People who use their Windows laptops primarily for business/accounting data-entry tasks love the number pads.
This blogger does not know the market better than the large and profitable manufacturers selling into it. The manufacturers have real numbers backing their decisions – not subjective aesthetic and ergonomic hand-waving. If customers weren't choosing (and even paying extra for) for the numpad, it'd disappear quickly.
Lenovo's been shipping 14" and 15" business laptops with 1366x768 screens for a while, and no one seems to want that. No users were benefited by trimming ThinkPads to a 6-row keyboard, yet they pushed ahead with that anyways.
HP shipped plenty of laptops with massive heat issues (literally painful to the touch, even sitting idle at the MS Store).
To think that OEMs always know best is wishful thinking. Although in the case of a numpad on a large style laptop, I'd probably prefer it.
> If customers weren't choosing (and even paying extra for) for the numpad, it'd disappear quickly.
You are assuming that consumers are making rational and informed choices. The fact that people buy numpad-equipped laptops does not mean that they prefer it, but rather it means that it is what is being sold to them.
If there is a minority that is willing to pay extra for the numpad, and a majority who are ignorant about the compromises involved and thus ambivalent about the choice, then of course manufacturers are going to cater that minority and squish couple extra bucks while sacrificing the majority. But that doesn't mean that numpad would be beneficial to the ignorant majority.
You can always buy a USB number pad for data entry tasks, but you can't remove a numpad from an existing keyboard. A 3rd party number pad is probably higher quality anyway.
Exactly. The main reason I chose my current laptop over another was because it has a number pad. I now have a work issued laptop without a number pad, so I have to drag around my work issued keyboard because zipping through excel efficiently without it is harder.
I am very happy to have a numpad on my laptop (first time I've had one after five laptops without) and in all likelihood would only buy a laptop in the future with a numpad. The balancing issue took a few minutes to get used to, if I use on my lap, but otherwise, it was an easy adjustment to make. Using the numpad when entering figures into Excel or other programs is much easier than before when using the top-line of the keyboard, and no longer need to have a usb desktop keyboard around to help with that.
I am an average user, not an accountant or anything like that and I like a lot the numpad. For filling forms (Phone, house number, postal code), passwords, basic Excel use, etc.
No, the worst trend is the squashed screens. People writing - be it English or French, or source code of some kind, or for that matter, many other kinds of creating, work vertically, not with these super wide but not very tall screens.
If your work consists of single text from one corner of the screen to the opposite, then I guess your complaint makes sense. But for most people you'll have all sorts of things open, and widescreen enables throwing that all to the sides. There are plenty of examples: Photoshop (and GIMP, Illustrator, InDesign, Inkscape etc) having tool palettes in the sides, IDEs with all sorts of tools and document trees and whatnot, or if you are more of a text-editor guy then still you can have eg documentation and code side-by-side, etc.
And of course for laptops, especially smaller ones, widescreen provides the unique advantage of maximizing keyboard size to total body size as keyboards are wide by nature. Admittedly this is less of a concern for 15"+ models, but I've never been a fan of those.
The recent trend of only offering 1080p screens as the luxury choice and 900p or worse for the standard is depressing. And of course all being 16:9 (since watching TV is totally what the average laptop is used for...)
I need numpads for fast stuff. Numpad keys are also not just duplicate numeric keycodes. Figure out a better laptop design, yes, but taking it out for good eliminates some use cases. While you're at it, make function keys work consistently across all manufacturers.
> "the numpad is useless for the vast majority of people, and those who need numpads, already use them at desktop (keyboard) or, can buy numpads"
Nice, yet another blogger that says that I do not exist. I need a numpad, and I don't want to carry with another peripheral and no... I don't have a desktop.
I like my numpad. In fact, I bought my laptop explicitly because it has a numpad on it.
And I also like the fact that the PC market caters to every niche. I know some people don't like numpads on laptops, but I do. So you can buy a laptop without one, and I'll go buy one with one. Bam, both of us are happy.
Nearly 10 years ago I bought happy hacker keyboards without numpads for all of my desktops and I haven't missed the numpad one bit. I did get the model with cursor keys though (edited to add: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0000U1DJ2/ ).
Giant keyboards are even more of a waste of space and ugly eyesore on the desktop than they are on a laptop.
Number pads are very useful to me as a programmer.
People forget that they aren't only useful for number entry...Num lock is there for a reason.
It's a solution from the horrible absence/reconfiguration of the Home cluster, as the numpad can be used for that purpose. And it can be used for rapid text movement. If you aren't using numpad as a programmer, you might be suprised at the code editing benefits.
The really stupid trend in laptop (and most portables) design is non-user replaceable batteries!! What can be at most a 10 USD, 30 second affair is now a drive to the service centre, a two week (if lucky) wait and a 100 USD bill ...
To be fair, Apple popularized the buttonless trackpad trend and is reasonably good at executing it; originally I was skeptical of it but Apple's clicky trackpads are very nice to use.
That said, Lenovo made the decision to integrate a Synaptics Clickpad in a lot of the recent ThinkPads and it's basically untenable - on my ThinkPad I've turned the trackpad entirely off because the Clickpad is just so unusable.
I don't like numpads either, but I see why some people do like them. Low resolution screens however; that does no-one any good I would say. And for me it's downright annoying. I work mostly exclusively on laptops and having as much room on one screen as possible is very valuable for me. 1366x768 is insanely low and yet most laptops have had it for years.
Good point. Liked the assessment of where eye focus is, though I often notice that I position myself slightly to the left of my balanced laptop, perhaps because I use my right hand for more than 1/2 of the keyboard.
