I am incredibly grateful to Cook for this, not least because of how it will affect young gay people.
When I was a child, I felt generally good about myself. I was reasonably smart, well-spoken, curious, and so on, and I wanted to do something important with my life. Some nagging part of me suspected I was gay from very early on, but I resisted it intensely. I wasn't really afraid of being mistreated, although I probably should have been. People were already calling me names so I wasn't worried about that. More important for me was my sense that being gay meant being marginal.
There hasn't been a gay President, and at least when I was a child there weren't many gay people visible to me at all. The image of gay people presented to me were not powerful, focused on frivolous things, and consumed by attitude and lifestyle. If I wanted to do something important, I couldn't possibly be gay. It just didn't fit.
Knowing that the CEO of not only the most powerful company, but also the most admirable company, is gay would have helped me enormously. I always wanted apple products even before I could afford them, and this would have meant a clearly visible path forward. I can't imagine how happy this must be making some confused young people, given how happy it's making me right now.
I was in a similar boat. My first exposure to the term "lesbian" was a flash cartoon that had a throwaway gag about a butch woman who lived in the sewer and ate children—I remember going home and crying because I strongly suspected that that's what I was, once the other kids explained what the term meant, and I didn't want to end up having to move underground and away from all my friends once I grew up. (This is hilarious in retrospect, but at the time I was really distressed.)
It's really good that young gay people to have so many prominent and positive role models now, and easy access to information on the subject via the internet. Can't imagine my story happening to anyone today.
At first I didn't like the news. Tim Cook is gay, so what? I though 5 seconds about it and then I realized how actually we still need this... we still need to remind people that there's nothing wrong with being gay. That's sad that we are still at this point.
After I came out, one of the best things was getting an email from an 18-year-old guy who had read my blog saying that he'd never spoken to or read anything from a gay person in technology and it was cool to read something from someone who as a programmer and geek came from the same perspective as him. He then said he'd gotten the courage to tell his parents from that.
Which left me feeling amazing for about a week.
Tim Cook's article will do the same for young gay techies but on a much grander scale. :)
We've gone through an incredible process in a single generations. Truly incredible and blazingly fast. It hasn't been everywhere, but it certainly has been global.
In many ways it seemed to have very high hurdles. Homosexuality and queerness elicits an unexplainably intense anger in some people. It is potently threatening. On the other hand, overcoming homophobia had a relatively small hurdle to get over because there was no intergenerational complexity like racism and xenophobia or deeply rooted structural institutions like sexism. Homosexuals were already everywhere in secret. A homosexual didn't need to overcome to become CEO, he was already a CEO. He just needed to come out.
A part of the precess that I think is happening now nearer the cutting edge is post revolutionary normalization. After the gay parades and overt homosexuality that forced the issue into centre stage what is needed is a homosexuality that can be worn lightly outside of the spheres were it is naturally central (like romantic relationships).
Tim Cook is gay, but he's mostly the CEO of Apple. His gayness is not the central part of his public identity and not being public about it up till now is not being closeted.
It's really a great thing that happened, and is happening. I'm glad to be part of the generation that made it happened, a gift to those who will come after, to those who will not have to suffer.
I applaud this. I am not gay. Conventional family, kids, etc. Oh, yes, I am also an atheist which, today, in the US, is worst than being gay in some circles.
As I am sure a lot of you know, the reality show Survivor features a male homosexual couple this year. Bravo! We watch the show with our kids every week. Yes, they ask questions. The little ones cover their eyes when anybody kisses on TV anyway. Seeing two men kiss on the lips and show affection is, well, weird to them. You just don't see that on mainstream TV these days. We simply tell them that what they are seeing is perfectly normal and that these are two people who love each other just as much as mom and dad do. They say "ok" and still go "ewwwww!" When anyone kisses on the show.
The part of Tim Cook's statement that is disappointing to me is where he says "I consider being gay among the greatest gifts God has given me.". Of course, as an atheist I tend to be particularly sensitive to such statements. If we leave that aside, it is simply a fact that god and religion --world wide-- have been brutal to the gay community. Historically this has ranged from denouncement all the way up to torture and murder. And that stands on it's own, it's a historical fact that has nothing whatsoever to do with the messenger being an atheist.
Anyhow, I am glad he decided to come out as the role model he surely is. Society has far to go. This helps. Every little step helps.
It looks like we had similar experiences. I had no model of "gay" that resembled me, and almost everyone around me was aggressively straight. Even considering the idea of being gay made me uncomfortable. So much changed in the last year that I felt safe thinking about it, and it was obvious in retrospect.
