Just so that people that are not following Firefox OS can know some tidbits:
* The mission of Firefox OS is to bring the next billion people online. Many in the poorest classes can't afford a computer or a smartphone and with the web being a wonderful resource with the potential to transform the life of its users, Mozilla saw that it needed to focus on those that are not attended by the current crop of entry level smartphones.
* Another objective is to bring back the freedoms we enjoy in the web into the mobile ecosystem which means no walled gardens and no exclusivity in the sense that the phone uses HTML5 based apps than can be easily shared between Android, iOS, Tizen, Ubuntu, $NEWFANCY, Firefox OS. Using HTML5 based apps doesn't mean the phone needs to be online, it just means that we're using an agreed stardard to build apps on proven technology that is not owned by a single vendor. You're free to build apps and ship them just like you are free to build a webpage and place it online without the need to request permission from Apple or Google.
* Many new internet users are browsing the web thru mobile devices. In some places, mobile devices are already 25% of the internet users and rising. But there was no platform that took HTML5 and the Web as a first class citizen. Firefox OS is a hero platform for the web to prove that it can work on a mobile ecosystem and that we can all use shared technology that is interoperable instead of doing this 1990s flashback of Obj-C here and Java there thing.
DISCLAIMER: I am a Mozilla Rep and I wrote a FOSS quick guide about how to develop for Firefox OS at https://leanpub.com/quickguidefirefoxosdevelopment/ that is helping lots of new Indian developers get ready for this launch ;-)
The reviews I've read about the existing Firefox OS phones, which have reportedly cost well over $25, have not been very encouraging. Pretty much all of them have pointed out that the hardware is quite poor, and this results in a rather bad user experience. Even considering how rapidly the cost of mobile hardware has been decreasing, what will prevent a similarly negative user experience on these cheaper Firefox OS devices?
While the ideological benefits of HTML5/JavaScript/CSS "apps" are often touted, we've yet to see anything truly remarkable done using such technologies. At best, we've only really seen clones of existing Android and iOS apps, but these generally feel less responsive and less capable than their native counterparts. If Firefox OS only supports these kind of non-native apps, how is it supposed to truly compete with Android, iOS and the other mobile platforms that support these HTML5/JavaScript/CSS "apps" just fine, but also offer far more choice and capabilities to developers in the form of real native apps?
And one other thing that I rarely see considered by the advocates of Firefox OS is how we're seeing more and more used iOS and Android mobile devices ending up in developing nations. They tend to be quite affordable and usable, even if they are somewhat outdated. Why would people in developing nations pay for a new Firefox OS phone, when they can get a used Android or iOS phone that may very well perform better than the Firefox OS phone, while offering a wider selection of apps, while also costing roughly the same?
Thanks for highlighting the least emphasized but the most important aspect of the operating system, which is being completely free and open. Too often I see people criticizing Firefox OS because it looks slow and the current hardware is inferior to whatever device they have now, but to me, that's completely besides the point. The market needs an open mobile OS that respects the user's liberties, and it's only because of Firefox OS that I finally went for my first smartphone.
The OS definitely has a really long way to go and I've noticed quite a few bugs and plenty of missing essential features, but I'm optimistic about its future, provided the developers acknowledge these issues. I think people also need to be made aware that as development continues, they will be able to install the OS on other more powerful devices if they fall outside of current low end, cheap smartphone market.
On a side note, thanks for sharing the link to your guide because I've been looking all over the place for a good resource to help me start learning how to develop web applications.
While this is awesome, the bigger problem in India is that data plans are often prohibitively expensive, and the people who can afford data plans prefer swankier phones (since the phone is a status symbol).
But this is a good start, so best of luck :)
Sorry guys, HTML is faaaar from being proven technology for the apps. And it will stay that way, sorry to dissapoint you.
On the other hand: why this obession to have mobile apps built with HTML and JS. Why not fight for desktop, if you are so inklined. That does not make it any less stupid, I am just curious about the reasons.
(Apologies for this rant. I'm just hoping someone from Mozilla sees this here.)
I was very excited last year when I found out that there were phones running Firefox OS that you could actually use. I was disappointed when I found out that the only way to get my hands on the hardware in India was to fly to a different country, buy the hardware there, and fly back to India.
It's been a year since that day, and I still haven't been able to get my hands on a Firefox OS device (except briefly playing with a friend's Keon). I get excited every time there's a Firefox OS announcement from Mozilla, only to be let down by the inevitable "We're sorry, we don't ship this product to your country."
