Their "autopilot" is basically a "driver assist" system: lane-keeping plus adaptive cruise control. Mercedes, BMW, Cadillac, Volkswagen, Ford, etc. already have that. Tesla's is rumored to be the Daimler-Benz system.
That's good enough for about 99% of freeway driving. The last 1% is a problem, which is why none of the big car companies call it automatic driving. Most of them put in systems to insure the driver keeps paying attention, such as insisting on hands on the wheel in auto mode.
We're approaching the "deadly valley" - automatic driving that's almost good enough that the driver can stop paying attention. On the far side of the "deadly valley" is full-auto driving, including automatic handling of unusual and emergency situations, which is where Google and CMU/Cadillac are headed.
The minimum safe level is probably a system that can get the vehicle stopped autonomously when it's headed into a situation it can't handle. Beeping the driver to take over is not going to work in practice. As soon as hands-off driving is available, people will use it when tired, drunk, or texting.
The interesting thing is that, based on my experience with the cruise control/driver assist on the 5 Series, it's far better at responding quickly to changing road situations, like when somebody in front of you just jumps hard on the breaks. The car will take it all the way down to a stop in just a few seconds - quite often before the driver would have even realized something was happening, and way before they could have reacted to prevent an accident.
I'm guessing once the technology is widespread, we'll see almost total elimination of rear-end accidents on the freeway - the technology really is quite amazing.
Who downvoted you? This is a very serious issue. A partial autopilot for cars is worse than useless: it will create distracted drivers who can't react when the car encounters something it can't handle. Self-driving cars need to be either 100% or 0%.
As a driver of a car with these systems (Audi, having a 'Lane assist' and 'ACC'): The implementation is absolutely crushingly useless, every day.
Lane assist kinda, sorta works (I can choose if the car will actively try to stay in the lane and/or if it's going to alarm me by vibrating the steering wheel when I cross over into another lane). It's limited to the Autobahn though and really more often then not just doesn't recognizes the lanes.
IF it does, it has the kind of protection you describe. Unfortunately that makes it even less useful. On a really straight road I cannot turn it on, because it's going to beep at me after 1-2 seconds. You need to drive (I exaggerate, but the idea's true) like in a Hollywood movie from the 60s (or the Simpsons intro), turning the wheel left and right for no reason.
(The ACC in this car is crap as well, but .. let's leave it with lane assist for now)
I am extremely skeptical that this system can work, in general, any time soon. Even in a Tesla.
>We're approaching the "deadly valley" - automatic driving that's almost good enough that the driver can stop paying attention.
Infiniti has a commercial out now that I see frequently while streaming TV that shows someone who should not be on the road but is enabled by the driver assist features.
Maybe one mandatory feature of driver assist should be that if the car intervenes more than 2 times in 10 minutes its next step should be to find a safe place to pull over and stop.
> The minimum safe level is probably a system that can get the vehicle stopped autonomously when it's headed into a situation it can't handle. Beeping the driver to take over is not going to work in practice.
I think the MVP for an automatic driving system—presuming we don't just get the AI version out soon enough—would be your suggestion (stopping the car when it can't handle a situation), plus passing control of the vehicle to the moral equivalent of OnStar. There'd be call-centres full of people remotely driving drunk/sleeping people's cars for them using the vehicle's instrumentation+the driver's pre-programmed route. Like a taxi service where your own car is the taxi.
>>>Mercedes, BMW, Cadillac, Volkswagen, Ford, etc. already have that.
So? None of these manufacturers have a carbon-friendly drive train. The fact that Tesla added a software feature "late in the game" is no 'bonus' to the already-contenders. Actually, lets see Mercedes' obstacle-avoidance compete with the SpaceX/Tesla crowd. I'm willing to suffer the down-votes until such a point is reached that we all, conscientiously, acknowledge the docking maneuvers allowed by a SpaceX/Tesla co-operation. In the meantime I'd like to point out to you: software features as an "also-ran" is not really a dilemma.
Among the auto manufacturers offerings, some 'lane assist' systems can only handle the most simple of turns (taking you out of the lane, _very scary_). These systems are too simple IMHO with single cameras and or no mix of additional systems.
Tesla seems to want a system that is more complex. Things like "have the car come meet you from where it was parked", lane _crossing_ (let alone lane keep assist), and eventually on-off ramp driving. All with live updates rather than going into the dealer.