Excellent news. I am from India where being gay is a crime in this country. Leaders of this country believe that being gay is a disease and it can be 'cured'[0]. According to Indian Penal Code 377[1], if you are gay you can be imprisoned for life. I had a friend and two years ago he committed suicide because he was gay. In India it's not easy to be gay. Parents and societal pressures can make anyones life living hell. His parents made his life horrible, as if he had committed some crime and they never accepted him. Everyone around him were mocking. After his suicide also, his parents behave as if it was good riddance for them and they don't miss him at all. And rather they are happy because now they don't have to answer society.
Just today morning I read a news[2] that a software engineer working in Infosys was booked for Sec 377 and put in jail. In June 2014, seven people were booked under Section 377 by the Bangalore Police [3]. So far 200 people have been prosecuted under this law [4].
That's the reason I don't see any famous Indian, those who work in movies or HNI, coming out and accepting they are gay. I really hope people in other countries also encourage actions of Tim Cook so that people have freedom to express their wishes and sexuality.
Being in such a progressive community (i.e. young nerdy people), it's easy to forget that this is an enormous deal for some people. A friend of mine recently came out as transgender and the general response was "oh, cool, good for you". It's hard to fathom what it's like for people who aren't in such a supportive environment.
There are undoubtedly many people who will no longer purchase Apple products because of this, and I don't know society can fix this with anything but time.
This made me well up inside. Being from a country that considers homosexuality to be illegal (India) and having a close friend who left that country as well as his religion (Islam) solely due to being gay, I applaud this man's spirit.
It is not only the government that must accept equality of different ways, but so must society. Religion, culture and political climates are no reason to deny fundamental human freedoms - the right to have consensual sex with the people of your choice being one of them. Amazing that the one thing that we hold up as a pinnacle of political theory - democracy - is the one that keeps many minorities from exercising their rights. I am sure, for example, that a referendum on Article 377 would fail in most small Indian towns. Someone correct me if I am wrong.
I hope that prominent Indians take this up as well (there are at least a couple of Bollywood directors who are rumoured to be gay as well as at least one business tycoon) and come out of the closet.
Strangely enough I'd see pictures of him at some gay pride thing and it never even occurred to me he might be gay. I think, more accurately, it didn't trigger anything in my brain that thought it mattered either way. Obviously this is the way it should be!
It seems like Tim Cook isn't under any pressure to publicly announce this, so it seems he's doing it as a way of leveraging his position to help others who are experiencing adversity. Some will say this is a stunt for Apple, and no doubt it does draw attention to Apple in a way, but I think you'd have to be pretty cynical to say that this is anything more nefarious than an admirable gesture.
While everyone already knew, the act of public announcement is one of great meaning and catharsis. Coming out is an important event for a gay person, and for a prominent person such as Tim Cook, for our society as well. As an ally, congratulations for having the courage to be who you are.
I am a white male married to a black female with 2 mixed kids living in Texas. While we haven't experienced much bigotry our way, it has happened. The first time I was filled with disbelief and shortly after rage while my wife (then gf) cried.
Our lives would be different if we were born a generation ago. Thank you MLK and Tim Cook.
I found this one very striking:
"Still, there are laws on the books in a majority of states that allow employers to fire people based solely on their sexual orientation."
Could anyone provide details? I wonder whether it is an explicit "Being gay is grounds for firing" or rather just plain lack of protection from firing for being gay?
In most states, employment law is structured such that the absence of explicit protection means that it is a valid grounds for firing. The laws on the books that create this structure, combined with the absence of an explicit protection for sexual orientation, constitute laws on the books that allow employers to fire people based solely on their sexual orientation.
I'm no expert, but I suspect this is just referring to work "at will" states, where you can be fired without being given a reason. Thus, it could actually be for anything: Your orientation, your work performance, that ugly shirt you wore yesterday. Doesn't matter.
Indeed. Oh, he's gay, we all knew that. Wait, the CEO of Apple is a Christian? That I did not know. Judging by the comment thread here, it seems to be new to a lot of people. It's not a big deal, but it did surprise me. It's easy to assume that a gay man living in the Bay Area is going to be an atheist.
I agree. We should be a lot more shocked that an individual that understands the internet and how information spreads still clings to the fairy tales told to him by his parents.
This is no different than believing in Santa Claus and we're all distracted by what kind of sex he likes to have. I've never heard of a war started by gay people. Being religious is being complicit in that religion's wrongdoings.