If there's a good reason Firefox OS developer devices still aren't available in India – one of the countries Mozilla is targeting with these phones – I'd like to hear it.
I've built a couple of webapps for desktop browsers, and I really like the idea of being able to use the same development stack on a mobile device. Webapps on Android and iOS can do a lot these days, but there's always that one API that you need that is missing. I was hoping I could build something fun with FirefoxOS, but I suppose I should just suck it up already and learn how to use the Android SDK.
Same experience here, In fact we ported our enterprise mobile platform on FF OS early 2013 but the company (Geeksphone) who was supposed to provide the developer phones did not even respond to emails, we hope the situation changes this time. These are instances where you cannot help but feel the world is not as global as it should be. A transcript of the emails below
Subject: Firefox Developer Preview Phone
3 messages
XXX XXX <####@###.com> Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 7:49 PM
To: [email protected]
Hello there,
Can you send me info on the Firefox Developer Preview phone along with pricing and availability date? We
expect to be there at the MWC at Barcelona end of Feb and would like to have the phone tested before that
--
For a $25 price tag, this has the potential to appeal to a lot of Indians in the rural areas and being a potential rival to other in house android brands like Micromax et al.
Even if they support the basic subset of functionality exposed by Android, it should be more then enough for it do well. Looking forward to more updates on the launch.
When the FirefoxOS developer device was posted on here some time ago half the comments were about how it was missing feature X or Y that Android or iPhone has had for ages, and therefore it just couldn't compete.
A $70 price point doesn't put them in competition with other smart phones, it puts Mozilla at the fore of a new class of customer.
I just bought a $69 Nokia Lumia 521 (Windows Phone) off contract. Mozilla isn't at the forefront here - both Nokia/Microsoft and Motorola are driving down the off-contract price point.
Where do you see $70? The article talks about current phones that you can buy right now at that price - those are different from the new $25 phones (which will be sold in India in "the next few months" also according to the article):
"The current handsets, which are sold via eBay, retail at £59.99 in the UK, or $69.99 in the US."
Mozilla is not selling phones in the U.S. Mozilla doesn't actually sell phones. Carriers and Factories sell phones. The $70 phone you mention is being sold by ZTE using Mozilla Firefox OS as its system.
The problem that has plagued these inexpensive phones is that you're not usually selling to a typical "consumer." That is, the people who buy these phones, won't buy much else, so it will hurt the ecosystem in the long run. This happened to Palm with the Pre and Pixi. I created some apps for it and it was clear that the demographic wasn't shelling out money for apps or anything else, this makes it really unattractive as a platform for developers.
Agree with you here. At this price point, smart phone is starting to be a commodity item, just like the shirt you are wearing, like the cup of coffee you drank this morning or like that piece of apple you ate.
Just need for the service provider to give ground breaking plans. Imagine having a flat data plan for $5/month at LTE speed with this type of smart phone.
What makes Firefox OS inherently more cost effective than Android? I doubt you'd need a weaker CPU or less memory for the same amount of responsiveness. Or is that it's possible for Android phones to be as inexpensive, but no one's bothered creating a decent one at that price yet (just like no one bothered creating even a decent $130 one until the Moto E).
Fewer layers between machine and app -- just Gonk (linux layer) and Gecko (application runtime). With Android, you have all the Android runtime in between.
From Indian perspective it may not be a good decision for Mozilla to team up with Intex and Spice. They produce phones priced cheap but their track record in quality is not so good. People have become more quality conscious now. I think it may end up like Tata Nano - cheap car but not many takers.
Its a shame that Tmobile US has such odd gsm frequencies than the rest of the world, and as such are unsupported by any of the FFOS phones so far.
With their embracing of prepaid plans combined with inexpensive smart phones could really open up anytime information access for people who cannot otherwise afford it.
"T-Mobile’s network currently only supports GSM-compatible phones.
Only 3G phones that support the 1700-MHz band are compatible (not all 3G phones support it). If you own a 3G phone that does not support the 1700-MHz band, it will operate at 2G (EDGE) speeds on our network."
Do you mean that data rates with Tmobile will be slow? It seems to be supported otherwise?
Why did they have to announce it just 2 days after I bought a new andorid phone! I could have saved some money.
Joking aside this news is very exciting for me mainly because I will finally have a good reason to try out pouch db.
