Dota2 is a massively popular AAA game created by Valve which just came out of beta yesterday. The game is known to be difficult to play and master.
Why Linux release is important:
Valve released Steam for Linux couple of months back but apart from TF2 and other Valve titles, Steam for Linux is picking up pace very slowly. Even games like TF2 and L4D are more or less last generation titles. Dota2 on the other hand is brand new, it uses all the new features from source engine and hopefully is capable of pushing Gaming on Linux like no other title.
I wouldn't say it's difficult to play, you get the jist pretty quick, but yes it is hard to master as there are a lot of good/seasoned players and takes a lot of time learning all of the playable characters skills. It's really fun.
If you assume a company doesn't want to port games, but decide to support linux at the beginning of their development cycle, we'd really need to wait a few years for proper titles. That is making the assumption they are interested right now though, which is less than likely.
However, there are currently many indie games available for linux. Even some well-known hits, like Kerbel Space Program and Surgeon Simulator (by chance, they both happen to use the Unity engine, which natively includes linux support).
Just out of interest, what was the timeline for OSX steam like? I don't use a Mac, so I'm not sure.
I know that their Linux initiative is a recent development, but if they want it to succeed, they really need to get more current generation titles out there. I play Counterstrike: GO, its the only reason I still use Windows. Instead of wasting the effort to port Counterstrike Source, they should have put those resources into porting the latest version.
It's a curious phenomenon, isn't it? As a long-time DotA player myself, I maintain a separate "DotA Persona" which I fall into when playing. It's basically an offensive response to assholes: also be an asshole.
I think it essentially comes from the nature of the game: as an individual, you're suddenly stuck with a bunch of other people you have to cooperate with. It's not like tf2 or CS. The teams are smaller and the stakes are much higher. People care about winning games in DotA a lot more than they do in most FPS games, where the journey is the destination. In DotA, the win is the destination and it's the validation of your abilities (k/d ratio doesn't cut it).
You would think having the win be so important would make it easier or better to work together, but the fact of the matter is most DotA players suck. Even people who consistently win public games still suck. Players hold everyone else to incredibly high standards and get frustrated when they feel like their team "drags them down." This is compounded by a feeling that, if you're doing badly yourself, you should scapegoat a team member in order to shift the blame.
DotA 2 is actually a lot better. I'm not sure why exactly, and it depends on your level. Maybe there's hope.
I'd like to introduce you to www.dotanoobs.com - a personal project to create a rage-free environment for both new and experienced players to have fun together.
Just moved from Wordpress to Flask, got the Valve Dota2 replay-parser running on Linux and am preparing some cool stuff with that on the back end.
tl;dr: get on teamspeak (voice.dotanoobs.com) and play with people who aren't mean.
You should try Dota2. Out of all the games in that genre (HoN, LoL, original Dota), Dota2 seems to have the best community out there. There is match making, so you will be paired with people that are at least somewhat close to you in skill.
To deal with trolls/toxic people, they have a reporting system. If someone gets reported by a number of people they will be muted and/or put into the low priority queue. Muting lasts X duration (depending on repeat offences) and prevents that person from talking at all in game (they can still use the chat wheel I believe).
The low-priority queue is a separate match-making queue, where only people in this queue will play against one another. It is for people that regularly abandon games (or are toxic players). It tends to be filled with the trouble-making players.
The game is extremely addictive. When you start getting serious at this game, it means that you will be offended by many small things you wouldn't care about if you were just a casual gamer.
Let's say you play at a high level game. You do well at your top lane with your carry, you farmed well for 10 minutes, even got a kill and you're satisfied with how the game's going so far.
Meanwhile you have your mid lane getting crushed by the enemy. Your ally mid dies 5 times in 8 minutes and you soon get ganked by a level 12 middle hero when you're only level 6. You get run over as well as they're little you can do.
The rest of the game snowballs like this and because you can't give up in DotA 2, you have to play for 15-20 minutes defending or not defending your base against feeded (too strong) opponents. So yea, that's when the unfriendliness comes from
These players tend to stay in the low levels of matchmaking. In high and very high matchmaking, people are a lot more cooperative or criticize constructively. However, without playing ~500 games (~500 hours), you probably won't graduate from the low skill bracket.