Also I'd say it's strange that a gay person is religious. Any person holding a non-mainstream position ends up having to do a lot of thinking and reading before accepting oneself for what they are. In that process they usually become a lot more rational. Didn't work for Tim, though. Weird.
One of the things my father told me when I was very young was, you should not be proud of things you cannot control (birthplace, sex, race, etc.). He also told me that God (or gods) do not exist. I have not found a reason to discard those two.
Yeah, I know, the US is literally the only place on earth where many people are still religious. South America and Africa and India and countries with Muslim majorities are totally not religious. Just those weird Americans.
I wish we lived in a society where people weren't pressured into "publically acknowledge" their sexual orientation just because it's different than the norm. You don't see heterosexual CEOs publically acknowledging they are banging their wife, why should it be different for other sexual orientations? Just let everyone be.
Warning: for the sake of your faith in HN and in humanity, do not read this thread, especially not from the bottom up. I did - big mistake, day ruined.
I am hetero, and I always asked myself: why all that fuzz about people being gay or anything else. I don't need to be proud to be gay or hetero or whatever, I just don't get it.. I have gay friends and never had anything against people with other sexuality, but I truly hate the Gay Pride in our country. I think it is pathetic to be proud of your sexual orientation and feeling a need to show that off.
This will definitely cost me some points, I know, not being gay and not promoting them is just dreadful.
You don't need to be proud of being straight because being straight is the default - and society doesn't give you any shit for being straight.
Pride - in race, in sexuality, in gender, in whatever else - comes from ostracism and marginalization. You band together, develop a group identity, form communities, etc, because the world treats you poorly. Gay Pride is a development out of necessity, not just for parade floats.
This goes beyond sexuality - there is a massive "geek" community out there that gathers for conventions, concerts, and whatever else you can think of. Much of this community formed as a result of ostracism, both real and perceived.
Ditto race. Blacks, Asians, and Latinos band together - both formally in organizations, or informally in communities - to combat the racism its members experience, and support its victims.
When you find any description of people marginalized, odds are you will find communities and organizations that have formed around it. Pride is a natural response - a collective "there is nothing wrong with being us!" is a natural response to a society that tells you that what you are is wrong.
Now, to address your context of your comment - you're incredibly lucky if you don't "get" gay pride. I think most marginalized people would like to live like you - never having to belong to a collective to defend your being, or having society treat you like an individual instead of a constant outsider. To be in a position where this marginalization is invisible to you is a fortunate circumstance indeed.
So it's particularly annoying to those of us who are still marginalized in society - in whatever ways - that you've turned this around to play the victim. You live an enviable life, where you don't need to band together with other marginalized people out of desperation or necessity, yet you have the gall to turn it around as if you're being punished for it.
> I truly hate the Gay Pride in our country. I think it is pathetic to be proud of your sexual orientation and feeling a need to show that off.
The notion of "Gay Pride" exists to specifically counter the widespread notion that being gay is something to be ashamed of. Countering shame with pride is way more effective than countering it with "meh, it's not relevant to my identity".
There are other, more subtle aspects of identity politics at play too, but I expect those would sail way over your head.
The "skin of a rhinoceros" - I liked that the most, as it reflects the development one makes when being part of a minority, no matter if it is sexual, financial ethnical or political nature.
We'll first have to pass from the stage were announcement like this are not that courageous (sure might annoy some BS far right minority who nobody cares about), and are actually the in vogue thing to say for kudos and hi-fives.
Which I think is were we are now.
The people who really had the guts, "came out" when it really mattered and made a difference, back in the seventies and eighties.
Someone isn't out until they out themselves. Until then, it's gossip and speculation from second-hand (or worse) sources.
I'm glad the culture around him reached the point where he felt comfortable and safe being out. Hopefully this will be a kick in the pants to the culture around me. It's hard to date when most people are in the closet.
[+] [-] ForrestN|11 years ago|reply
When I was a child, I felt generally good about myself. I was reasonably smart, well-spoken, curious, and so on, and I wanted to do something important with my life. Some nagging part of me suspected I was gay from very early on, but I resisted it intensely. I wasn't really afraid of being mistreated, although I probably should have been. People were already calling me names so I wasn't worried about that. More important for me was my sense that being gay meant being marginal.
There hasn't been a gay President, and at least when I was a child there weren't many gay people visible to me at all. The image of gay people presented to me were not powerful, focused on frivolous things, and consumed by attitude and lifestyle. If I wanted to do something important, I couldn't possibly be gay. It just didn't fit.