One question that I have though is how the updates to the os are delivered to the user? Are they managed by manufacturers or can any one with access to internet just download it from a central repository?
A request: I implore that you keep a good stock of phones ready. Because I don't want it to go out of stock after the first day at sale.
This segment has potential to crack into rural markets of India where "Nokia" and chinese handsets rule . Too early to comment till features are not released . Lot of chinese handsets provide loud music players and camera ( though not reliable).
Respect for the endeavour. But India presents many challenges. The masses this phone targets may not be able to use it effectively unless the UI is extremely simple. Remember that India has most illiterates on the planet and the most people who earn less than $2 a day. Smart phone penetration is a measly 10% now though growing at a healthy 50% per year. This is despite smart phones being made available at less than $75 price point already. Would be glued on the ground.
People in India are Brand concious like anywhere else, Intex and Spice do not really command any good selling space in India. It would be better if Mozilla works with Intex and Spice to just get the Hardware and Software done and let the New brand name be Mozilla Or Firefox Phone something on Similar lines, this way, the brand recall and brand recognition will be instant with regards to the phone.
British news headlines seem to use these far more than I would expect. However, in this case it's perhaps not unreasonable: These are not yet on sale at that price; while the Mozilla COO "suggested" that they would retail at that, it's not clear that he's the one setting the final price - and the linked announcement actually does not include the $25 pricing.
[+] [-] soapdog|11 years ago|reply
* The mission of Firefox OS is to bring the next billion people online. Many in the poorest classes can't afford a computer or a smartphone and with the web being a wonderful resource with the potential to transform the life of its users, Mozilla saw that it needed to focus on those that are not attended by the current crop of entry level smartphones.
* Another objective is to bring back the freedoms we enjoy in the web into the mobile ecosystem which means no walled gardens and no exclusivity in the sense that the phone uses HTML5 based apps than can be easily shared between Android, iOS, Tizen, Ubuntu, $NEWFANCY, Firefox OS. Using HTML5 based apps doesn't mean the phone needs to be online, it just means that we're using an agreed stardard to build apps on proven technology that is not owned by a single vendor. You're free to build apps and ship them just like you are free to build a webpage and place it online without the need to request permission from Apple or Google.
* Many new internet users are browsing the web thru mobile devices. In some places, mobile devices are already 25% of the internet users and rising. But there was no platform that took HTML5 and the Web as a first class citizen. Firefox OS is a hero platform for the web to prove that it can work on a mobile ecosystem and that we can all use shared technology that is interoperable instead of doing this 1990s flashback of Obj-C here and Java there thing.
DISCLAIMER: I am a Mozilla Rep and I wrote a FOSS quick guide about how to develop for Firefox OS at https://leanpub.com/quickguidefirefoxosdevelopment/ that is helping lots of new Indian developers get ready for this launch ;-)
[+] [-] Pacabel|11 years ago|reply
While the ideological benefits of HTML5/JavaScript/CSS "apps" are often touted, we've yet to see anything truly remarkable done using such technologies. At best, we've only really seen clones of existing Android and iOS apps, but these generally feel less responsive and less capable than their native counterparts. If Firefox OS only supports these kind of non-native apps, how is it supposed to truly compete with Android, iOS and the other mobile platforms that support these HTML5/JavaScript/CSS "apps" just fine, but also offer far more choice and capabilities to developers in the form of real native apps?
And one other thing that I rarely see considered by the advocates of Firefox OS is how we're seeing more and more used iOS and Android mobile devices ending up in developing nations. They tend to be quite affordable and usable, even if they are somewhat outdated. Why would people in developing nations pay for a new Firefox OS phone, when they can get a used Android or iOS phone that may very well perform better than the Firefox OS phone, while offering a wider selection of apps, while also costing roughly the same?
Can you address these concerns?
[+] [-] LowDog|11 years ago|reply
The OS definitely has a really long way to go and I've noticed quite a few bugs and plenty of missing essential features, but I'm optimistic about its future, provided the developers acknowledge these issues. I think people also need to be made aware that as development continues, they will be able to install the OS on other more powerful devices if they fall outside of current low end, cheap smartphone market.
On a side note, thanks for sharing the link to your guide because I've been looking all over the place for a good resource to help me start learning how to develop web applications.
