> In my mind, it’s a little preposterous that if I want to do so, however, I have to be ok with being felt up and indirectly insulted.
To the author: You're right, it's unacceptable but you know how to fix it? You say something at the point in which it occurs. Nip it in the bud. Running off to write yet another gender-division-in-the-tech-world blog which will be read, primarily, by the sort of folk who already agree with you isn't going to make nearly as much of a difference as taking care of issues promptly. After doing so, blog about what happened and the resulting reaction. That's the sort of story that'll spread like wildfire.
I'm really turned off by these posts, too. I roll my eyes and mutter "Christ, not another one". But I'm a male who doesn't have to worry about being groped and I keep my hands to myself.
But let me guess how the reality turns out for her:
- She says something about it.
- The guy who is misbehaving is probably physically bigger than her. She may feel fearful of speaking up.
or
- She speaks up and gets called a "prude" or, ironically, a "slut". Maybe they'll blame it on her sweater being a little too form-fitting, or a little too low-cut.
Then, she follows your advice and posts what happened and the resulting action which results in even more criticism, death and rape threats than the course she actually took here.
If you have a young daughter, these are the kinds of issues she'll have to deal with some day. Might as well think about this now.
It's not on the author to say something. There were a handful of other people there who could have spoken up.
Please, everyone, if you witness this type of rude behavior, speak up. We are all, male, female, undecided, both etc. responsible for improving treatment of non-males in tech. Take an active role.
What exactly do you want her to say? "Hi, stop being a dick, because this kind of behavior is a serious turn off to women who want to be involved in tech?" That's obviously not going to fly.
So what about, "Hi, could you not awkwardly hug me?" What people say in response to that is, "Why are you being mean to me? I was just trying to be friendly." It's extremely hard to say something in the moment without getting stereotyped as a frigid bitch.
Someone with such a messed up perception of personal boundaries and acceptable behavior that they would FEEL UP SOMEONE IN PUBLIC is not necessarily going to stop just because you tell them. They might get more aggressive.
I don't know. Doing that would probably, consciously or not, forever put the author down in the other attendees' "difficult to deal with; better to stay clear of in the future" list. On the other hand, chances are the social repercussions the groper will suffer for his actions will be minimal regardless of whether he is called out or not.
There is a lot the unmentioned presumable majority of perfectly reasonable guys at that meeting could have done to make the few bad apples feel excluded and uncomfortable in a way which would far surpass any explicit callout by anyone in its effectivity, but unfortunately, in practice, most people are very reluctant to use social signalling in any rational or deliberate way.
That's the sort of story that'll spread like wildfire.
You must be using a different Internet from me. On my Internet, it looks something like this:
"Oh, you did speak up? You should have spoken up louder. You (should|should not) have cursed at him. You (should|should not) have been more polite. You (should|should not) have left. You (should|should not) have called the cops."
You can nitpick someone's past circumstances ad infinitum, as being too much of this or too little of that because there will never be a perfect, falsifiable individual test case— someone will find a reason why it's invalid. And after the fact, an individual can't go back and revise what they did, so all folks like you have to do is pick a reason why they did it wrong, and you can safely write it off.
In actuality, post isn't meant to be a conclusive proof or some damning, final conclusion. It's a data point, one among many as women get up the courage to talk about this shit. We need data points because there is actually a large subset of people who simply don't believe this is even a problem, let alone something they ought to think about.
I think that the point is less to change it than to report on the fact that it's (still) happening.
If she just told him off and he avoided her for the rest of the night, but otherwise she still felt as isolated and ogled, how would that change things? If she picked up a megaphone and shouted about how she needed to be treated with more respect, would she be? Or would everyone just think she was looking for attention.
The way she conducted herself makes sense to me, and while she was put off by the situation, she still got most of what she wanted to out of it. She didn't go to the bitcoin meetup to make a stand on her rights, she did it to talk about bitcoins. While there, she was put off by the way she was treated. Had she just made a scene about the way she was treated, maybe she wouldn't get to talk about bitcoins, maybe the people there would think "Oh, ok, this makes sense. Women don't really talk about bitcoins, she's not here because she is interested in bitcoins, she's one of those feminists. I get it now."
Her blog post is just a way of expressing "Hey, I experienced some uncomfortable situations at a bitcoin meetup because I was one of two women in a sea of men who didn't take me seriously."