What makes this offering (potentially) different is the ambitious intended use of the system, something which would make even a Daimler-Benz lawyer cringe.
I find it so odd that automated driving and auto-safety features (adaptive cruise, lane assist, etc.) are being so aggressively developed.
These features have never once appealed to me and I can't imagine using them even if I had them. I find it very hard to square the "American Love of Driving" and the cultural connotations that driving has in the US with systems that relegate the driver to a passenger ...
Maybe for stop and go rush hour driving ... but beyond that, I don't see the appeal.
Are the current generation systems in a state where they can recognise and deal with some high percentage of that 1% by bringing the car to a safe stop? I realise of course that stopping can in itself be dangerous in certain situations, but it's probably going to be safer on average than just barrelling on regardless of what's coming.
I can imagine that not being default behaviour because it doesn't match driving norms, but perhaps it would be better?
> We're approaching the "deadly valley" - automatic driving that's almost good enough that the driver can stop paying attention.
This sounds to me like the "technology right now is crossing a distinct line into doom" fallacy. It seems like the same could have been said when automobiles started being operated by average folks rather than professional chauffeurs, when the synchromesh was invented, automatic transmissions, antilock brakes, cruise control, adaptive cruise control, and so on.
It is funny that on HN the discussion is mainly focused on driver assist and its merits/drawbacks, while the real innovation is being ignored: this thing has two engines, increased range (on all but top of the line versions where range is decreased by only 10 miles), and is nearly a 10 second car, with 0-60 time in just over 3 seconds. Oh and roller coaster-like lateral acceleration of 1 g. Also note that the range of the dual motor setup is the result of software optimization of which engine to run at what power level at what point. This is the really exciting new development here.
There is no innovation in having two motors in a car, unless your restricting the statement to a purely electric car. Many cars produced by others do the more difficult, combine and electric and petrol motor. There may even be examples of dual electric motor vehicles.
The performance should be expected since they engineered for that. Electric motors have their torque immediately and it becomes a balance of suspension and tires in effectively using it.
What I am disappointed in that there is only ten more miles. Frankly why is a 100k car than only gets a little over two hundred miles lauded so much? If anything its a demonstration that the technology IS NOT THERE.
I was really hoping D was double range. When a 100k electric gets 500 a charge call me, then I will be impressed. Tesla better hurry, many of the big manufactures plan to field 200 mile range affordable electrics no later than 2017
Thanks for saying this. I was scratching my head as to why the top comments focused on the wrong thing. Distributed coordinated engines is in my opinion hugely exciting
>Model S comes standard with a forward looking camera, radar, and 360-degree ultrasonic sensors that actively monitor the surrounding roadway. Progressive software updates over time will enable sophisticated convenience and safety features that use these sensors to respond to real world conditions. These features will ultimately give Model S Autopilot capability on the highway from on-ramp to off-ramp.
At this stage all you need to install is the machine learning algorithm so it can watch and learn what real drivers do when faced with the conditions it's sensing.
It seems that Tesla's autopilot is pretty similar to other highway autopilots from manufacturers like Mercedes Benz. The new feature seems to be automatic reading of speed signs.
Impressive...I wonder how effective these "autopilot" features are in snow and ice road conditions? Does the autopilot and traction control work together?
California doesn't have to worry about these things but a lot of northern markets (Canada/Norway) do.
More impressive than the "autopilot" is the D option, at least to me. The P85D has 691 hp and will do 0-60 in 3.2 seconds. If that 0-60 holds true it should the quickest accelerating production 4-door sedan, besting the E63 AMG S (3.4 sec). And 691 hp makes in nearly the most powerful.
The "autopilot" is similar to what Mercedes and BMW have had for a while (software updates is a nice capability), but the performance is best in class.
I don't understand why they don't solve the problem of sitting in traffic (relatively safe) in a hands-free way first. Would help so many people be more productive, etc..
I am surprised that they did not stream the announcement or immediately put it up for viewing. I think they have the opportunity to turn their announcements into as much of an event as Apple does.
Certainly the amount of hype they got from Elon's tweet shows that people are paying attention, I bet there are people clamoring for Tesla news in the same way people are clamoring for Apple news.
