You really know what you want, and what to do. Concrete plan. Midwest is still in the US right. It's funny, I just read earlier here in YC an accepted application but failed in the interview.
This is a good example of a YC application but I'm more intrigue with applications outside America, or in Asia. And dealing with what you said as language barriers, culture differences, and also the visa problem.
I found this useful. Even if the terms are being abused, it always helps to have others perspectives on how they succeeded. Regardless if it doesn't apply to your system/experience, it is still a valid (and successful) method of getting in. Do you need to work for 1 month to submit the YC application? Nope. Did it work for them: Yep. So, as with anything, YMMV but getting as many different perspectives as possible can only help.
Hack a bootstrap to get kickstarted.
[+] [-] sethbannon|13 years ago|reply
1) "If you’re writing your Y Comb application and it takes you less than a month of work, you’re not trying hard enough."
No. You should not be spending that much effort on your application to YC -- or any accelerator. Should you have a few people read it over? Yes. Should you spellcheck? Yes. But not much more than that. Focus on building your product and building your business.
2) "no one’s video is under a minute."
Ours was. 50 seconds, to be exact.
3) "But my point is, if your company and team is solid, than you will get in."
This is the most dangerous statement in the post. This is simply not the case. Every successful entrepreneur was told "no" and turned down time and time again on their path to greatness. Facebook got "no's" from VCs. Airbnb's founders were told they were crazy. Many people outright laughed at Elon Musk's dream to build rocket ships. SendGrid was rejected from YC. If you believe in your team, and you believe in your idea, trek on. The YC partners are some of the smartest people I've ever met, but they're not infallible.
YC has been absolutely amazing for my team and my company, and we're very grateful for having gone through the program. But we likely wouldn't have been accepted and wouldn't have benefitted so much from the program if we weren't focused intensely on what matters -- building our product, talking to our customers, and staying healthy. Apply, hope you get in, but if you don't, carry on.
[+] [-] ibdknox|13 years ago|reply
There is certainly no guarantee that with a "solid" team you'll get in. At the end of the day, it's all a matter of serendipity.
[+] [-] gleb|13 years ago|reply
I started filling out our application 2 hours before the deadline, and I am a slow writer. It worked out for us, but I wouldn't recommend this approach. Correlation is not causation.
Best applications consistently keep the video under 1 minute. Given the culture of conciseness in YC I wouldn't recommend intentionally going longer.
[+] [-] zonotope|13 years ago|reply
Instead of building that application for a whole month, he should have been building his product and landing customers.
[+] [-] jorde|13 years ago|reply
Interestingly enough also many alumnus I know thought they failed the interview once walking out of the room. I sure did.
Edit: With the second comment I was referring to section "Once we got the Interview, we knew we were in"
[+] [-] dsugarman|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lloydarmbrust|13 years ago|reply
Our application process helped hone and focus our business in ways that nothing else has. I would argue that working hard on your YC application is working hard on your company.
As you've pointed out twice (#2,#3), there are always exceptions to rules.
If a company does not make it past a YC interview, then there was something that YC didn't like... it can only help that company to try to extract that issue and deal with it early on.
[+] [-] viviantan|13 years ago|reply
I live in Silicon Valley so everyone here is either going YC crazy right now, or absolutely clueless. It would be awesome to get feedback from someone objective but experienced.
I apologize if this wasn't the right place to ask, but with 4 YC alums in the same thread I had to give it a shot!
Thank you in advance.
[+] [-] pg|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] aidenn0|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] cletus|13 years ago|reply
But, as an aside, can we please kill the abusage of the word "hacked" because, as far as I can tell, it's being used as a synonym for "did a lot of research and spent a bunch of time on".
[+] [-] Timothee|13 years ago|reply
I typically think of the term in the way it's used in the question "Please tell us about the time you most successfully hacked some (non-computer) system to your advantage." I.e. something like finding a loophole.
It's too bad, this diverts the discussion on that post around the use of the word, whereas there is some good stuff in there.
[+] [-] amirmc|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] CaveTech|13 years ago|reply
Seems like every "YC Application Advice" blog is about spending hundreds of hours doing an APPLICATION. To me this sounds absurd. If you're really using the time to figure out the direction you want to head, or where your product focus is, then fine. But then it's not really for your YC application, its for your company.
In the end we didn't get in. We didn't have a sound business strategy; our focus was on the product. Nieve, yes, but lesson learned. It was one hell of an experience.
[+] [-] Alex3917|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] phillco|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] amirmc|13 years ago|reply
[1] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4695587
[+] [-] polyfractal|13 years ago|reply
Unrelated, I like your "Tweet this quote" sidebars...clever idea. :)
[+] [-] lloydarmbrust|13 years ago|reply
Plus, being two guys from the Midwest, we really didn't know what we were doing. After YC, our path was much clearer.
[+] [-] dbecker|13 years ago|reply
I hope you don't actually believe that... if you do, start-up groupthink is definitely getting to you.
[+] [-] padobson|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Torrents|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dorkrawk|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] CaveTech|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] biot|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jsiarto|13 years ago|reply
If your company's revenue stream is growing 20% each month on the backs of millions of users, why are you applying to Y-Combinator?
[+] [-] IsaacL|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hafabnew|13 years ago|reply
But then again, the title got you on the frontpage of HN, which was almost certainly the goal.
[+] [-] rolux|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lloydarmbrust|13 years ago|reply
Apologies if you felt mislead. LMK a better title and ill change it. Also, I hope there's plenty of stuff in there that demonstrates how to write a good application.
[+] [-] mddw|13 years ago|reply
Please please stop using them for anything.
[+] [-] timpeterson|13 years ago|reply
lame.
[+] [-] tomasien|13 years ago|reply
I can't imagine "we're already making money" and the fact that you were doing it monetization journalism (an RFS and a tough one) didn't help you get in more than the clarity of your application though. That seems to be a proof point beyond anything you could have written, to me.
[+] [-] beebs93|13 years ago|reply
"...we basically don’t have an accent..."
You do. It's called "American". :P
[+] [-] icewater|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] MojoJolo|13 years ago|reply
This is a good example of a YC application but I'm more intrigue with applications outside America, or in Asia. And dealing with what you said as language barriers, culture differences, and also the visa problem.
[+] [-] evmar|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lloydarmbrust|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] johncoogan|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lloydarmbrust|13 years ago|reply
[+] [-] omnisci|13 years ago|reply