I worked there a long time ago. Indian VPs were taking kickbacks from consulting firms to hire their devs, it was an open secret. Whole divisions of the company are 95% Indian.
I wont expose the group here, but there's a broad network of technology directors from Amex, that have all been hiring and promoting eachother for 20 years. Very tight nit networks of nepotism, in some cases, brother and sister working together
All that really matters is the Amex brand, and so all the tech was considered back office, and unimportant.
Also, once a company enters some kind of monopoly status, very little matters in the quality of their product.
Amex has less than 10% worldwide market share and is a distant 4th behimd unionpay, visa, mc. I don't see the monopoly here.
I have to say I was relieved when my Amex card issuer switched to visa because owning an Amex is a pita. I think they build their business on various rewards programs, the brand itself is garbage in my eyes.
This happened to the company I worked for also. Blatant corruption. One Indian guy gets appointed to VP, then almost immediately all their reporting chain is Indian. Managers are told they can only hire from some obscure Indian staffing company (that the VP has a stake in or gets bribed to use). Quality is garbage cause no self respecting Indian dev would work for them.
Zero pushback from exec level, zero acknowledgment even though it's obvious. Very deflating for employees.
The two American political parties are so perfectly shielded by their own ideological blinders to avoid any possibility of national protectionism against offshoring and outsourcing that I don't think there will ever be any kind of movement against this.
The conservative base is unfriendly to foreigners and foreign cultures, and claims to prefer American-made goods and services, but will immediately guillotine any internal party member who causes consumer prices to raise substantially--which they would have to do in order to support American workers creating products rather than our offshored counterparts. And the business owners and shareholders who love to outsource generally aren't true blue voters.
The liberal base is in theory pro-union and pro-worker, but will immediately guillotine any internal party member who suggests economic discrimination in favor of native-born industries and workers.
In my opinion, it's because the two party divide has reached the point of extremism on both sides, and extremists act on emotion rather than logic or reason. Up until a couple of decades ago, they both did a good job of keeping their more extreme members out of sight and mind. Now they're embracing and amplifying them.
> The conservative base is unfriendly to foreigners and foreign cultures, and claims to prefer American-made goods and services, but will immediately guillotine any internal party member who causes consumer prices to raise substantially--which they would have to do in order to support American workers creating products rather than our offshored counterparts.
Currently, the head of the party is raising and lowering tariffs at will, so I don't quite think this holds anymore.
I really find the state of American (but not only) politics dreadful where everything is seen under the lenses of conservatives vs liberals.
Most people I know, everywhere in the world have mixed views on most topics.
Let alone the fact that ideologies tend to change, modern rights are way more populist and economically-socialist than they were 2 decades ago. See Poland, Hungary, Italy, etc, where governments make money fall on the poorest, on the elderly, etc ignoring their historical electorate (middle class).
liberal base is in theory pro-union and pro-worker, but will immediately guillotine any internal party member who suggests economic discrimination in favor of native-born industries and workers.
Well, yes, because discrimination on the basis of where someone was born is illegal. The American liberal base is, and has always been, fine with economic discrimination in favor of those in America (without regard to where they were born or their residency status).
Protectionism may work in some cases, but even when it works, it works by making things more expensive. People don't buy American cars because it's cheaper to make similar cars in Mexico. Fine, so let's force companies to make cars in America. It's now more expensive (otherwise we won't be importing from Mexico in the first place).
You add more and more protectionism, it may get some jobs back, but the price is that things get more and more expensive. And not by a few percent, more like by 50% or more. (Just think of how much money an American worker needs to have an ordinary middle-class life compared to a Mexican worker.)
Now consider how much people were angry over the Covid-era inflation and how it was a major factor in Trump coming back (and looks like it's going to be a major factor in Republicans losing the mid-term election this year). Nobody wants prices to go up. Americans say they want protectionism but what they want is a fairy tale protectionism where jobs comes back but prices magically stay stable. It cannot happen, and if the choice is between some other group of Americans in Michigan getting better jobs and you getting your SUV at a "reasonable" price, people will choose the latter. (I'm not digging at Americans - the same is going to happen everywhere.)
It's basically "It's extremely hard to defeat capitalism at its own game." Nobody likes capitalism, but that doesn't mean you'll get popular by defying capitalism.
Let this be a lesson. If you're dumb enough to say "how high?" when they ask you to jump, you will always get steamrolled. Always!
This poor fellow talks about what happened to him as if it's something new. This form of outsourcing has been exploited ever since the internet became fast enough!
If anything, it's possible that AI will result in all those Indian offices being shut down.
Don't work harder than your boss. Find a leader who is worth following.
If this was about a useful part of the economy rather than financialized credit access, I would care. Paying 10x to US residents to provide a better Amex experience really doesn’t incentivize anything that is long term useful. Now when materials scientists and skilled scientific technicians are fired from US based jobs, well that is a problem. The economy in the US has fallen prey to the demands of irreality based capital which is seeking, not profit, not good products and healthy trade, but seeking to extract capital and to erect legislative barriers to Adam Smith style competition (between innovative small businesses striving to find an innovative way to push product utility up a bit). If you can’t brag about the good your job is doing for people, life, or history, try again.
Credit cards alter the power dynamic between customer and merchant, especially in a world where so much commerce is remote. I appreciate protection against fraudulent merchant activity, as well as the ease of use relative to alternatives (who likes carrying cash or a checkbook?). Not having to pay for a month is nice but not the reason I use credit cards.