ECC? Yes, but that's not all; safety-critical applications like automotive often use two cores running the same code in lockstep, each with their own memory. If the behavior of the two CPUs goes out of sync, the processor can be configured to take corrective actions, such as resetting, halting, and/or going into a failsafe mode.
TI has an overview of the safety features in their Hercules microcontrollers here:
It's not really 'autonomous driving' so you might be overestimating the safety factor implied by the term 'autopilot'.
I'm not a car person or expert in the field but I've done a little bit of work on automotive systems. As the other responders pointed out these systems are designed to, ECC or not, do things like (at the slightest sign of inconsistency or error)
- reset and recover very quickly
- enter reduced functionality or failsafe modes
- fully disable themselves and anything that might cause you to rely on them
They're fundamentally built around the eventuality of them failing and with consideration of the things that need to happen when they fail. They don't usually rely on 'well, we'll just put in a somewhat more reliable component'.
TBH, assuming the system either has a relatively short log of the traffic situation, and / or does a few thousand calculations a second, I can't imagine how a random bit level error would severely influence the system. Unless, you know, it causes a full system crash, but I'm sure there's a lot of measures against that.
I really dislike the idea of vehicles capable of that kind of acceleration on city streets. It could make for some truly spectacular accidents at intersections.
It's a shame that superfast impractical cars like this get all the good press and hype, while a sensible version with limited acceleration and top speed but with much greater range would be boring. The latter would be a much greater benefit to humanity.
I'm sure you've seen all the same "street racing" videos with folks crashing that I have. Yes, it's dangerous, but typically what you aren't seeing is that the driver has completely disabled the (normally always-on) traction aids.
I hate hooligan drivers as much as / more than the next guy, and the "horsepower wars" are getting a little out of control, but I don't think that the Model S is any less safe than a Mustang Camaro, or Charger that one can get for less than half the price.
(disclaimer: I'm a huge automotive enthusiast, and regularly take my car on the track)
My 3-year old CLS can do most of not all of these "new features." Including, parallel parking itself, alerting me to someone in my blind spot via audible, visual and haptic feedback via the steering column shaking, keep its distance from the car in front via Distronic Adaptive Cruise Control and slow to zero (0) during a braking situation, alert me via haptic feedback (steering column shake) if I swerve out of my lane and for shits and giggles has night vision (totally useless for me in the city at least).
But what's even more impressive is that the brand new S-Class I just picked up does all of this and then some: it has a pedestrian awareness system: the car will brake if it senses a collision with a pedestrian. It has magic body control: a system that scans the road ahead via stereoscopic cameras for potholes and uneven pavement surfaces and adjust the suspension in real-time for a smooth ride (this is an insane feature). It has active steer assist! It will keep me in my line by applying brake pressure to the opposing wheels and will not let you swerve out. It also has another two features that I simply can't think of at the moment. But there is a really neat video from Mercedes Benz on all of this somewhere.
I also believe Tesla's entire drive train and technology is made by Daimler-Benz.
Finally, like Animats pointed out - all of these features are not necessarily a good thing for the heavily distracted driver these days. These features open the door for even more careless driving (texting, fiddling with Google on your Tesla screen and etc.) I believe Mercedes actually have self driving technology working for a few years now (they have a freight truck that is completely autonomous) but decided to pull full self driving from the S-Class due to many of these issues raised.
I guess what irks me most about a lot of these Tesla drivers (from reading articles, blogs, posts and watching the news tonight after the unveiling) is that they are so hung up on the damn hype, they do not see past the issues that still remain for the company. Yes, Musk is a visionary guy, no doubt. But too much hype here. Some dumb women even said on the news when asked how she likes the new car "I'll let you know tomorrow morning." Clearly alluding to her caring solely about the lousy $20k of shares she probably has in the company.
I think another big problem for Tesla (and yes, going off track here) is the fact that not everyone can afford a $70k+ car. Tesla needs to get a sub-$40k car if they want to actually sustain this model. I just don't see how they can by selling a niche car to a niche market.
Finally, like others said, we need to go 100% autonomous or 0%. The middle ground is scary. I bought two Mercedes because I love how amazingly engineered they are. They are at the pinnacle of modern engineering and perhaps the best built cars on earth (most likely). I enjoy driving. I don't enjoy playing with a touchscreen or texting. The features I have on my cars compliment the driving experience, they make it better. I fear many people will start buying cars (whether Teslas or cheaper) for these "lazy" features that allude to you not having to concentrate as much any more. This is a scary premonition and I don't see it ending well.