The thing is, it's not her responsibility to fix it. Sure, there's things that she can do, but when men go to a bitcoin meetup, they don't go there to argue for men's rights, they go to talk about bitcoins. She can't reasonably do both, and the only way women can get into bitcoins is if they talk about bitcoins. If they have to defend their gender position instead, they don't have much opportunity to do that.
The way to fix it is to support your female friends who are interested in these things to continue to be interested in them. To go with them, whether you're a guy or a girl yourself, to give them support when they are learning about them. To not make a big deal about the fact that they're a woman and you like these things. Instead spend your time just collaborating on those things that they're interested in.
The only real way it will change is when people start to see it as not unusual. The only way for it to become not unusual is for more women in general to get interested. If women are getting turned off these things by weird guys and sexist comments (which come about because culturally not many women participate in these topics), then you can either try and stop every immature guy from saying something sexist about a women who does things that no other women do, or you can support more women when they want to do those things so that can get something out of it even when the weird guys bug them. Maybe with enough women interested it will no longer be something that seems surprising.
This is a great point, but it's hard to be confrontational in a place where you're already worried about your social standing. I agree that things would change faster if people were more confrontational but it's kind of a lot to ask. Posting a blog post about it (and one that's well-written, with good examples and explanation) is also a great step forward, and requires substantial courage on its own.
If we actually want to "nip it in the bud," shouldn't we be talking at/about/towards the men who groped and insulted her ? That's the actual bud here, right? Why are we all trying to police her behavior instead of the men who attacked her?
Not everyone is able to "nip it in the bud" as easily as you may be. I'm not saying you're wrong, just pointing out that the solution you cite is not always easy.
I think it's absolutely disgusting that you criticize the victim for documenting what happened to her.
It's despicable and downright fucking evil that you basically accuse her of sharing her story solely because she wants attention.
The worst part of your god-awful post is that it's currently pinned to the top of this board.
The fact that your disgusting, insensitive post is at the top is why women don't work in tech. They don't want to have to deal with assholes like you who have nothing better to do than say "she should do X instead of sharing her story", or whatever else you want to do to silence her, and shame her for sharing her story.
She is brave for doing anything, because she knew the world is full of assholes like you: cowardly bigots who will criticize ANY action she takes.
I'm sorry she had a problem. And I'm more sorry that HN has degraded to the point where a cowardly attack from a piece of shit like you is pinned to the top.
Easier said than done. I've been "out" for years and despite being opinionated and a "proud" person, I still find it extremely hard to put my neck out there and call others out (and interesting, it's much easier for me to stand up for female friends than it is to stand up for myself or other LGBT-specifically related issues).
It's hard enough to do, at all, to confront someone. But it's another thing when you've just been thrown completely off-kilter by having a stranger inappropriately groping you in public (Plus, you think he's going to have a positive reaction to her chiding him? Somehow I doubt it.). I'll give her a pass on not reprimanding him. (Plus, your post has the distinct scent of victim blaming)
This doesn't really line up with the entire second paragraph, in which she was basically groped. Groped. And then treated like a piece of meat instead of as a human being.
If that's not mistreatment, I really don't know what would be.
I think it's actually disturbingly telling that women's (or at least this particular woman's) expectations for how they'll be treated at tech meetups are so low that the described behavior isn't considered mistreatment.
To the younger folks out there: if you see something like this occur as a third party (you're neither the groper nor the gropee, neither the misogynist nor the victim), you need to not politely ignore it but to step in and correct the asshole, as firmly as necessary.
Whether it's groping or just verbal putdowns of some sort, you should step forward and add yourself to the situation, making it clear that the behavior you witnessed is not acceptable to you.
I agree wholeheartedly with this article, however I don't think it's fair to use such a wide brush. "This is What it's Like to Be a Woman at _This_ Bitcoin Meetup" would have been more appropriate. There are bad apples in every community, and it certainly sounds like the author met some, but it's important to realize that a few bad apples don't ruin the whole bushel.
How many more posts like this are needed to convince you that the whole community of tech meetups is hostile towards women?
Of course that individual deserves the lion's share of the blame, but writing this off as an isolated individual acting inappropriately misses the forest for the trees (i.e. misses the root cause [culture] for the proximate cause [assholes]).