Knowing that the CEO of not only the most powerful company, but also the most admirable company, is gay would have helped me enormously. I always wanted apple products even before I could afford them, and this would have meant a clearly visible path forward. I can't imagine how happy this must be making some confused young people, given how happy it's making me right now.
[+] [-] mklim|11 years ago|reply
I was in a similar boat. My first exposure to the term "lesbian" was a flash cartoon that had a throwaway gag about a butch woman who lived in the sewer and ate children—I remember going home and crying because I strongly suspected that that's what I was, once the other kids explained what the term meant, and I didn't want to end up having to move underground and away from all my friends once I grew up. (This is hilarious in retrospect, but at the time I was really distressed.)
It's really good that young gay people to have so many prominent and positive role models now, and easy access to information on the subject via the internet. Can't imagine my story happening to anyone today.
[+] [-] dwild|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tommorris|11 years ago|reply
After I came out, one of the best things was getting an email from an 18-year-old guy who had read my blog saying that he'd never spoken to or read anything from a gay person in technology and it was cool to read something from someone who as a programmer and geek came from the same perspective as him. He then said he'd gotten the courage to tell his parents from that.
Which left me feeling amazing for about a week.
Tim Cook's article will do the same for young gay techies but on a much grander scale. :)
[+] [-] netcan|11 years ago|reply
In many ways it seemed to have very high hurdles. Homosexuality and queerness elicits an unexplainably intense anger in some people. It is potently threatening. On the other hand, overcoming homophobia had a relatively small hurdle to get over because there was no intergenerational complexity like racism and xenophobia or deeply rooted structural institutions like sexism. Homosexuals were already everywhere in secret. A homosexual didn't need to overcome to become CEO, he was already a CEO. He just needed to come out.
A part of the precess that I think is happening now nearer the cutting edge is post revolutionary normalization. After the gay parades and overt homosexuality that forced the issue into centre stage what is needed is a homosexuality that can be worn lightly outside of the spheres were it is naturally central (like romantic relationships).
Tim Cook is gay, but he's mostly the CEO of Apple. His gayness is not the central part of his public identity and not being public about it up till now is not being closeted.
It's really a great thing that happened, and is happening. I'm glad to be part of the generation that made it happened, a gift to those who will come after, to those who will not have to suffer.
[+] [-] wefarrell|11 years ago|reply
http://www.salon.com/2012/05/14/our_real_first_gay_president...
[+] [-] robomartin|11 years ago|reply
As I am sure a lot of you know, the reality show Survivor features a male homosexual couple this year. Bravo! We watch the show with our kids every week. Yes, they ask questions. The little ones cover their eyes when anybody kisses on TV anyway. Seeing two men kiss on the lips and show affection is, well, weird to them. You just don't see that on mainstream TV these days. We simply tell them that what they are seeing is perfectly normal and that these are two people who love each other just as much as mom and dad do. They say "ok" and still go "ewwwww!" When anyone kisses on the show.
The part of Tim Cook's statement that is disappointing to me is where he says "I consider being gay among the greatest gifts God has given me.". Of course, as an atheist I tend to be particularly sensitive to such statements. If we leave that aside, it is simply a fact that god and religion --world wide-- have been brutal to the gay community. Historically this has ranged from denouncement all the way up to torture and murder. And that stands on it's own, it's a historical fact that has nothing whatsoever to do with the messenger being an atheist.
Anyhow, I am glad he decided to come out as the role model he surely is. Society has far to go. This helps. Every little step helps.
[+] [-] mkr-hn|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] avinassh|11 years ago|reply
Just today morning I read a news[2] that a software engineer working in Infosys was booked for Sec 377 and put in jail. In June 2014, seven people were booked under Section 377 by the Bangalore Police [3]. So far 200 people have been prosecuted under this law [4].
That's the reason I don't see any famous Indian, those who work in movies or HNI, coming out and accepting they are gay. I really hope people in other countries also encourage actions of Tim Cook so that people have freedom to express their wishes and sexuality.
[0] - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/05/india-health-minist...
[1] - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_377_of_the_Indian_Penal...
[2] - http://www.bangaloremirror.com/bangalore/cover-story/Sec-377...
[3] - http://www.bangaloremirror.com/bangalore/cover-story/Six-mon...
[4] - http://judis.nic.in/supremecourt/imgs1.aspx?filename=41070
[+] [-] broodbucket|11 years ago|reply
There are undoubtedly many people who will no longer purchase Apple products because of this, and I don't know society can fix this with anything but time.
