Some context: Rob Ford is the mayor of Toronto, the most populous city in Canada. This is the newest of numerous controversies during his time in office.
Edit: it's also worth noting that Mayor Ford's relationship with the media has been... colorful. Some funny cases include him calling 80% of journalists "maggots" (1) and lying about a drunken outburst back in 2006 (2).
More than that, his brother (Doug Ford - also a counselor) is being accused of being a high level hashish dealer in the 80s. 2 of his staffers have now quit, and one was fired for apparently telling him to go to rehab. He's been told that he's no longer wanted as a volunteer high school football coach. Also has been kicked out of a hockey game for being too intoxicated and was arrested for dui & possession of marijuana in florida before he became mayor. It's a circus.
Also he was almost kicked out of office at Christmas time this year for voting on something in which he had a vested interest.
The fact that this is getting such widespread attention is making Toronto look like a farce, and as someone from there, it really upsets me. Now when I tell people I'm from Toronto, it will be, "Oh, that's the city with the crack smoking mayor right?"
Really unfortunate and despicable. Cannot believe we voted this idiot into office.
Obviously a lot of you guys don't like Mr. Ford and he doesn't sound like a decent person, but why is this on HN? I fail to see how this relates to tech or entrepreneurship.
This is, to my knowledge, the first time a crowdfunding platform has been used as a way to raise money in an attempt to buy a video of alleged misconduct by a politician from a drug cartel.
This political story is at the top of HN despite the guidelines for the same reason that your remarks are at the top of the comments... despite the guidelines urging us not to comment on why something doesn't belong on HN.
Despite what others may say, on balance, there really isn't a good reason for this to be on top of HN.
Also, it's important to recognize that the fundraisers have lost contact with those in custody of the video. It's likely that we may never see that video and, rather than contributing to original intent of the fundraiser, the donations will instead go to fund Gawker's arbitrarily chosen charity. Crowdfunding's double-edged sword strikes again.
I'm from Toronto and have been following this story closely. But even I am surprised to see this at the top of HN... You know, it only take a small amount of votes in a short period to get to the top...
True true. But, while we're at it, can we stop posting articles about how higher education sucks, and how veiled libertarian ideals rule? Politics belong somewhere else, or, there's simply no membrane careful enough to prevent this.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that it's here because a large majority of HN users voted it here... because they found it to be of interest... Just guessing...
I posted it because of the implications for crowdfunding. I've never seen anything like this before and it's extremely interesting to me and I work in the tech industry.
I'm a Torontonian, and definitely not a fan of Rob Ford, but somehow it feels like there is an ongoing, organized effort to get him out of the office and out of politics (whether by the opposing parties, or some other organization). Sometimes he really doesn't help the issue by somehow managing to charge head first into even more trouble, but the string of various things he's been charged/accused of can't be coincidental.
Now there's a video of him smoking crack (which it looks like nobody will see, but trust us - it's there!), then there are some anonymous drug dealers who swear that Rob's brother Doug was a major drug-lord back in the day (which for some reason, just surfaces now).
I don't know... it's all a bit convenient and yet ethereal.
It is not an understatement to say he is easily the worst mayor the city has ever seen, and further, that he's embroiled in a number of scandals, any one of which could take him down.
He's made a lot of enemies, especially within the press. Although he was treated fairly at first, given the benefit of the doubt, any free passes he's had have long since been used up. Every little thing he does from this point forward is going to be questioned and scrutinized endlessly.
Remember he just spent the last half year stumping for a casino nobody wanted based on expectations that were sky-high. The amount of money he thought was fair was orders of magnitude more than usually given to a casino. This comes after the effort to derail a transit plan with $1.3B in funding, and a decade-long effort to rehabilitate the port-lands.
He deserves every single bit of negative publicity he gets.
This might be a case where there actually should be an organized, ongoing campaign to get this man out of politics. Clearly this is not a man who should be in a leadership position.
He fired his chief of staff last week for telling him to go to rehab. This is according to the Sun which, as newspapers go, has been his cheerleader for the past ten years.
So you can't claim there's no substance to the drug allegations when his highest ranking staff-member is advising him to get help.
"... Sometimes he really doesn't help the issue by somehow managing to charge head first into even more trouble..." or a camera! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj8haZzvaE8)
> UPDATE-- MAY 27, 2013, 9:46 AM EASTERN EDT: We have had no further contact with the people we believe to have custody of this video since the last update.
IMPORTANT UPDATE: Our confidence that we can consummate this transaction has diminished.