To further analogize, perhaps the bad apple was there because the bushel was poisoned?
Actually, the saying is that a few bad apples spoils the bunch, which refers to the tendency of decay or infestation to quickly spread throughout the bushel: http://www.npr.org/2011/05/09/136017612/bad-apple-proverbs-t... ("But as the memory of rotting apples fades, the meaning of the 'bad apple' proverb has changed. In 19th century America, it was a staple of Sunday morning sermons: 'As one bad apple spoils the others, so you must show no quarter to sin or sinners.' Or it could suggest that finding one malefactor in a group should make you suspicious of everybody else. 'A bad apple spoils the bin,' one journalist wrote in 1898 of the Dreyfus Affair; if one officer is capable of forgery then why wouldn't others be as well?
Back then, nobody ever talked about 'just a few bad apples' or 'only a few rotten apples' — the whole point was that even one was enough to taint the group.").
In this case, the saying, the real one, is apropos. It might just be a few bad apples, but they taint the whole culture.
{I actually used this phrase a couple of days ago, at which point my wife hit my with some FFA knowledge.}
Women have faced, and continue to face, challenges in tech circles. It's hard to make progress because the first step is admitting you have a problem, and it's easy for the tech community to think it's someone else's problem. Keep an eye on your own thoughts and challenge assumptions (yours and others) that marginalize gender issues.
The article seems to imply that this behavior isn't limited to just this particular meet-up, but is characteristic of her experiences in bitcoin/tech/etc.
> “Wow. Women don’t usually say that type of things”.
To be perfectly honest, this is something I might have thought (but even then had the sense not to say) when I was working as an engineer. The mere lack of women in tech leads to perceptions that make it unpleasant for women to enter the field. Most people interact with just a few spheres: people they work with, people they meet on the street, and their friends, which are often drawn from people they work with or people they went to school with. When you go to school with very few women, and work with very few women, as engineers usually do, your perception of the whole gender is disproportionately shaped by those women you meet on the street, in the course of day to day activities. For people who work in intellectually demanding fields, the people you meet on the street are quite likely to not be as smart as the people you work with or the people you went to school with. And that as a real impact.
Really? I've been a geek since, well, always, have a CS degree and have been working as a sysadmin and programmer since 1996. There have been women along the way, in my CS program, as coworkers, at the various startups I've worked at. Some of them have been a whole lot brighter than me. And in all that time, I've never thought "oh wow, how unusual." I just don't get it.
Nobody deserves to be physically or verbally assaulted like that, and it's up to the rest of the community (at everything: hackathons, meetups, open hours, etc.) to deal with toxic people.
People in situations like this: please if somebody is making you uncomfortable, speak up. Maybe the guy putting his hand on your leg is your boyfriend? The "good people" in the room want to make you feel comfortable, but sometimes its hard to determine if somebody is a friend or not.
This sounds absolutely horrible, but it raises a questions.
I'm a guy, and I tend to be quite aware of things happening around me. If I were to notice things unfold as described in this post... Assuming I'm not in charge: is it preferable that I somehow try to play a role in this, or would this only make everything more complicated/awkward. Should I stay back and just be pissed off?
What would be the best way to approach this situation?
If you are worried about causing a scene, butt in about something else.
Hey <NAME>, I heard somebody say you like <TECHNOLOGY>! I'm a huge fan too!
If he's resistant to your interruption, be more forceful in trying to engage him. Maybe sit down next to him. Worst-case he becomes aggressive towards you, but so long as you stay bright & friendly, everyone else will see him picking the fight. That way you can try to defuse the situation indirectly. Maybe you get him engaged in conversation, or maybe the girl seizes the moment to excuse herself. Maybe you offer to the girl, Some other girls were looking for their friend, they said she had a blue shirt, was that you?
If he seems reasonable yet misguided (rather than a total asshole who knows the girl wants nothing to do with him), you can optionally try leading him away and quietly saying something like, I noticed that girl was starting to feel uncomfortable, tone it down/back off/try a different tactic.
Anyway, that's what I'd do if I was trying to avoid making a scene.
Notice unease. "Hey (groper), haven't you only just met (gropee)? Bit inappropriate to have your hand on her leg like that?"
