I understand why Uber's culture might be less popular with drivers and I certainly wish they seemed less smarmy - to echo another commenter - but this description totally underscores why I prefer Uber to Lyft as a customer.
Nothing against Lyft per se (though getting hit on by drivers twice, including a text after the fact, my last trip to SF didn't help), but the "we're all friends" culture sounds ok on paper but when I'm paying for car service, maybe I'm just a bitch, but I don't want to be your friend.
I get there is a difference between liveries and ride sharing in some cities, I do. But I live in New York. I don't want to sit in the front. I don't want to bump your fist. I don't always want to talk (though I've maintained a diary of sorts of many of my favorite Uber driver conversations). I'k primarily using the app because I need a car and couldn't get a taxi. Having a warm and fuzzy relationship is fine, but most of the time I'm trying to do work on my laptop or iPad. As a result, I'm more incline to use the service that treats it as a business than a lark.
But I do appreciate that Lyft drivers feel more appreciated there. That's important. I hope Lyft continues to treat it's drivers well.
This is one of my least favorite things about American culture. Not just in cabs, but in most service situations.
I've literally stopped going to coffee shops that became too chatty. Sometimes I just want a coffee, not a chat about the weekend and the weather and the local sports team.
I much prefer the French service style: efficient, cordial, but out of your way.
To be fair, you are basically describing a taxi service or professional driving service, word for word. The friendly, talkative atmosphere is exactly what Lyft is marketing towards. In fact, a comment directly below yours talks about how great the atmosphere is for them and how it feels like a true ride sharing service between friends.
One couldn't even argue the ride sharing between friends when you actively don't want to communicate with your driver....
Lyft created that image because they thought they would need some cover story about "friends driving friends" in order to violate taxi licensing laws without repercussions. Uber demonstrated that such a cover story was unnecessary.
I agree. I like Lyft but what the author feels is sterile and walled off about Uber appears to me as organization and professionalism. Likewise, what the author applauds about Lyft as being unique and perhaps more engaging appears to me as being a little too lax and carefree. If my life is in your hands via you driving then I'd better see you as a professional who takes their job seriously since I don't know you.
... but the "we're all friends" culture sounds ok on paper but when I'm paying for car service, maybe I'm just a bitch, but I don't want to be your friend.
I prefer Uber for at least this reason. I don't want to chat or make a friend; I just want to get from point A to B and be left alone.
As I was reading the article, though, I realized that if I were a driver, I'd prefer to drive for Lyft. I'm not a particularly "professional" person, and I appreciate Lyft's "come as you are" driver culture... at least from the perspective as a potential driver. As a rider I'd still prefer the efficient and non-social Uber.
Yep. I don't have a lot of occasion to take taxis/Uber but I do take a car service to the airport fairly frequently. Most of the time I'm fine with a few minutes of chit chat about what the weather has been like while I've been away or the successes/tribulations of whatever sports team, or what traffic nightmare is going on at the moment--but, at that point, I'm generally good with being driven to my destination without feeling the obligation to make further polite conversation, listen to talk radio, or whatever.
Did you choose to sit in the front or the back of the car? When I get taxis in Beijing, I sit in the front when I'm open to chat, and the back when when I'm not. Most drivers respect this signal.
Does the same not work with Lyft? I've only tried Lyft once (in SF). I chose to sit in the front, and had an enjoyable conversation with the driver.
There's not problem whatsoever sitting in the back seat without a fist bump or chatting. But I think Lyft's friendlier brand promise could ultimately keep it in the game.
i don't particularly want to do any of that (i'd far rather sit in the back and not talk), but i put up with it for the pleasure of using a service where the drivers feel treated well. uber seems to have imbibed the toxic "customer is always right" mentality[0] that often gets confused with actual professionalism.
[0] except when it comes to customers versus uber, of course
As a (full-time) driver for both: I am biased towards lyft - I make more money on their platform weekly, they take less commission, I have a good friend who works for lyft.
There is certainly a difference between the two, but the two corporate cultures are converging. The cutthroat competition, and possibly growth demands put on them by VC has forced lyft to 'play catch up' against uber in many ways.
It shows up in superficial ways: For example, especially hilarious was the week that uber's and lyft's driver-side UI for accepting and completing rides swapped (uber went from tap and confirm to swipe in/swipe out; lyft went the opposite way).
Lyft communication with drivers, while always upbeat, is often very very slow and occasionally they are borderline negligent in dealing with pay issues.