It seems likely to me that other members in their gang or community must have taken care of these guys by now. Who would buy drugs from anyone associated with these guys after such a major leak of personal information? The "Somali" brand has undoubtedly taken a huge hit now that its clear that, like so many young operations experiencing growth, they didnt take security seriously enough from the start.
The guys at the top must be in full damage-control mode, because they're going to lose a magnitude more revenue than a measly $200k. I don't know who their competition is, but there's a big opening for a mid-sized crack dealer to rapidly expand their marketshare if they can convince their customers that they take the security of their personal information seriously.
As for the guys with the video, think what happened to David Barksdale
...but cross it with what happened to D'Angelo Barksdale.
It's so ironic and weird that Gawker was involved in poisoning David Barksdale's employment opportunities, and is also involved in the Rob Ford case, while still living under the shadow of the millions of passwords they leaked last year.
Perhaps the drug dealers got smart, "hey, if we hand over the video showing Ford smoking the crack we sold him, doesn't that prove we are drug dealers? damn mo-fo, we outta here!"
Well I had actually wondered as well about the simple logistics of accepting a $200k payment.
Clearly Gawker would need some kind of paper trail before making that payment, not just for tax purposes but simply because I'm pretty sure there are laws that govern transfers that large..
So the recipient would have to declare that income at tax time (and possibly even file paperwork on receipt) to at the very least pay taxes on it, which would put them on the government's radar, which is something they may want less than they would want $200k..
This somewhat off topic, but I just got back from Toronto last week. Great city. It has been 20 years since I've been up there and a lot has changed.
There are concerns about the development that is going on, but seeing new urban housing going up is refreshing compared with many US cities which effectively have no growth policies.
Based on the number of units that seemed ready to hit the market, I suspect Toronto could see significantly lower housing prices in the future. I just hope it doesn't end in financial ruin for the banks.
You know, I had been previously thinking about crowdfunding competitors to Kickstarter. Like Google, that company has pretty much cornered the market in mindshare to the point that kickstarting is synonymous with crowdfunding. Good on Indiegogo, the West Coast/Silicon Valley alternative, for establishing itself with this, I guess.
IndieGoGo has nothing to do with this, aside from it being on their site. It's a poorly written headline. If anything it should say 'Gawker fund raises enough money...'
But yes, i'm very happy to see others succeeding at crowdfunding outside of KickStarter, and I firmly believe those with large followings don't even need to be using an outside source, but could be doing it on their own websites.
This isn't exactly great attention for Indiegogo. With the most recent update that "Our confidence that we can consummate this transaction has diminished." this only serves to make the Kickstarter model of filtering submissions look even better.
Is anyone else bothered by the fact that if the [Insert Kickstarter project here] doesn't materialize there are few things holding the founder/creator accountable?
In this case, if they don't obtain the video they are simply going to donate $200k to a charity that they will "figure out what that is later if it comes to it."
Weren't they originally claiming that his drug dealers shot the video? If so, isn't it actually more harmful to society to give a bunch of crack dealers $200,000 than it is for the mayor of Toronto to smoke crack?
Compare who has more influence and therefore potential for harming the public - two dealers with $200k or a crackhead mayor of a city with 2.6M inhabitants.
Interestingly, another candidate (George Smitherman) who ran against Ford for the 2010 municipal election in Toronto admitted to being addicted to "an illegal drug" before running for political office.
I wasn't living in Toronto when the election was going on so I didn't really pay attention to the media re: the election, but I wonder how they portrayed him at the time
[+] [-] iharris|12 years ago|reply
Edit: it's also worth noting that Mayor Ford's relationship with the media has been... colorful. Some funny cases include him calling 80% of journalists "maggots" (1) and lying about a drunken outburst back in 2006 (2).
(1) http://read.thestar.com/#!/article/51a27b477b1eacc589c3f4ae-...
(2) http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/story/2006/05/03/tor-f...
[+] [-] soperj|12 years ago|reply
Also he was almost kicked out of office at Christmas time this year for voting on something in which he had a vested interest.
[+] [-] HorizonXP|12 years ago|reply
Really unfortunate and despicable. Cannot believe we voted this idiot into office.
[+] [-] afterburner|12 years ago|reply
http://torontoist.com/2012/12/2012-villain-rob-ford/
[+] [-] muratmutlu|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] CoachRufus87|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] weisser|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] raganwald|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Tyrannosaurs|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] eli|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tsurantino|12 years ago|reply
Also, it's important to recognize that the fundraisers have lost contact with those in custody of the video. It's likely that we may never see that video and, rather than contributing to original intent of the fundraiser, the donations will instead go to fund Gawker's arbitrarily chosen charity. Crowdfunding's double-edged sword strikes again.