Knowing that those people are out there, what you can do is be the moral leader. When the game starts, give the all-chat "good luck have fun" greeting, start discussing lane strategy, team strategy (push/turtlefarm/gank), etc. If you make a mistake, live up to it. The only time the trolls really ruin games is if everyone else is silent and lets the person continue ranting.
Learning to float above the trolls' guilt trips while still being able to admit your mistakes is an interesting emotional exercise.
I haven't run into many (I have about 300 hours played). There were only 2 or so that were unfriendly. I turned off voice chat a while ago though, that was due to me playing together with my brother and using mumble instead of the built-in chat. Although there was an idiot in mumble that was trying to mess with us while we were playing. I think it has to do more with he voice chat rather than the actual game.
I play dota2 and im pretty nice and always try to be friendly to people in game, ive not really ran into "horrible" people. Depends what level you play at but once you get into the "know your bad but can play the game" level then most people are fine.
It's true, and of all the clones, I've found Dota 2 to have the friendliest community by far and it's is constantly getting better. It's night and day from what I remember it being six months ago.
While this is true far too often in DOTA, LoL, and HoN, I think it's worth mentioning that there are nice players out there.
I play League of Legends, and while there's a decent chance that you'll run into a few toxic players every 3 or 4 games, most of the time if you set the tone at champion select or the start of a game with "gl hf" and, more impoartantly something like, "hey guys, how's it going?" or "let's have a good time" (as cheesy as it sounds) things end up going really smoothly. Silliness and joking helps too (such as, "Party at our nexus!" or "ey yo [champion name], what u doin later tonight?"). I've played 4 games over the past 2 days and only one person came close to raging.
The worst of the worst tend to have the lowest ratings, so if you're halfway decent (which is pretty easy to achieve) then you'll be alright, barring the occasional crazy person.
I agree with some of the others, Dota 2 really tries to work on this. I've met so many nice people in Dota 2 willing to help out, but of course, I've met scumbags aswell.
The best solution to enjoy your game when a scumbag is in your team (or the other):
1. Mute him/her. Both the chat and microphone will be muted.
2. Report.
3. Keep playing.
I've done this since day one, I've muted about 5 people during the last month. It's acceptable for me. And if you team up with friends in a party, you'll have so much more fun.
Please remember to commend the people helping you out. I love being commended, and that's why I'm trying to help out and staying friendly during all of my games no matter how it turns out.
I've been involved in competitive gaming since the early days. Asshatery is universal and found in other communities like counter strike, quake, unreal tournament, halo, et al..
Games typically last 30-40 minutes and are heavily team-based.
This scenario makes it very easy to get agitated when a person on your team screws up badly and ends up costing your team the game.
Dota 2 has recently introduced a robust muting system that has really done a good job changing the behavior of the more... voiceful members online - this has led to an overall much more pleasant in-game chat experience.
DOTA and LoL teeter-totter as to which one has the most unfriendly players. currently, LoL around level 20-28 doesn't seem very bad. i hear Ranked (level 30, organized/draft (both teams ban some champions and then choose them, elementary school sports style)) is a bit less friendly.
I'm actually really sad that these take off so well, because imho the DOTA format is the worst thing to happen to online gaming. The game is feels deliberately brutal to newbies in so very many ways. The whole genre seems utterly dysfunctional for any kind of player who doesn't have a tight, committed clan to play with.
Long high-commitment match-ups make it bad for people with other committments, a hyperlong list of powers and heroes makes for a tremendous amount of trivia to learn, there's the various play mechanics that make you hate the weakest man on your team (and can examine his failings in detail), and the way DOTA2 embraces counterintuitive hardcore tweaks that were eradicated in other iterations (like killing your own troops to deny the opponents XP).
I like the pro gaming circuit, but a truly good game is one that's approachable, friendly, and deep.
How can the existence and relative success of this game offend you so? Virtually all games out there nowadays are newbie friendly and watered down to a fault. People with your preferences are drowning in choices. For those of us who enjoy uncompromising skill-based games, the only AAA titles to come along in recent memory have been Dota 2, Dark Souls and a handful of RTS and fighting games.
League of Legends addresses many of your apparent concerns with Dota's game design. But guess what? Its online community is every bit as toxic and obnoxious. Both are skill-based team games that are played over the Internet, require a lot of coordination, and usually take over 30 minutes per match. You can address in-game bad manners at the margins with something like Riot's tribunal system or Valve's reporting system, but I doubt you can do much to eliminate the problem without also eliminating those essential features of their game design.