The most exciting part of this for me is not the immediate features that are being released, but rather the hardware being put in place that can open up a bunch of neat possibilities via software upgrades.
>I think another big problem for Tesla (and yes, going off track here) is the fact that not everyone can afford a $70k+ car. Tesla needs to get a sub-$40k car if they want to actually sustain this model. I just don't see how they can by selling a niche car to a niche market.
They're working on that, it's called the "Model 3". But it's still a while away for them to reach the economies of scale for them to be able to produce it.
Seems like more and more cars have radar/ultrasound sensors. Won't this eventually lead to interference? Can such a system be influenced by, say, a nutter with a stronger radar?
I was about to get all OOH, CAR PORN STATS but then I saw the Dodge Challenger/Charger SRT Hellcats... which are literally half the price, and faster. Womp womp.
Somewhat... In a straight line ya, not in a road course (most likely). Definitely agree with you on the point of price and yet, it's sort of hard to compare them. If drag racing/street racing is what you're after yah, Dodge all the way.
I love tesla for it's all electric cars.
But do we hate driving so much now that we're taking drivers out of the driving experience?
This is not just for tesla but any other automaker.
If you're doing 'self driving' cars, why not make better technology for public transportation which makes way more sense. Not to mention this picture: http://randomdude.com/images/car-bus-bike.jpg
[+] [-] Animats|11 years ago|reply
That's good enough for about 99% of freeway driving. The last 1% is a problem, which is why none of the big car companies call it automatic driving. Most of them put in systems to insure the driver keeps paying attention, such as insisting on hands on the wheel in auto mode.
We're approaching the "deadly valley" - automatic driving that's almost good enough that the driver can stop paying attention. On the far side of the "deadly valley" is full-auto driving, including automatic handling of unusual and emergency situations, which is where Google and CMU/Cadillac are headed.
The minimum safe level is probably a system that can get the vehicle stopped autonomously when it's headed into a situation it can't handle. Beeping the driver to take over is not going to work in practice. As soon as hands-off driving is available, people will use it when tired, drunk, or texting.
[+] [-] ghshephard|11 years ago|reply
I'm guessing once the technology is widespread, we'll see almost total elimination of rear-end accidents on the freeway - the technology really is quite amazing.
[+] [-] FeeTinesAMady|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] darklajid|11 years ago|reply
Lane assist kinda, sorta works (I can choose if the car will actively try to stay in the lane and/or if it's going to alarm me by vibrating the steering wheel when I cross over into another lane). It's limited to the Autobahn though and really more often then not just doesn't recognizes the lanes. IF it does, it has the kind of protection you describe. Unfortunately that makes it even less useful. On a really straight road I cannot turn it on, because it's going to beep at me after 1-2 seconds. You need to drive (I exaggerate, but the idea's true) like in a Hollywood movie from the 60s (or the Simpsons intro), turning the wheel left and right for no reason.
(The ACC in this car is crap as well, but .. let's leave it with lane assist for now)
I am extremely skeptical that this system can work, in general, any time soon. Even in a Tesla.
[+] [-] chrisBob|11 years ago|reply
Infiniti has a commercial out now that I see frequently while streaming TV that shows someone who should not be on the road but is enabled by the driver assist features.
Maybe one mandatory feature of driver assist should be that if the car intervenes more than 2 times in 10 minutes its next step should be to find a safe place to pull over and stop.
[+] [-] gadders|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] derefr|11 years ago|reply
I think the MVP for an automatic driving system—presuming we don't just get the AI version out soon enough—would be your suggestion (stopping the car when it can't handle a situation), plus passing control of the vehicle to the moral equivalent of OnStar. There'd be call-centres full of people remotely driving drunk/sleeping people's cars for them using the vehicle's instrumentation+the driver's pre-programmed route. Like a taxi service where your own car is the taxi.
[+] [-] ibisum|11 years ago|reply
So? None of these manufacturers have a carbon-friendly drive train. The fact that Tesla added a software feature "late in the game" is no 'bonus' to the already-contenders. Actually, lets see Mercedes' obstacle-avoidance compete with the SpaceX/Tesla crowd. I'm willing to suffer the down-votes until such a point is reached that we all, conscientiously, acknowledge the docking maneuvers allowed by a SpaceX/Tesla co-operation. In the meantime I'd like to point out to you: software features as an "also-ran" is not really a dilemma.