And as is always the case, it's very difficult to measure the supply and demand, and so in my market at least there is a gross oversupply of drivers; as the drivers tail off and stop driving because they aren't making money, lyft finds itself needing to go on a hiring drive before major events (halloween, etc)... And then everyone shows up on the road for the few weeks after that and takehome goes sharply down.
I have doubts lyft will ever get caught in a major dustup like Uber did with its executive-level idiocy, but it's not a perfect company, and there are certainly more points of similarity (in bad ways) between the two companies than this review points out.
Still having said that, I do like contracting with lyft. It's (and to a less extent uber) given me runway for setting up my nonprofit and I'll be launching a for-profit after I move up to the bay area next week.... While we're seeking capital for it, I'll be lyfting around, if you use lyft you might see me.
This post references its original parent in Pando Daily. I'm surprised there is no disclosure in Pando Daily that investors in Pando Daily such as A16Z, Founder's Fund, Peter Thiel are also investors in Lyft. I think it is only fair that every post in Pando Daily should carry that disclosure so that readers are fully aware of the connection. Why isn't this not called out? I just read a post in Medium which is rightfully questioning the motivation of these media posts absent the disclosure. https://medium.com/@PersonofAwesome/buying-news-coverage-and... We need more transparency from the media outlets.
The truth is that VCs don't invest in the media outlets because they are going to be the next Facebook or Google. No, instead they invest in the media outlets because it helps them promote their investments. There simply is no reason to invest in media outlets for the direct ROI upon exit. They will never be worth enough.
I have used Lyft probably close to 25 times (Is there a place I can see my ride history other than CC statements?) and only used Uber once so I won't try to compare the two but I will say this about Lyft:
Lyft was the first ride-share program to come to my city and I was a little disappointed as I had spent over a year hearing about how awesome Uber was. This feeling quickly disappeared after my first Lyft ride. It was so completely different than any taxi ride I had ever taken that I was taken aback. The whole process was super smooth and it really does feel like getting a ride from a friend. One of the parts I hated most about taxi's was paying at the end because they don't take CC's where I live (or if they do they hide the CC terminals) and so I always had to pay in cash and would often over tip (by rounding up to the nearest bill I had) just to get the ride over with faster. With Lyft I find myself wanting the ride to keep going and I genuinely enjoy talking to every Lyft driver I have ever had. I don't think I have ever had a conversation with a taxi driver that wasn't forced or awkward.
I get that a lot of people don't drive for Lyft as their main job (as do taxi drivers) and so it may be easier for them to be talkative and upbeat but it really does make all the difference. I gush about how much I love Lyft to all my friends and now they all use it and similarly love it. Everytime Lyft comes up in conversation everyone will talk about how great it is and how they love to use it.
Uber is now in my city but as I said I only used it once and I won't even begin to try to compare the experiences because the data set is way too small (hell, 25 rides with Lyft is probably too small as well). But from what I have seen from the outside looking in it's much more "professional" (I don't say that as a good thing) and buttoned up. I love how laid back Lyft drivers are and after reading this blog post it appears that Lyft as a company is this way as well. I wish Lyft the best of luck and will always try to get a Lyft driver before I fall back on Uber.
I find this really interesting. I prefer Uber at-least in LA. I have used both Uber and Lyft pretty consistently in the last year. My problem with lyft has been my extreme experiences that come at the expense of "being a friend". I have had rides from LAX with drivers asking me very private information like my religious beliefs. There was another guy who was talking about his relationships and hinting at his sex life. It was bizarre and funny in the way he said that he does not like to talk but lyft emphasizes on this social experience (and in my head I was like, dude please shut up.. i wont mind) I am sure these incidents can happen with Uber but so far I have never been creeped out even if I thought the drivers were rude or even reckless etc.
With lyft, I tend to sit on the passengers side; which kind of increases my sense of dread when I get weird drivers.
I hear this quite frequently on how awesome it is that Lyft emphasizes this social experience. But in my personal experience it has a (slight?) downside.
This seems to objectively match my customer experience as well, though my subjective experience is different.
I wish Uber didn't feel like such a scummy bunch of people, because I'm not a particularly friendly/talkative/social person. I like that when I got into an Uber it seemed expected to not really interact with my driver. It's not that I'm "above them" or anything, though I certainly can see how their chauffeur atmosphere would appeal to those who appreciate that, it's just that they're a stranger, and I find that intimidating.
I'll probably keep using Lyft though, because all else being equal I'd rather be uncomfortable with my ride than uncomfortable with my decisions as a consumer.