Risk is that she may avoid confrontation by saying something to defuse the situation and the groper then misses the point and just takes you as an obstacle, thinking or later saying "It's hard enough to meet women without you blocking me, man!" Response to that is easy, of course.
The way that values basic human decency and empathy the most would be to notify the organizers and ensure that they don't just ignore your complaint, and to talk to the person who was assaulting the other person.
Unfortunately, I'm jaded enough to believe that no good deed goes unpunished, so in the same situation I'd just notify the organizers.
Start off with polite inquiry. If it's a false positive, apologize truthfully!
If it's a true positive, you can still rebuke the aggressor politely. "Wow, that's really not cool, man. Don't you owe her an apology? What if somebody did that to your sister or mother?" You don't need to demolish the person because maybe they're not a lost cause and they can learn.
Good thing that, unlike meetups, the bitcoin protocol doesn't care if a bitcoin address is controlled by a man or a woman.
I mean, that's the whole point of having a collective ledger where every agent is untrusted. There is no one saying, "Your money is no good here," based on your gender, race, creed, or political leanings.
This story made me realize that eventually we will get some sort of "FemCoin", though. Anybody who continues to use Bitcoin will be labeled a sexist and be made a social pariah.
The reason is that women didn't have a fair chance to get into Bitcoin in time because the community was so hostile. Therefore all the Bitcoin wealth is unfairly shifted to white men.
Great examples of what not to do. I would guess that many of these are fairly easy mistakes to make if you haven't been inoculated.
For most people, I think a single article like this is enough to "inoculate" -- to make the reader substantially more aware of potential mistakes / hidden assumptions in their social interactions, and likely change their behavior. Yet we still read lots of stories like these. I guess distributing these stories widely should help the situation.
The story is pretty sad and not reflective of the tech community in my opinion. It sounds like a group of either a) nerdy guys with severely lacking social skills or b) just garden-variety douchebags.
The event was in NYC not SF. SF / SV has its own share of problems but the one being discussed here isn't unique to SF or the U.S. Though I do wonder how the U.S. rank in terms of % of women in STEM majors or STEM careers.
Also the issue here has something to do with bitcoin attracting early adopters and groups with certain political preferences. I certainly wouldn't call the bitcoin subculture mainstream yet.
I've had some experience with managing tech meetups, and the inevitable occurrence of creepers making the attending women uncomfortable. The correct solution is for the people running the event to be paying attention to the behavior of the attendees and kick people out who are being disrespectful. And to do it noisily. It needs to be made an example of.
Unfortunately, these guys creep out other guys, too, so it's often the case that you see nothing happen because nobody wants to deal with the 'tard.
But it's no excuse. Pull up your big boy pants and give the asshole the boot.
If nobody bothers to challenge or set boundaries with cretins like this, how will the situation ever change? I don't think this is a situation where you'd have to fear for your safety for showing a little bit of a spine. It's not as if people who are socially retarded enough to think that behavior is okay will change without negative repercussions for their actions.
Last year my girlfriend wanted to go to a Bitcoin Meetup in Buenos Aires. Nothing like that happened in that occasion, but it was really boring imo... though it was interesting to see how many "bitcoiners" are mostly clueless about how Bitcoin actually works
btw I would change the title to "This is What it’s Like to Be a Woman."
I can never tell how to interpret stories like this.
They met assholes. Assholes are everywhere. They're guaranteed continue to be assholes until their targets stop them / make others aware that they are assholes.
Slap them (it's loud, shocking, and non-damaging). Make a scene. It's not acceptable behavior, regardless of gender or location.
Not to defend the men in this story but I imagine they are like many guys in tech-single and lonely, and see these sorts of meet-ups as an opportunity to meet women with similar interests. Specifically the line "Oh ok cool, so if we start dating I can use the app with you!" seems to suggest this objective.
I think a lot of their statements are said to provoke a reaction from women in a "flirty" manner, not because these men are actually misogynistic. Their well-intentioned flirtatious remarks are being interpreted as sexist by women attending these events, likely because these men are inexperienced with women and unsure how to relate to them.