Between AI and outsourcing, desk jobs in the US can risk disappearing altogether. Do not count on them, and do not expect you to be owed anything. Go in every day knowing that day can be your last day there, and you will be at peace. Find your own alternate paths.
That pretty much describes Indian work culture/ethic. Let's say "aggressive" work hours, and you just let your manager claim whatever he wants and agree with it, against everyone. "Yes", "Yes, sir".
And then, yeah, when the time comes that the work needs to be delivered, odds of it actually being done, let's say 50/50 at best.
Does your manager even want to know the truth? Mine does, but that's only the case because I changed managers 4 times before I found one that I can reasonably believe tells the truth to his superiors.
The Indian manager has the power to fire that employee, finding another job is difficult, so from the employee's perspective it's safe to just say yes.
Is amex still alive? The worst company I dealt with - both professionally for data integration and personally took me a year to make them fix their own mistakes and close my accounts.
llmslave|13 days ago
I wont expose the group here, but there's a broad network of technology directors from Amex, that have all been hiring and promoting eachother for 20 years. Very tight nit networks of nepotism, in some cases, brother and sister working together
All that really matters is the Amex brand, and so all the tech was considered back office, and unimportant.
Also, once a company enters some kind of monopoly status, very little matters in the quality of their product.
bagacrap|13 days ago
I have to say I was relieved when my Amex card issuer switched to visa because owning an Amex is a pita. I think they build their business on various rewards programs, the brand itself is garbage in my eyes.
jst1fthsdys|13 days ago
Zero pushback from exec level, zero acknowledgment even though it's obvious. Very deflating for employees.
quacked|13 days ago
The conservative base is unfriendly to foreigners and foreign cultures, and claims to prefer American-made goods and services, but will immediately guillotine any internal party member who causes consumer prices to raise substantially--which they would have to do in order to support American workers creating products rather than our offshored counterparts. And the business owners and shareholders who love to outsource generally aren't true blue voters.
The liberal base is in theory pro-union and pro-worker, but will immediately guillotine any internal party member who suggests economic discrimination in favor of native-born industries and workers.
stronglikedan|13 days ago
lenerdenator|13 days ago
Currently, the head of the party is raising and lowering tariffs at will, so I don't quite think this holds anymore.
epolanski|13 days ago
Most people I know, everywhere in the world have mixed views on most topics.
Let alone the fact that ideologies tend to change, modern rights are way more populist and economically-socialist than they were 2 decades ago. See Poland, Hungary, Italy, etc, where governments make money fall on the poorest, on the elderly, etc ignoring their historical electorate (middle class).
gamblor956|13 days ago
Well, yes, because discrimination on the basis of where someone was born is illegal. The American liberal base is, and has always been, fine with economic discrimination in favor of those in America (without regard to where they were born or their residency status).
yongjik|13 days ago
You add more and more protectionism, it may get some jobs back, but the price is that things get more and more expensive. And not by a few percent, more like by 50% or more. (Just think of how much money an American worker needs to have an ordinary middle-class life compared to a Mexican worker.)
Now consider how much people were angry over the Covid-era inflation and how it was a major factor in Trump coming back (and looks like it's going to be a major factor in Republicans losing the mid-term election this year). Nobody wants prices to go up. Americans say they want protectionism but what they want is a fairy tale protectionism where jobs comes back but prices magically stay stable. It cannot happen, and if the choice is between some other group of Americans in Michigan getting better jobs and you getting your SUV at a "reasonable" price, people will choose the latter. (I'm not digging at Americans - the same is going to happen everywhere.)
It's basically "It's extremely hard to defeat capitalism at its own game." Nobody likes capitalism, but that doesn't mean you'll get popular by defying capitalism.
rayiner|13 days ago
unknown|13 days ago
[deleted]
givemeethekeys|13 days ago
This poor fellow talks about what happened to him as if it's something new. This form of outsourcing has been exploited ever since the internet became fast enough!
If anything, it's possible that AI will result in all those Indian offices being shut down.
Don't work harder than your boss. Find a leader who is worth following.
lanstin|13 days ago
bagacrap|13 days ago
unknown|13 days ago
[deleted]
OutOfHere|13 days ago
cmxch|13 days ago
silexia|12 days ago
bigyabai|12 days ago
josefritzishere|13 days ago
missedthecue|13 days ago
functionmouse|13 days ago
only-one1701|13 days ago
spwa4|13 days ago
And then, yeah, when the time comes that the work needs to be delivered, odds of it actually being done, let's say 50/50 at best.
Does your manager even want to know the truth? Mine does, but that's only the case because I changed managers 4 times before I found one that I can reasonably believe tells the truth to his superiors.
sumedh|12 days ago
The Indian manager has the power to fire that employee, finding another job is difficult, so from the employee's perspective it's safe to just say yes.
epolanski|13 days ago
Obviously, time and time again has proven that outsourcing is not always more efficient.
sumedh|12 days ago
recursivedoubts|13 days ago
throwaway920102|13 days ago
[deleted]
OutOfHere|13 days ago
The way I think about it is that if they don't want to hire me, it means I am not offering them enough value to bypass any bias.
unknown|13 days ago
[deleted]
democracy|13 days ago