[+] [-] kshatrea|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Jedd|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] colinramsay|11 years ago|reply
It seems like Tim Cook isn't under any pressure to publicly announce this, so it seems he's doing it as a way of leveraging his position to help others who are experiencing adversity. Some will say this is a stunt for Apple, and no doubt it does draw attention to Apple in a way, but I think you'd have to be pretty cynical to say that this is anything more nefarious than an admirable gesture.
[+] [-] Bud|11 years ago|reply
Tim Cook
[+] [-] s_q_b|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] flexie|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] singletonaccnt|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] scragg|11 years ago|reply
Our lives would be different if we were born a generation ago. Thank you MLK and Tim Cook.
[+] [-] grecy|11 years ago|reply
What a shame.
[+] [-] dwild|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] notastartup|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] praptak|11 years ago|reply
Could anyone provide details? I wonder whether it is an explicit "Being gay is grounds for firing" or rather just plain lack of protection from firing for being gay?
[+] [-] dragonwriter|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DanBC|11 years ago|reply
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Employment_discrimination_law...
[+] [-] GI_Josh|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dsjoerg|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mikeash|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] innguest|11 years ago|reply
This is no different than believing in Santa Claus and we're all distracted by what kind of sex he likes to have. I've never heard of a war started by gay people. Being religious is being complicit in that religion's wrongdoings.
Also I'd say it's strange that a gay person is religious. Any person holding a non-mainstream position ends up having to do a lot of thinking and reading before accepting oneself for what they are. In that process they usually become a lot more rational. Didn't work for Tim, though. Weird.
[+] [-] bobcostas55|11 years ago|reply
Americans are so weird.
[+] [-] Fastidious|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jusben1369|11 years ago|reply
Interesting given the article we're all commenting on!
[+] [-] scottjad|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] nandemo|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] general_failure|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknown|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] Mahn|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tomasien|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unknownBits|11 years ago|reply
This will definitely cost me some points, I know, not being gay and not promoting them is just dreadful.
[+] [-] potatolicious|11 years ago|reply
Pride - in race, in sexuality, in gender, in whatever else - comes from ostracism and marginalization. You band together, develop a group identity, form communities, etc, because the world treats you poorly. Gay Pride is a development out of necessity, not just for parade floats.
This goes beyond sexuality - there is a massive "geek" community out there that gathers for conventions, concerts, and whatever else you can think of. Much of this community formed as a result of ostracism, both real and perceived.
Ditto race. Blacks, Asians, and Latinos band together - both formally in organizations, or informally in communities - to combat the racism its members experience, and support its victims.
When you find any description of people marginalized, odds are you will find communities and organizations that have formed around it. Pride is a natural response - a collective "there is nothing wrong with being us!" is a natural response to a society that tells you that what you are is wrong.
Now, to address your context of your comment - you're incredibly lucky if you don't "get" gay pride. I think most marginalized people would like to live like you - never having to belong to a collective to defend your being, or having society treat you like an individual instead of a constant outsider. To be in a position where this marginalization is invisible to you is a fortunate circumstance indeed.
So it's particularly annoying to those of us who are still marginalized in society - in whatever ways - that you've turned this around to play the victim. You live an enviable life, where you don't need to band together with other marginalized people out of desperation or necessity, yet you have the gall to turn it around as if you're being punished for it.
[+] [-] alexbecker|11 years ago|reply
> I truly hate the Gay Pride in our country. I think it is pathetic to be proud of your sexual orientation and feeling a need to show that off.
The notion of "Gay Pride" exists to specifically counter the widespread notion that being gay is something to be ashamed of. Countering shame with pride is way more effective than countering it with "meh, it's not relevant to my identity".
There are other, more subtle aspects of identity politics at play too, but I expect those would sail way over your head.
[+] [-] _xhok|11 years ago|reply
What makes you think that?
[+] [-] wuschel|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] DonHopkins|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Gigablah|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] coldtea|11 years ago|reply
Which I think is were we are now.
The people who really had the guts, "came out" when it really mattered and made a difference, back in the seventies and eighties.
[+] [-] oblio|11 years ago|reply
On this level both extremes are similar :)
[+] [-] IceyEC|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] darrellsilver|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] mkr-hn|11 years ago|reply
I'm glad the culture around him reached the point where he felt comfortable and safe being out. Hopefully this will be a kick in the pants to the culture around me. It's hard to date when most people are in the closet.