[+] [-] CmonDev|11 years ago|reply
1. JavaScript and HTML are themselves a 1990s flashback.
2. We want a choice of technology, not being pigeonholed into one "good for all" thing. JavaScript sucks, and HTML sucks equally.
[+] [-] tsycho|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] frowaway001|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rimantas|11 years ago|reply
On the other hand: why this obession to have mobile apps built with HTML and JS. Why not fight for desktop, if you are so inklined. That does not make it any less stupid, I am just curious about the reasons.
[+] [-] GeneralMaximus|11 years ago|reply
I was very excited last year when I found out that there were phones running Firefox OS that you could actually use. I was disappointed when I found out that the only way to get my hands on the hardware in India was to fly to a different country, buy the hardware there, and fly back to India.
It's been a year since that day, and I still haven't been able to get my hands on a Firefox OS device (except briefly playing with a friend's Keon). I get excited every time there's a Firefox OS announcement from Mozilla, only to be let down by the inevitable "We're sorry, we don't ship this product to your country."
If there's a good reason Firefox OS developer devices still aren't available in India – one of the countries Mozilla is targeting with these phones – I'd like to hear it.
I've built a couple of webapps for desktop browsers, and I really like the idea of being able to use the same development stack on a mobile device. Webapps on Android and iOS can do a lot these days, but there's always that one API that you need that is missing. I was hoping I could build something fun with FirefoxOS, but I suppose I should just suck it up already and learn how to use the Android SDK.
[+] [-] avighnay|11 years ago|reply
Subject: Firefox Developer Preview Phone
3 messages
XXX XXX <####@###.com> Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 7:49 PM To: [email protected]
Hello there, Can you send me info on the Firefox Developer Preview phone along with pricing and availability date? We expect to be there at the MWC at Barcelona end of Feb and would like to have the phone tested before that --
regards, xxx
-----------------------------------------------------------
XXX XXX <####@###.com> Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 11:39 AM
To: [email protected] Hello there I have not received any response from you. Please do send the info on the phones.
regards, xxx
-----------------------------------------------------------
XXX XXX <####@###.com> Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 1:24 PM
To: [email protected] Any update from your side?
regards, xxx
[+] [-] contingencies|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hatred|11 years ago|reply
Even if they support the basic subset of functionality exposed by Android, it should be more then enough for it do well. Looking forward to more updates on the launch.
[+] [-] Zikes|11 years ago|reply
When the FirefoxOS developer device was posted on here some time ago half the comments were about how it was missing feature X or Y that Android or iPhone has had for ages, and therefore it just couldn't compete.
A $70 price point doesn't put them in competition with other smart phones, it puts Mozilla at the fore of a new class of customer.
[+] [-] caryme|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rhelmer|11 years ago|reply
"The current handsets, which are sold via eBay, retail at £59.99 in the UK, or $69.99 in the US."
[+] [-] soapdog|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] codezero|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] yitchelle|11 years ago|reply
Just need for the service provider to give ground breaking plans. Imagine having a flat data plan for $5/month at LTE speed with this type of smart phone.
[+] [-] akgerber|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] higherpurpose|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] diafygi|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] thoughtpalette|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zhyder|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] abrowne|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jestinjoy1|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dpeck|11 years ago|reply
With their embracing of prepaid plans combined with inexpensive smart phones could really open up anytime information access for people who cannot otherwise afford it.
[+] [-] b_emery|11 years ago|reply
"T-Mobile’s network currently only supports GSM-compatible phones. Only 3G phones that support the 1700-MHz band are compatible (not all 3G phones support it). If you own a 3G phone that does not support the 1700-MHz band, it will operate at 2G (EDGE) speeds on our network."
Do you mean that data rates with Tmobile will be slow? It seems to be supported otherwise?
[+] [-] lmorchard|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lxt|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] brickcap|11 years ago|reply
Joking aside this news is very exciting for me mainly because I will finally have a good reason to try out pouch db.
One question that I have though is how the updates to the os are delivered to the user? Are they managed by manufacturers or can any one with access to internet just download it from a central repository?
A request: I implore that you keep a good stock of phones ready. Because I don't want it to go out of stock after the first day at sale.
[+] [-] linux_devil|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] anuraj|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DanBC|11 years ago|reply
Let's hope they can release that data in an open format to allow researchers to make use of it.
[+] [-] Naushad|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] spike021|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] PhasmaFelis|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] snori74|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hyp0|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] known|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] enthdegree|11 years ago|reply