They have to pretend that you're car-pooling, rather than just hiring a taxi. I don't like lying to people, so I prefer to tell them that I'm paying them to drive me from A to B.
seriously, when you get in, politely and friendly-ly tell your driver that you prefer a quiet ride, and thank them when you get out. They'll understand.
i was banned from Llyft and never given a reason except that "we take safety seriously". i remember always being an upstanding rider, but may have been a bit light in the tip category. tried to contact the company to see why i was banned but have been stonewalled. hopefully they don't start banning poor people, or some other group just because.
wish they would provided more transparency and have contacted the utilities commission in my state to share my concern.
I also enjoyed how they admitted that they mislead drivers and riders by not displaying a rating lower than 4.55 even though the email said the driver's rating was less than 4.55.
I have experienced exactly this in SF. It may just be that I am overly friendly with strangers, but I opt for Lyft every time the prices are close (I'll take 1.5x Lyft over 1.25x UberX every time). The drivers are nicer and just generally more considerate. I've had drivers show me cool music and tell me great stories.
Then again I have friends who hate Lyft for the same reasons. They want to sit quietly in a black car and just get there. To each his/her own.
The thing that seems crazy to me is that drivers are worried that they will lose their jobs to driverless cars. While I am sure this will be possible someday, even if it were 100% technically possible today (and it isn't) it would take a few years for all the driverless cars to be purchased.
I am sure someday it will happen. But if I were driving a car for a living I think I would be more worried about a car accident, illness, a recession..
When the CEO of the company you work for tells the world he can't wait to replace you and your fellow workers, it seems reasonable to worry a little bit. At a minimum, it's a bit disconcerting to be equated in value to a (not so distant future) machine.
At least here in NYC, I see the same drivers driving for both UberX and Lyft. The only difference is that they have to attach the pink mustache in the front if they are responding to a Lyft order. In their mind, and mine, once I am in the cab, the company culture does not come afore as much as the human in the car. If he is talkative, he is - Uber or Lyft. If I am talkative, I am - wether Uber or Lyft. I have used both the services and I have had great conversations.
I find Uber and Lyft as great ways of being introduced to new cities. The drivers give me a shade of the city, that I might otherwise miss, just staying in business hotels and talking to the hotel staff, and business partners. I think of them as my "Lonely Planet" for X city.
From my seat in back, the difference is tipping. I hate tipping. Increase fares 15% if you want, but not dealing with tipping was one of the nice things about Uber.
[+] [-] filmgirlcw|11 years ago|reply
Nothing against Lyft per se (though getting hit on by drivers twice, including a text after the fact, my last trip to SF didn't help), but the "we're all friends" culture sounds ok on paper but when I'm paying for car service, maybe I'm just a bitch, but I don't want to be your friend.
I get there is a difference between liveries and ride sharing in some cities, I do. But I live in New York. I don't want to sit in the front. I don't want to bump your fist. I don't always want to talk (though I've maintained a diary of sorts of many of my favorite Uber driver conversations). I'k primarily using the app because I need a car and couldn't get a taxi. Having a warm and fuzzy relationship is fine, but most of the time I'm trying to do work on my laptop or iPad. As a result, I'm more incline to use the service that treats it as a business than a lark.
But I do appreciate that Lyft drivers feel more appreciated there. That's important. I hope Lyft continues to treat it's drivers well.
[+] [-] nostromo|11 years ago|reply
I've literally stopped going to coffee shops that became too chatty. Sometimes I just want a coffee, not a chat about the weekend and the weather and the local sports team.
I much prefer the French service style: efficient, cordial, but out of your way.
[+] [-] crazypyro|11 years ago|reply
One couldn't even argue the ride sharing between friends when you actively don't want to communicate with your driver....
[+] [-] qq66|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pbreit|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Evolved|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] kelnos|11 years ago|reply
I prefer Uber for at least this reason. I don't want to chat or make a friend; I just want to get from point A to B and be left alone.
As I was reading the article, though, I realized that if I were a driver, I'd prefer to drive for Lyft. I'm not a particularly "professional" person, and I appreciate Lyft's "come as you are" driver culture... at least from the perspective as a potential driver. As a rider I'd still prefer the efficient and non-social Uber.
[+] [-] ghaff|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pnathan|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] rahimnathwani|11 years ago|reply
Does the same not work with Lyft? I've only tried Lyft once (in SF). I chose to sit in the front, and had an enjoyable conversation with the driver.
[+] [-] pbreit|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] zem|11 years ago|reply
[0] except when it comes to customers versus uber, of course
[+] [-] slingerofwheat|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] username223|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] dnautics|11 years ago|reply
There is certainly a difference between the two, but the two corporate cultures are converging. The cutthroat competition, and possibly growth demands put on them by VC has forced lyft to 'play catch up' against uber in many ways.