It's a third person, heavily skill shot based MOBA. So no you don't have to be pro to learn how to play. The skills rollover from other games (especially WoW), so you don't really have to relearn basic mechanics. And new players are matched with all new players (so besides from smurfs), you should have a relatively easy time.
Coming in late here, but DotA's difficulty coupled with its focus on spectating any game, including professional tournaments, provides an amazing viewer experience. It's really one of, if not the best in my opinion, game to watch professionals play. This matched with its large viewerbase means that sponsors are bigger, and tournament prize pots are bigger. MasterCard recently sponsored the recent Alienware Cup tournament [1].
As a side note, Valve has recently crowdsourced the prizepot for The International 3 with great success (their large DotA2 tournament) [2].
MOBA games aren't really that hard to get into. Millions of players find it rather easy to get into. In fact, if numbers are anything to take into account, MOBA games may be the easiest type of competitive game to actually get into.
Dota is no more difficult to learn than games like starcraft IMO the only difference is aRTS games have significantly worse communities than pure rts games.
Nitpick: The title is kind of misleading. They are putting Mac and Linux support in Dota 2 Test, which is a separate client with separate servers from the real Dota 2 that they use to test new features. It's not actually being released in the sense of being able to play Dota 2 with normal Dota 2 players. The actual release will come at some indeterminate point in the future.
I just want to say, there was a time once when I was overly addicted to playing dota. One of my workarounds whenever I felt I had binged too much was to whipe my windows install and go with Ubuntu. It kind of worked, but eventually I'd just go back. I even went so far as throwing my windows license in the bin and snapping my install disc. Time and time again I'd just download a cracked version and burn a new disc...
Eventually I overcame the addiction by replacing the habit with going to the gym 4-5 times a week. Now I spend my time in windows playing with the directx sdk instead of on Dota.
Not really sure what value this comment adds, but I guess soon even Linux won't be a semi-safe-haven for Dota addicts (p.s. I have an ATI card so wine wasn't an option for me).
For those interested in the MOBA genre but looking for a friendlier community and a bit more casual, yet faster, gameplay, I can really recommend the 2d-platform version: Awesomenauts.
It is available for all three major platforms: Windows, OSX and Linux. It was part of a recent Humble Indie Bundle, so you might already have it.
It has been the first online game that I've really become hooked upon since my old days of playing Warcraft 3 custom maps.
I run Dota 2 at 720p on my Windows 7 PC with substantially lower spec hardware - A Core 2 Duo clocked at 2.4GHz, 4GB RAM, Intel IGP GMA X4500 (G41 chipset)
This proves that the Source Engine on Linux isn't exactly efficient as its Windows counterpart as Valve claimed a few months back.
To be perfectly honest, I like the basic idea of the format that DOTA games present, I just find the execution to be quite awkward, and that's what kills it for me. It controls like an RTS since it came about as a Warcraft III map, and that continues to limit it.
Alternative takes on it tend to be fun for me (things like MNC), and I really feel like the genre would work a lot better with a more action-oriented control scheme. Something like a GW2 sPvP mode with a dota-style objective/flow would be quite excellent, in my opinion.
Does anyone remember the thread where people weren't sure whether steam releasing games for linux would be definitive in advancing linux? Pepperidge Farm remembers
Now I just need a Laptop with Nvidia Graphics that works on Linux. :( :( Is there even one?
I have to use vgaswitcheroo to disable my discrete ATI 4550 card, because it causes artefacts and crashes and consumes too much power. The proprietary driver doesn't even work at all.
And yet, no news on the OSX front, even though the Source Engine has worked on Mac even longer than it has on Linux. Really was hoping they'd have at least a Mac beta by the time they started the rolling launch of the Windows version :(
It'll come, they already said it would. I suspect the thing is that Linux users are generally more testing types. Mac users, like windows want an already finished/polished product.
[+] [-] gnufied|12 years ago|reply
Dota2 is a massively popular AAA game created by Valve which just came out of beta yesterday. The game is known to be difficult to play and master.
Why Linux release is important: Valve released Steam for Linux couple of months back but apart from TF2 and other Valve titles, Steam for Linux is picking up pace very slowly. Even games like TF2 and L4D are more or less last generation titles. Dota2 on the other hand is brand new, it uses all the new features from source engine and hopefully is capable of pushing Gaming on Linux like no other title.