[+] [-] meritt|12 years ago|reply
To the author: You're right, it's unacceptable but you know how to fix it? You say something at the point in which it occurs. Nip it in the bud. Running off to write yet another gender-division-in-the-tech-world blog which will be read, primarily, by the sort of folk who already agree with you isn't going to make nearly as much of a difference as taking care of issues promptly. After doing so, blog about what happened and the resulting reaction. That's the sort of story that'll spread like wildfire.
[+] [-] runjake|12 years ago|reply
But let me guess how the reality turns out for her:
- She says something about it.
- The guy who is misbehaving is probably physically bigger than her. She may feel fearful of speaking up.
or
- She speaks up and gets called a "prude" or, ironically, a "slut". Maybe they'll blame it on her sweater being a little too form-fitting, or a little too low-cut.
Then, she follows your advice and posts what happened and the resulting action which results in even more criticism, death and rape threats than the course she actually took here.
If you have a young daughter, these are the kinds of issues she'll have to deal with some day. Might as well think about this now.
[+] [-] slewis|12 years ago|reply
Please, everyone, if you witness this type of rude behavior, speak up. We are all, male, female, undecided, both etc. responsible for improving treatment of non-males in tech. Take an active role.
[+] [-] zasz|12 years ago|reply
So what about, "Hi, could you not awkwardly hug me?" What people say in response to that is, "Why are you being mean to me? I was just trying to be friendly." It's extremely hard to say something in the moment without getting stereotyped as a frigid bitch.
[+] [-] kevingadd|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] 4bpp|12 years ago|reply
There is a lot the unmentioned presumable majority of perfectly reasonable guys at that meeting could have done to make the few bad apples feel excluded and uncomfortable in a way which would far surpass any explicit callout by anyone in its effectivity, but unfortunately, in practice, most people are very reluctant to use social signalling in any rational or deliberate way.
[+] [-] wonderzombie|12 years ago|reply
You must be using a different Internet from me. On my Internet, it looks something like this:
"Oh, you did speak up? You should have spoken up louder. You (should|should not) have cursed at him. You (should|should not) have been more polite. You (should|should not) have left. You (should|should not) have called the cops."
You can nitpick someone's past circumstances ad infinitum, as being too much of this or too little of that because there will never be a perfect, falsifiable individual test case— someone will find a reason why it's invalid. And after the fact, an individual can't go back and revise what they did, so all folks like you have to do is pick a reason why they did it wrong, and you can safely write it off.
In actuality, post isn't meant to be a conclusive proof or some damning, final conclusion. It's a data point, one among many as women get up the courage to talk about this shit. We need data points because there is actually a large subset of people who simply don't believe this is even a problem, let alone something they ought to think about.
[+] [-] zeidrich|12 years ago|reply
If she just told him off and he avoided her for the rest of the night, but otherwise she still felt as isolated and ogled, how would that change things? If she picked up a megaphone and shouted about how she needed to be treated with more respect, would she be? Or would everyone just think she was looking for attention.
The way she conducted herself makes sense to me, and while she was put off by the situation, she still got most of what she wanted to out of it. She didn't go to the bitcoin meetup to make a stand on her rights, she did it to talk about bitcoins. While there, she was put off by the way she was treated. Had she just made a scene about the way she was treated, maybe she wouldn't get to talk about bitcoins, maybe the people there would think "Oh, ok, this makes sense. Women don't really talk about bitcoins, she's not here because she is interested in bitcoins, she's one of those feminists. I get it now."
Her blog post is just a way of expressing "Hey, I experienced some uncomfortable situations at a bitcoin meetup because I was one of two women in a sea of men who didn't take me seriously."
The thing is, it's not her responsibility to fix it. Sure, there's things that she can do, but when men go to a bitcoin meetup, they don't go there to argue for men's rights, they go to talk about bitcoins. She can't reasonably do both, and the only way women can get into bitcoins is if they talk about bitcoins. If they have to defend their gender position instead, they don't have much opportunity to do that.
The way to fix it is to support your female friends who are interested in these things to continue to be interested in them. To go with them, whether you're a guy or a girl yourself, to give them support when they are learning about them. To not make a big deal about the fact that they're a woman and you like these things. Instead spend your time just collaborating on those things that they're interested in.
The only real way it will change is when people start to see it as not unusual. The only way for it to become not unusual is for more women in general to get interested. If women are getting turned off these things by weird guys and sexist comments (which come about because culturally not many women participate in these topics), then you can either try and stop every immature guy from saying something sexist about a women who does things that no other women do, or you can support more women when they want to do those things so that can get something out of it even when the weird guys bug them. Maybe with enough women interested it will no longer be something that seems surprising.