[+] [-] unreal37|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] soperj|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] quinndupont|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shocks|12 years ago|reply
I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that it's here because a large majority of HN users voted it here... because they found it to be of interest... Just guessing...
[+] [-] muratmutlu|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] TruthElixirX|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mladenkovacevic|12 years ago|reply
Now there's a video of him smoking crack (which it looks like nobody will see, but trust us - it's there!), then there are some anonymous drug dealers who swear that Rob's brother Doug was a major drug-lord back in the day (which for some reason, just surfaces now).
I don't know... it's all a bit convenient and yet ethereal.
[+] [-] astrodust|12 years ago|reply
He's made a lot of enemies, especially within the press. Although he was treated fairly at first, given the benefit of the doubt, any free passes he's had have long since been used up. Every little thing he does from this point forward is going to be questioned and scrutinized endlessly.
Remember he just spent the last half year stumping for a casino nobody wanted based on expectations that were sky-high. The amount of money he thought was fair was orders of magnitude more than usually given to a casino. This comes after the effort to derail a transit plan with $1.3B in funding, and a decade-long effort to rehabilitate the port-lands.
He deserves every single bit of negative publicity he gets.
[+] [-] noonespecial|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] themstheones|12 years ago|reply
So you can't claim there's no substance to the drug allegations when his highest ranking staff-member is advising him to get help.
[+] [-] platonichvn|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] dmix|12 years ago|reply
> UPDATE-- MAY 27, 2013, 9:46 AM EASTERN EDT: We have had no further contact with the people we believe to have custody of this video since the last update.
IMPORTANT UPDATE: Our confidence that we can consummate this transaction has diminished.
[+] [-] themstheones|12 years ago|reply
And one of the reporters who saw the video was on the radio this morning saying that three other copies are floating around.
[+] [-] krrrh|12 years ago|reply
The guys at the top must be in full damage-control mode, because they're going to lose a magnitude more revenue than a measly $200k. I don't know who their competition is, but there's a big opening for a mid-sized crack dealer to rapidly expand their marketshare if they can convince their customers that they take the security of their personal information seriously.
As for the guys with the video, think what happened to David Barksdale
http://gawker.com/5637234/gcreep-google-engineer-stalked-tee...
...but cross it with what happened to D'Angelo Barksdale.
It's so ironic and weird that Gawker was involved in poisoning David Barksdale's employment opportunities, and is also involved in the Rob Ford case, while still living under the shadow of the millions of passwords they leaked last year.
[+] [-] borgchick|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sbarre|12 years ago|reply
Clearly Gawker would need some kind of paper trail before making that payment, not just for tax purposes but simply because I'm pretty sure there are laws that govern transfers that large..
So the recipient would have to declare that income at tax time (and possibly even file paperwork on receipt) to at the very least pay taxes on it, which would put them on the government's radar, which is something they may want less than they would want $200k..
[+] [-] jaredmcateer|12 years ago|reply
[1] http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/toronto/toronto-police-s...
[+] [-] cmbaus|12 years ago|reply
There are concerns about the development that is going on, but seeing new urban housing going up is refreshing compared with many US cities which effectively have no growth policies.
Based on the number of units that seemed ready to hit the market, I suspect Toronto could see significantly lower housing prices in the future. I just hope it doesn't end in financial ruin for the banks.
[+] [-] afterburner|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Oculus|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Apocryphon|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shawnc|12 years ago|reply
But yes, i'm very happy to see others succeeding at crowdfunding outside of KickStarter, and I firmly believe those with large followings don't even need to be using an outside source, but could be doing it on their own websites.
[+] [-] sethbannon|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] kmfrk|12 years ago|reply
IGG is an open barn door by comparison, which is what drives a lot of project creators there.
[+] [-] bsims|12 years ago|reply
In this case, if they don't obtain the video they are simply going to donate $200k to a charity that they will "figure out what that is later if it comes to it."
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] gyardley|12 years ago|reply
Did you read the endorsement article you linked to? It ends with "The electors of Toronto should guardedly opt for George Smitherman."
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] phaus|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] xxchan|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] cmnzs|12 years ago|reply
I wasn't living in Toronto when the election was going on so I didn't really pay attention to the media re: the election, but I wonder how they portrayed him at the time
[+] [-] sinemetu11|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ronnier|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] bob13579|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] quinndupont|12 years ago|reply
[Edit: uhm, tongue in cheek, obviously. But Rob Ford is pretty clearly messed up with some dodgy people doing dodgy things.]