[+] [-] jeltz|12 years ago|reply
http://store.steampowered.com/stats/
[+] [-] bonjourmr|12 years ago|reply
I wouldn't say it's difficult to play, you get the jist pretty quick, but yes it is hard to master as there are a lot of good/seasoned players and takes a lot of time learning all of the playable characters skills. It's really fun.
[+] [-] keeperofdakeys|12 years ago|reply
However, there are currently many indie games available for linux. Even some well-known hits, like Kerbel Space Program and Surgeon Simulator (by chance, they both happen to use the Unity engine, which natively includes linux support).
Just out of interest, what was the timeline for OSX steam like? I don't use a Mac, so I'm not sure.
[+] [-] phaus|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] pdknsk|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] delluminatus|12 years ago|reply
I think it essentially comes from the nature of the game: as an individual, you're suddenly stuck with a bunch of other people you have to cooperate with. It's not like tf2 or CS. The teams are smaller and the stakes are much higher. People care about winning games in DotA a lot more than they do in most FPS games, where the journey is the destination. In DotA, the win is the destination and it's the validation of your abilities (k/d ratio doesn't cut it).
You would think having the win be so important would make it easier or better to work together, but the fact of the matter is most DotA players suck. Even people who consistently win public games still suck. Players hold everyone else to incredibly high standards and get frustrated when they feel like their team "drags them down." This is compounded by a feeling that, if you're doing badly yourself, you should scapegoat a team member in order to shift the blame.
DotA 2 is actually a lot better. I'm not sure why exactly, and it depends on your level. Maybe there's hope.
[+] [-] binaryatrocity|12 years ago|reply
Just moved from Wordpress to Flask, got the Valve Dota2 replay-parser running on Linux and am preparing some cool stuff with that on the back end.
tl;dr: get on teamspeak (voice.dotanoobs.com) and play with people who aren't mean.
[+] [-] kyrra|12 years ago|reply
To deal with trolls/toxic people, they have a reporting system. If someone gets reported by a number of people they will be muted and/or put into the low priority queue. Muting lasts X duration (depending on repeat offences) and prevents that person from talking at all in game (they can still use the chat wheel I believe).
The low-priority queue is a separate match-making queue, where only people in this queue will play against one another. It is for people that regularly abandon games (or are toxic players). It tends to be filled with the trouble-making players.
[+] [-] mitchi|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] thwest|12 years ago|reply
Knowing that those people are out there, what you can do is be the moral leader. When the game starts, give the all-chat "good luck have fun" greeting, start discussing lane strategy, team strategy (push/turtlefarm/gank), etc. If you make a mistake, live up to it. The only time the trolls really ruin games is if everyone else is silent and lets the person continue ranting.
Learning to float above the trolls' guilt trips while still being able to admit your mistakes is an interesting emotional exercise.
[+] [-] nobodysfool|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sliverstorm|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Zariel|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] shazow|12 years ago|reply
Valve's commitment to tweaking behaviour through player feedback has been surprisingly effective. You can read a bit about it here: http://blog.dota2.com/2013/05/communication-reports/
[+] [-] jpreiland|12 years ago|reply
I play League of Legends, and while there's a decent chance that you'll run into a few toxic players every 3 or 4 games, most of the time if you set the tone at champion select or the start of a game with "gl hf" and, more impoartantly something like, "hey guys, how's it going?" or "let's have a good time" (as cheesy as it sounds) things end up going really smoothly. Silliness and joking helps too (such as, "Party at our nexus!" or "ey yo [champion name], what u doin later tonight?"). I've played 4 games over the past 2 days and only one person came close to raging.
The worst of the worst tend to have the lowest ratings, so if you're halfway decent (which is pretty easy to achieve) then you'll be alright, barring the occasional crazy person.
[+] [-] mmmm|12 years ago|reply
The best solution to enjoy your game when a scumbag is in your team (or the other):
1. Mute him/her. Both the chat and microphone will be muted. 2. Report. 3. Keep playing.
I've done this since day one, I've muted about 5 people during the last month. It's acceptable for me. And if you team up with friends in a party, you'll have so much more fun.
Please remember to commend the people helping you out. I love being commended, and that's why I'm trying to help out and staying friendly during all of my games no matter how it turns out.