[+] [-] ariannahsimpson|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lincolnq|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dgempesaw|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mikeleeorg|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hbags|12 years ago|reply
It's despicable and downright fucking evil that you basically accuse her of sharing her story solely because she wants attention.
The worst part of your god-awful post is that it's currently pinned to the top of this board.
The fact that your disgusting, insensitive post is at the top is why women don't work in tech. They don't want to have to deal with assholes like you who have nothing better to do than say "she should do X instead of sharing her story", or whatever else you want to do to silence her, and shame her for sharing her story.
She is brave for doing anything, because she knew the world is full of assholes like you: cowardly bigots who will criticize ANY action she takes.
I'm sorry she had a problem. And I'm more sorry that HN has degraded to the point where a cowardly attack from a piece of shit like you is pinned to the top.
[+] [-] ossreality|12 years ago|reply
It's hard enough to do, at all, to confront someone. But it's another thing when you've just been thrown completely off-kilter by having a stranger inappropriately groping you in public (Plus, you think he's going to have a positive reaction to her chiding him? Somehow I doubt it.). I'll give her a pass on not reprimanding him. (Plus, your post has the distinct scent of victim blaming)
[+] [-] McGlockenshire|12 years ago|reply
This doesn't really line up with the entire second paragraph, in which she was basically groped. Groped. And then treated like a piece of meat instead of as a human being.
If that's not mistreatment, I really don't know what would be.
[+] [-] rosser|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jellicle|12 years ago|reply
Whether it's groping or just verbal putdowns of some sort, you should step forward and add yourself to the situation, making it clear that the behavior you witnessed is not acceptable to you.
Otherwise, you're part of the problem too.
[+] [-] blairbeckwith|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jpwright|12 years ago|reply
Of course that individual deserves the lion's share of the blame, but writing this off as an isolated individual acting inappropriately misses the forest for the trees (i.e. misses the root cause [culture] for the proximate cause [assholes]).
To further analogize, perhaps the bad apple was there because the bushel was poisoned?
[+] [-] rayiner|12 years ago|reply
In this case, the saying, the real one, is apropos. It might just be a few bad apples, but they taint the whole culture.
{I actually used this phrase a couple of days ago, at which point my wife hit my with some FFA knowledge.}
[+] [-] cgearhart|12 years ago|reply
Women have faced, and continue to face, challenges in tech circles. It's hard to make progress because the first step is admitting you have a problem, and it's easy for the tech community to think it's someone else's problem. Keep an eye on your own thoughts and challenge assumptions (yours and others) that marginalize gender issues.
[+] [-] DerpDerpDerp|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rayiner|12 years ago|reply
To be perfectly honest, this is something I might have thought (but even then had the sense not to say) when I was working as an engineer. The mere lack of women in tech leads to perceptions that make it unpleasant for women to enter the field. Most people interact with just a few spheres: people they work with, people they meet on the street, and their friends, which are often drawn from people they work with or people they went to school with. When you go to school with very few women, and work with very few women, as engineers usually do, your perception of the whole gender is disproportionately shaped by those women you meet on the street, in the course of day to day activities. For people who work in intellectually demanding fields, the people you meet on the street are quite likely to not be as smart as the people you work with or the people you went to school with. And that as a real impact.
[+] [-] js2|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] blhack|12 years ago|reply
People in situations like this: please if somebody is making you uncomfortable, speak up. Maybe the guy putting his hand on your leg is your boyfriend? The "good people" in the room want to make you feel comfortable, but sometimes its hard to determine if somebody is a friend or not.
[+] [-] mercer|12 years ago|reply
I'm a guy, and I tend to be quite aware of things happening around me. If I were to notice things unfold as described in this post... Assuming I'm not in charge: is it preferable that I somehow try to play a role in this, or would this only make everything more complicated/awkward. Should I stay back and just be pissed off?
What would be the best way to approach this situation?
[+] [-] sliverstorm|12 years ago|reply
Hey <NAME>, I heard somebody say you like <TECHNOLOGY>! I'm a huge fan too!