I have no idea why numpads even exist on most desktop keyboards. They just make it more difficult to reach the mouse. I use the Filco Majestouch-2 in its "Tenkeyless" (no numpad) version[0], and it's great being able to reach the mouse so easily.
I use the numpad for every number i type on my keyboard. It's much faster and the time/energy i would save by having to move my hand a shorter distance to the mouse, is no where near the amount of time/energy i save by not having to look at the keyboard and find each individual number.
How many numbers do you enter? A numpad is really nice if you have to enter a bunch of numerical data.
I prefer add-on USB numpads, because I'm left handed and etc. But still, numpads are great and you only really appreciate how good they are when you have to type out a stupid list.
Don't disagree with any of that, but I bet the reason lots of laptops have numpads is that when Average Customer sees a laptop with and without one next to each other in a store, he will not choose the one without the numpad because, well, "you never know". Or the one without doesn't look like a "normal" keyboard: "maybe it's horrible to type on after a while?" etc.
Or conversely put a pad of usefulness to the left of the keyboard as well to maintain symmetry. I don't know about the author but if the G15 keyboard came with a fully programmable 'number pad' like arrangement to the left of control and a number pad to the right of enter I would be totally OK with that.
[+] [-] gojomo|12 years ago|reply
This blogger does not know the market better than the large and profitable manufacturers selling into it. The manufacturers have real numbers backing their decisions – not subjective aesthetic and ergonomic hand-waving. If customers weren't choosing (and even paying extra for) for the numpad, it'd disappear quickly.
[+] [-] MichaelGG|12 years ago|reply
HP shipped plenty of laptops with massive heat issues (literally painful to the touch, even sitting idle at the MS Store).
To think that OEMs always know best is wishful thinking. Although in the case of a numpad on a large style laptop, I'd probably prefer it.
[+] [-] zokier|12 years ago|reply
You are assuming that consumers are making rational and informed choices. The fact that people buy numpad-equipped laptops does not mean that they prefer it, but rather it means that it is what is being sold to them.
If there is a minority that is willing to pay extra for the numpad, and a majority who are ignorant about the compromises involved and thus ambivalent about the choice, then of course manufacturers are going to cater that minority and squish couple extra bucks while sacrificing the majority. But that doesn't mean that numpad would be beneficial to the ignorant majority.
[+] [-] wting|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Nicholas_C|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] nekojima|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] soneca|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hnha|12 years ago|reply
to save you the clickbait.
[+] [-] davidw|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zokier|12 years ago|reply
And of course for laptops, especially smaller ones, widescreen provides the unique advantage of maximizing keyboard size to total body size as keyboards are wide by nature. Admittedly this is less of a concern for 15"+ models, but I've never been a fan of those.
[+] [-] Guvante|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] wrongc0ntinent|12 years ago|reply
edit: and I love butterns.
[+] [-] pmelendez|12 years ago|reply
Nice, yet another blogger that says that I do not exist. I need a numpad, and I don't want to carry with another peripheral and no... I don't have a desktop.
[+] [-] dragontamer|12 years ago|reply
And I also like the fact that the PC market caters to every niche. I know some people don't like numpads on laptops, but I do. So you can buy a laptop without one, and I'll go buy one with one. Bam, both of us are happy.
What is wrong with that?
[+] [-] Amadou|12 years ago|reply
Giant keyboards are even more of a waste of space and ugly eyesore on the desktop than they are on a laptop.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Hacking_Keyboard
[+] [-] w1ntermute|12 years ago|reply
Do you mean the HHKB Pro JP? Don't the tiny spacebar and vertical enter key bother you? Not to mention a bunch of symbols being in different places.
[+] [-] generj|12 years ago|reply
People forget that they aren't only useful for number entry...Num lock is there for a reason.
It's a solution from the horrible absence/reconfiguration of the Home cluster, as the numpad can be used for that purpose. And it can be used for rapid text movement. If you aren't using numpad as a programmer, you might be suprised at the code editing benefits.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Numpad.svg
[+] [-] AdrianRossouw|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lazylland|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] LnxPrgr3|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mwfunk|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ChikkaChiChi|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hereonbusiness|12 years ago|reply
I would not consider buying a laptop that had any one of these.
[+] [-] jblow|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ek|12 years ago|reply
That said, Lenovo made the decision to integrate a Synaptics Clickpad in a lot of the recent ThinkPads and it's basically untenable - on my ThinkPad I've turned the trackpad entirely off because the Clickpad is just so unusable.
[+] [-] tluyben2|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] paulorlando|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] generj|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zokier|12 years ago|reply
http://imgur.com/zrZAeg4
Centered keyboard, numeric entry, everyone is happy?
[+] [-] RachelF|12 years ago|reply
Most people use the arrow keys way more than CAPS LOCK but guess which occupies more area.
Also needing a key combination for PgUp/PgDn Home etc.
[+] [-] w1ntermute|12 years ago|reply
0: http://www.amazon.com/Filco-Majestouch-2-Tenkeyless-FKBN87M-...
[+] [-] jolt|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DanBC|12 years ago|reply
I prefer add-on USB numpads, because I'm left handed and etc. But still, numpads are great and you only really appreciate how good they are when you have to type out a stupid list.
[+] [-] MarkTee|12 years ago|reply
If you type for even an hour each day, you owe it to yourself to try out a mechanical keyboard...I'd never go back.
[+] [-] lamby|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ChuckMcM|12 years ago|reply