[+] [-] pxlpshr|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] whywhywhy5|12 years ago|reply
This scenario makes it very easy to get agitated when a person on your team screws up badly and ends up costing your team the game.
Dota 2 has recently introduced a robust muting system that has really done a good job changing the behavior of the more... voiceful members online - this has led to an overall much more pleasant in-game chat experience.
[+] [-] plonk420|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] JimmaDaRustla|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zokier|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Pxtl|12 years ago|reply
Long high-commitment match-ups make it bad for people with other committments, a hyperlong list of powers and heroes makes for a tremendous amount of trivia to learn, there's the various play mechanics that make you hate the weakest man on your team (and can examine his failings in detail), and the way DOTA2 embraces counterintuitive hardcore tweaks that were eradicated in other iterations (like killing your own troops to deny the opponents XP).
I like the pro gaming circuit, but a truly good game is one that's approachable, friendly, and deep.
[+] [-] psykotic|12 years ago|reply
League of Legends addresses many of your apparent concerns with Dota's game design. But guess what? Its online community is every bit as toxic and obnoxious. Both are skill-based team games that are played over the Internet, require a lot of coordination, and usually take over 30 minutes per match. You can address in-game bad manners at the margins with something like Riot's tribunal system or Valve's reporting system, but I doubt you can do much to eliminate the problem without also eliminating those essential features of their game design.
[+] [-] iHalcyon|12 years ago|reply
It's a third person, heavily skill shot based MOBA. So no you don't have to be pro to learn how to play. The skills rollover from other games (especially WoW), so you don't really have to relearn basic mechanics. And new players are matched with all new players (so besides from smurfs), you should have a relatively easy time.
[+] [-] prawks|12 years ago|reply
As a side note, Valve has recently crowdsourced the prizepot for The International 3 with great success (their large DotA2 tournament) [2].
[1] https://twitter.com/MasterCard/status/354621397135409152 [2] http://www.dota2.com/international/compendium/
[+] [-] whywhywhy5|12 years ago|reply
MOBA games aren't really that hard to get into. Millions of players find it rather easy to get into. In fact, if numbers are anything to take into account, MOBA games may be the easiest type of competitive game to actually get into.
[+] [-] nnash|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] chc|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] avree|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] BookPage|12 years ago|reply
Eventually I overcame the addiction by replacing the habit with going to the gym 4-5 times a week. Now I spend my time in windows playing with the directx sdk instead of on Dota.
Not really sure what value this comment adds, but I guess soon even Linux won't be a semi-safe-haven for Dota addicts (p.s. I have an ATI card so wine wasn't an option for me).
[+] [-] jkw|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] orng|12 years ago|reply
It has been the first online game that I've really become hooked upon since my old days of playing Warcraft 3 custom maps.
[+] [-] mtgx|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] binarycrusader|12 years ago|reply
The engine is nice, but until I no longer have any need to boot into Windows, I'm only mildly impressed.
[+] [-] bdz|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ameen|12 years ago|reply
> Dota 2 Linux Minimum System Requirements:
> Ubuntu 12.04
> Dual core from Intel or AMD at 2.8 GHz
> 4GB RAM
> 4GB Hard Drive Space,
> nVidia GeForce 8600/9600GT, ATI/AMD Radeaon HD2600/3600 (Graphic Drivers: nVidia 310, AMD 12.11), OpenGL 2.1
> OpenAL Compatible Sound Card
I run Dota 2 at 720p on my Windows 7 PC with substantially lower spec hardware - A Core 2 Duo clocked at 2.4GHz, 4GB RAM, Intel IGP GMA X4500 (G41 chipset)
This proves that the Source Engine on Linux isn't exactly efficient as its Windows counterpart as Valve claimed a few months back.
[+] [-] neona|12 years ago|reply
Alternative takes on it tend to be fun for me (things like MNC), and I really feel like the genre would work a lot better with a more action-oriented control scheme. Something like a GW2 sPvP mode with a dota-style objective/flow would be quite excellent, in my opinion.
[+] [-] hardwaresofton|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] X4|12 years ago|reply
I have to use vgaswitcheroo to disable my discrete ATI 4550 card, because it causes artefacts and crashes and consumes too much power. The proprietary driver doesn't even work at all.
[+] [-] spleeder|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] donniezazen|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ssw1n|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] avolcano|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] endianswap|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] radge|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dubcanada|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dmead|12 years ago|reply