[+] [-] jjm|11 years ago|reply
Tesla seems to want a system that is more complex. Things like "have the car come meet you from where it was parked", lane _crossing_ (let alone lane keep assist), and eventually on-off ramp driving. All with live updates rather than going into the dealer.
What makes this offering (potentially) different is the ambitious intended use of the system, something which would make even a Daimler-Benz lawyer cringe.
[+] [-] rsync|11 years ago|reply
These features have never once appealed to me and I can't imagine using them even if I had them. I find it very hard to square the "American Love of Driving" and the cultural connotations that driving has in the US with systems that relegate the driver to a passenger ...
Maybe for stop and go rush hour driving ... but beyond that, I don't see the appeal.
[+] [-] mrow84|11 years ago|reply
I can imagine that not being default behaviour because it doesn't match driving norms, but perhaps it would be better?
[+] [-] eyeface|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] baddox|11 years ago|reply
This sounds to me like the "technology right now is crossing a distinct line into doom" fallacy. It seems like the same could have been said when automobiles started being operated by average folks rather than professional chauffeurs, when the synchromesh was invented, automatic transmissions, antilock brakes, cruise control, adaptive cruise control, and so on.
[+] [-] IgorPartola|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Shivetya|11 years ago|reply
The performance should be expected since they engineered for that. Electric motors have their torque immediately and it becomes a balance of suspension and tires in effectively using it.
What I am disappointed in that there is only ten more miles. Frankly why is a 100k car than only gets a little over two hundred miles lauded so much? If anything its a demonstration that the technology IS NOT THERE.
I was really hoping D was double range. When a 100k electric gets 500 a charge call me, then I will be impressed. Tesla better hurry, many of the big manufactures plan to field 200 mile range affordable electrics no later than 2017
[+] [-] cstpdk|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] sxp|11 years ago|reply
>Model S comes standard with a forward looking camera, radar, and 360-degree ultrasonic sensors that actively monitor the surrounding roadway. Progressive software updates over time will enable sophisticated convenience and safety features that use these sensors to respond to real world conditions. These features will ultimately give Model S Autopilot capability on the highway from on-ramp to off-ramp.
That's a pretty nice TODO to leave in the code :)
[+] [-] unknown|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] dwd|11 years ago|reply
Absolutely brilliant!
[+] [-] yelnatz|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dirtyaura|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mpg33|11 years ago|reply
California doesn't have to worry about these things but a lot of northern markets (Canada/Norway) do.
[+] [-] antoncohen|11 years ago|reply
The "autopilot" is similar to what Mercedes and BMW have had for a while (software updates is a nice capability), but the performance is best in class.
[+] [-] chrismorgan|11 years ago|reply
“Wir präsentieren Autopilot und Dual Motor Allradantrieb”
Did they confuse Austria (de_AT) with Australia (en_AU)?
[+] [-] blackdogie|11 years ago|reply
That will confuse those Australians this morning.
[+] [-] sschueller|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tmsh|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lylebarrere|11 years ago|reply
Certainly the amount of hype they got from Elon's tweet shows that people are paying attention, I bet there are people clamoring for Tesla news in the same way people are clamoring for Apple news.
[+] [-] Sammi|11 years ago|reply
:)
[+] [-] ck2|11 years ago|reply
Autopilot is not a place I want bit level errors to happen.
ps. not really a car person but dang that Model X looks nice - announced Feb 2012 but still not shipping?
[+] [-] duskwuff|11 years ago|reply
TI has an overview of the safety features in their Hercules microcontrollers here:
http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/spry178/spry178.pdf
[+] [-] glurgh|11 years ago|reply
I'm not a car person or expert in the field but I've done a little bit of work on automotive systems. As the other responders pointed out these systems are designed to, ECC or not, do things like (at the slightest sign of inconsistency or error)
- reset and recover very quickly
- enter reduced functionality or failsafe modes
- fully disable themselves and anything that might cause you to rely on them
They're fundamentally built around the eventuality of them failing and with consideration of the things that need to happen when they fail. They don't usually rely on 'well, we'll just put in a somewhat more reliable component'.