If he's resistant to your interruption, be more forceful in trying to engage him. Maybe sit down next to him. Worst-case he becomes aggressive towards you, but so long as you stay bright & friendly, everyone else will see him picking the fight. That way you can try to defuse the situation indirectly. Maybe you get him engaged in conversation, or maybe the girl seizes the moment to excuse herself. Maybe you offer to the girl, Some other girls were looking for their friend, they said she had a blue shirt, was that you?
If he seems reasonable yet misguided (rather than a total asshole who knows the girl wants nothing to do with him), you can optionally try leading him away and quietly saying something like, I noticed that girl was starting to feel uncomfortable, tone it down/back off/try a different tactic.
Anyway, that's what I'd do if I was trying to avoid making a scene.
[+] [-] prawn|12 years ago|reply
Risk is that she may avoid confrontation by saying something to defuse the situation and the groper then misses the point and just takes you as an obstacle, thinking or later saying "It's hard enough to meet women without you blocking me, man!" Response to that is easy, of course.
[+] [-] dictum|12 years ago|reply
Unfortunately, I'm jaded enough to believe that no good deed goes unpunished, so in the same situation I'd just notify the organizers.
[+] [-] _bfhp|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] wonderzombie|12 years ago|reply
If it's a true positive, you can still rebuke the aggressor politely. "Wow, that's really not cool, man. Don't you owe her an apology? What if somebody did that to your sister or mother?" You don't need to demolish the person because maybe they're not a lost cause and they can learn.
[+] [-] aferreira|12 years ago|reply
The behavior of these people should not be directly correlated with bitcoin/tech/startups/whateveryouwanttocallit.
[+] [-] hosh|12 years ago|reply
I mean, that's the whole point of having a collective ledger where every agent is untrusted. There is no one saying, "Your money is no good here," based on your gender, race, creed, or political leanings.
[+] [-] BlackDeath3|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] throwawaycoder|12 years ago|reply
The reason is that women didn't have a fair chance to get into Bitcoin in time because the community was so hostile. Therefore all the Bitcoin wealth is unfairly shifted to white men.
Edit: turns out Femcoin already exists https://bitbucket.org/valerieaurora/femcoin
[+] [-] lincolnq|12 years ago|reply
For most people, I think a single article like this is enough to "inoculate" -- to make the reader substantially more aware of potential mistakes / hidden assumptions in their social interactions, and likely change their behavior. Yet we still read lots of stories like these. I guess distributing these stories widely should help the situation.
[+] [-] ariannahsimpson|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jakejake|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] guard-of-terra|12 years ago|reply
Because I can't imagine such stories materialize in other places (of developed word and large parts of developing world either).
You just seem to have enough peculiar traits from both gender sides for a perfect storm.
[+] [-] rayshan|12 years ago|reply
Also the issue here has something to do with bitcoin attracting early adopters and groups with certain political preferences. I certainly wouldn't call the bitcoin subculture mainstream yet.
[+] [-] moron4hire|12 years ago|reply
Unfortunately, these guys creep out other guys, too, so it's often the case that you see nothing happen because nobody wants to deal with the 'tard.
But it's no excuse. Pull up your big boy pants and give the asshole the boot.
[+] [-] ljf|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ghc|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pera|12 years ago|reply
Last year my girlfriend wanted to go to a Bitcoin Meetup in Buenos Aires. Nothing like that happened in that occasion, but it was really boring imo... though it was interesting to see how many "bitcoiners" are mostly clueless about how Bitcoin actually works
btw I would change the title to "This is What it’s Like to Be a Woman."
[+] [-] Groxx|12 years ago|reply
They met assholes. Assholes are everywhere. They're guaranteed continue to be assholes until their targets stop them / make others aware that they are assholes.
Slap them (it's loud, shocking, and non-damaging). Make a scene. It's not acceptable behavior, regardless of gender or location.
[+] [-] lauradhamilton|12 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] EricDeb|12 years ago|reply
I think a lot of their statements are said to provoke a reaction from women in a "flirty" manner, not because these men are actually misogynistic. Their well-intentioned flirtatious remarks are being interpreted as sexist by women attending these events, likely because these men are inexperienced with women and unsure how to relate to them.
[+] [-] rfnslyr|12 years ago|reply
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[+] [-] unknown|12 years ago|reply
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