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tim-tday | 6 hours ago

We thought betting markets would bring out our best predictions. Instead they’re exposing our inherent corruption.

discuss

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dylan604|6 hours ago

Who thought this? Be careful with your wild use of we here. I'm not part of your we. Opening betting markets has only one ultimate ending where everything is done for the betting.

avaer|5 hours ago

Prediction was certainly the pitch. I don't know how many people genuinely believed it, beyond the level required to extract a profit.

It's hard to measure what anyone actually believes in the current social landscape, where nobody tells the truth. Maybe that's the real purpose of prediction markets.

cortesoft|5 hours ago

The traditional espoused financial market purpose of these prediction markets is based on the premise that actors on it will have inside information.

The point is for business with vested interests (and therefore often inside information) to use these markets to hedge for things that will materially affect their profitability.

For example, in this case, suppose you ran a company that was shipping goods through the Middle East, and a war would disrupt your business. You would then place bets on there being a war, so that if it does happen you will recover some of your losses. You might know inside information because your work in the region, but that is expected.

markus_zhang|6 hours ago

Insider gambling has been common since the invention of gambling I think.

estearum|6 hours ago

Most gambling "games" are quite a lot harder to acquire and use insider knowledge on though.

People don't play in corrupt markets for very long.

nkrisc|6 hours ago

Did anyone really think that? The corruption is inherently far, far easier than accurate predictions.

blazespin|5 hours ago

Yeah, trying to beat the market on actually predicting will get you pretty lame returns. Probably do better in non zero sum games like the stock market. At least there you get the benefit of the market always going up eventually.

No, the best way to win on Polymarket is purely by insider trading. Which is why it's a useful thing to watch. Insider news..

That said, the definition of 'insider trading' is always tricky. At what point does it become insider? Some things people call insider others just call clever detective work.

hn_throwaway_99|6 hours ago

Only for very narrow definitions of "we".

I think it's pretty obvious when betting on events that are inherently just decisions by one or a few people (e.g. when will Trump launch an attack on Iran, when will a company launch a new product, will some company acquire another one, etc.) that they will attract insider trading and corruption by their very nature - all that's necessary is to have information about the decision maker. This is fundamentally different than events that are subject to forces that no single individual controls - e.g. who will win an election, where will a crypto price be in a year, movie box office results, etc.

I think betting on "single decision maker" events is just a "sucker is born every minute"-type bet.

softwaredoug|5 hours ago

They actually encourage insider trading as to influence the prediction and make it more accurate.

Some insider selling changes the prediction downwards

The WANT the information

bawolff|5 hours ago

Those aren't mutually exclusive. The best predictions are going to be those based on non public information.

ekjhgkejhgk|5 hours ago

The best predictions are made when you already know the answer.

livestories|5 hours ago

And even better when others wrongfully think they know a better answer...

seydor|6 hours ago

We knew that already from every betting market in the history of betting markets

yieldcrv|6 hours ago

This is exactly what I wanted prediction markets for

Looks like “we” need to update our relationships with markets

Price discovery is a visualization of the collective conscious, and the evolution of markets gets closer and closer to direct exposure to an event. Share and derisk a transaction, cleanly, quickly

Reduce all frictions towards doing so

Frictions include finding the person making the transaction, negotiating with them, trusting them to perform, disputing resolution, insurance. These hamper anything from occurring, or occurring quickly, and the pricing is too variable. Prediction markets are an example of all of those frictions being reduced to almost non-existent. And dispute resolution will improve further and attract more liquidity.

streetfighter64|4 hours ago

They certainly could reduce friction in bribery, just make a public bet like "The court will decide in favor of XYZ Evil Corp v. United States", then buy "No" shares for a million dollars, and hope the judge in the case picks up a bunch of "Yes" shares. Quick, simple, effective bribery via cryptocurrencies.

watwut|5 hours ago

I definitely never thought so. It seemed primary as an unregulated casino to me - which usually implies criminality and frauds.

I dont think I was special or unusual.

dylan604|3 hours ago

People have been saying the same about crypto in general, yet, here we are. Another level of the scam built on top of a scam.

bdangubic|5 hours ago

if it is not regulated, you can always safely assume that it is a scam / corruption :) almost universally applicable

deadbabe|6 hours ago

Isn't exposing corruption a good thing? If betting markets are giving the masses access to knowledge about events that would normally be restricted from them, what is wrong with that? Information wants to be free. You can make use of metrics from betting markets without actively participating in them.

alephnerd|6 hours ago

Anyone who's followed the news since the 2000s would have realized a strike on Iran would have happened around now.

Notice how the bettor hedged and bet on multiple days and hedged each of their bets with a "by" clause. This is a bog standard hedging strategy that anyone who's been to a racetrack would know.

On a separate note, gamified prediction markets should not exist - they create perverse incentives and are basically a gamification of futures contracts (which requires a degree of risk management and hedging experience the median individual simply lacks), but this specific example doesn't seem like insider trading, just a seasoned gambler who knows basic hedging strategy.

dylan604|6 hours ago

> this specific example doesn't seem like insider trading, just a seasoned gambler who knows basic hedging strategy.

why can't it be both? you think degenerate gamblers have never had a government job?

csense|6 hours ago

> prediction markets should not exist

If you don't like prediction markets, you don't have to use them.

Why do you think other people shouldn't be allowed to use prediction markets if they want to?

yieldcrv|6 hours ago

No they were not hedging they were seeking liquidity because they couldnt get a total fill and ROI in the lowest probability market