[+] [-] Cthulhu_|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] anonfunction|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] wffurr|11 years ago|reply
It's a shame that superfast impractical cars like this get all the good press and hype, while a sensible version with limited acceleration and top speed but with much greater range would be boring. The latter would be a much greater benefit to humanity.
[+] [-] chadgeidel|11 years ago|reply
I hate hooligan drivers as much as / more than the next guy, and the "horsepower wars" are getting a little out of control, but I don't think that the Model S is any less safe than a Mustang Camaro, or Charger that one can get for less than half the price.
(disclaimer: I'm a huge automotive enthusiast, and regularly take my car on the track)
[+] [-] dakrisht|11 years ago|reply
My 3-year old CLS can do most of not all of these "new features." Including, parallel parking itself, alerting me to someone in my blind spot via audible, visual and haptic feedback via the steering column shaking, keep its distance from the car in front via Distronic Adaptive Cruise Control and slow to zero (0) during a braking situation, alert me via haptic feedback (steering column shake) if I swerve out of my lane and for shits and giggles has night vision (totally useless for me in the city at least).
But what's even more impressive is that the brand new S-Class I just picked up does all of this and then some: it has a pedestrian awareness system: the car will brake if it senses a collision with a pedestrian. It has magic body control: a system that scans the road ahead via stereoscopic cameras for potholes and uneven pavement surfaces and adjust the suspension in real-time for a smooth ride (this is an insane feature). It has active steer assist! It will keep me in my line by applying brake pressure to the opposing wheels and will not let you swerve out. It also has another two features that I simply can't think of at the moment. But there is a really neat video from Mercedes Benz on all of this somewhere.
I also believe Tesla's entire drive train and technology is made by Daimler-Benz.
Finally, like Animats pointed out - all of these features are not necessarily a good thing for the heavily distracted driver these days. These features open the door for even more careless driving (texting, fiddling with Google on your Tesla screen and etc.) I believe Mercedes actually have self driving technology working for a few years now (they have a freight truck that is completely autonomous) but decided to pull full self driving from the S-Class due to many of these issues raised.
I guess what irks me most about a lot of these Tesla drivers (from reading articles, blogs, posts and watching the news tonight after the unveiling) is that they are so hung up on the damn hype, they do not see past the issues that still remain for the company. Yes, Musk is a visionary guy, no doubt. But too much hype here. Some dumb women even said on the news when asked how she likes the new car "I'll let you know tomorrow morning." Clearly alluding to her caring solely about the lousy $20k of shares she probably has in the company.
I think another big problem for Tesla (and yes, going off track here) is the fact that not everyone can afford a $70k+ car. Tesla needs to get a sub-$40k car if they want to actually sustain this model. I just don't see how they can by selling a niche car to a niche market.
Finally, like others said, we need to go 100% autonomous or 0%. The middle ground is scary. I bought two Mercedes because I love how amazingly engineered they are. They are at the pinnacle of modern engineering and perhaps the best built cars on earth (most likely). I enjoy driving. I don't enjoy playing with a touchscreen or texting. The features I have on my cars compliment the driving experience, they make it better. I fear many people will start buying cars (whether Teslas or cheaper) for these "lazy" features that allude to you not having to concentrate as much any more. This is a scary premonition and I don't see it ending well.
[+] [-] jp555|11 years ago|reply
You may have it backwards; Tesla is building the powertrain for the Mercedes electric A-class E-cell.
[+] [-] jhgg|11 years ago|reply
>I think another big problem for Tesla (and yes, going off track here) is the fact that not everyone can afford a $70k+ car. Tesla needs to get a sub-$40k car if they want to actually sustain this model. I just don't see how they can by selling a niche car to a niche market.
They're working on that, it's called the "Model 3". But it's still a while away for them to reach the economies of scale for them to be able to produce it.
[+] [-] fnayr|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Tharkun|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jonmrodriguez|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] peterwwillis|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] joyeuse6701|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] grecy|11 years ago|reply
And of course, it's only until you go to a gas station.
[+] [-] jhgg|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Datsundere|11 years ago|reply
If you're doing 'self driving' cars, why not make better technology for public transportation which makes way more sense. Not to mention this picture: http://randomdude.com/images/car-bus-bike.jpg
[+] [-] agumonkey|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] jolux|11 years ago|reply