It shows up in superficial ways: For example, especially hilarious was the week that uber's and lyft's driver-side UI for accepting and completing rides swapped (uber went from tap and confirm to swipe in/swipe out; lyft went the opposite way).
Lyft communication with drivers, while always upbeat, is often very very slow and occasionally they are borderline negligent in dealing with pay issues.
And as is always the case, it's very difficult to measure the supply and demand, and so in my market at least there is a gross oversupply of drivers; as the drivers tail off and stop driving because they aren't making money, lyft finds itself needing to go on a hiring drive before major events (halloween, etc)... And then everyone shows up on the road for the few weeks after that and takehome goes sharply down.
I have doubts lyft will ever get caught in a major dustup like Uber did with its executive-level idiocy, but it's not a perfect company, and there are certainly more points of similarity (in bad ways) between the two companies than this review points out.
Still having said that, I do like contracting with lyft. It's (and to a less extent uber) given me runway for setting up my nonprofit and I'll be launching a for-profit after I move up to the bay area next week.... While we're seeking capital for it, I'll be lyfting around, if you use lyft you might see me.
[+] [-] pgopalan|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] pbreit|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hanief|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] wizawuza|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] malandrew|11 years ago|reply
https://twitter.com/pmarca/status/432909760984145920
The truth is that VCs don't invest in the media outlets because they are going to be the next Facebook or Google. No, instead they invest in the media outlets because it helps them promote their investments. There simply is no reason to invest in media outlets for the direct ROI upon exit. They will never be worth enough.
[+] [-] unknown|11 years ago|reply
[deleted]
[+] [-] closetnerd|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] joshstrange|11 years ago|reply
Lyft was the first ride-share program to come to my city and I was a little disappointed as I had spent over a year hearing about how awesome Uber was. This feeling quickly disappeared after my first Lyft ride. It was so completely different than any taxi ride I had ever taken that I was taken aback. The whole process was super smooth and it really does feel like getting a ride from a friend. One of the parts I hated most about taxi's was paying at the end because they don't take CC's where I live (or if they do they hide the CC terminals) and so I always had to pay in cash and would often over tip (by rounding up to the nearest bill I had) just to get the ride over with faster. With Lyft I find myself wanting the ride to keep going and I genuinely enjoy talking to every Lyft driver I have ever had. I don't think I have ever had a conversation with a taxi driver that wasn't forced or awkward.
I get that a lot of people don't drive for Lyft as their main job (as do taxi drivers) and so it may be easier for them to be talkative and upbeat but it really does make all the difference. I gush about how much I love Lyft to all my friends and now they all use it and similarly love it. Everytime Lyft comes up in conversation everyone will talk about how great it is and how they love to use it.
Uber is now in my city but as I said I only used it once and I won't even begin to try to compare the experiences because the data set is way too small (hell, 25 rides with Lyft is probably too small as well). But from what I have seen from the outside looking in it's much more "professional" (I don't say that as a good thing) and buttoned up. I love how laid back Lyft drivers are and after reading this blog post it appears that Lyft as a company is this way as well. I wish Lyft the best of luck and will always try to get a Lyft driver before I fall back on Uber.
[+] [-] binaryqueen|11 years ago|reply
With lyft, I tend to sit on the passengers side; which kind of increases my sense of dread when I get weird drivers.
I hear this quite frequently on how awesome it is that Lyft emphasizes this social experience. But in my personal experience it has a (slight?) downside.
[+] [-] delecti|11 years ago|reply
I wish Uber didn't feel like such a scummy bunch of people, because I'm not a particularly friendly/talkative/social person. I like that when I got into an Uber it seemed expected to not really interact with my driver. It's not that I'm "above them" or anything, though I certainly can see how their chauffeur atmosphere would appeal to those who appreciate that, it's just that they're a stranger, and I find that intimidating.
I'll probably keep using Lyft though, because all else being equal I'd rather be uncomfortable with my ride than uncomfortable with my decisions as a consumer.
[+] [-] username223|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dnautics|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] hisabness|11 years ago|reply
wish they would provided more transparency and have contacted the utilities commission in my state to share my concern.
[+] [-] MacsHeadroom|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] LewisJEllis|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jsprogrammer|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] gregd|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] fibbery|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] inspiredworlds|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] habosa|11 years ago|reply
Then again I have friends who hate Lyft for the same reasons. They want to sit quietly in a black car and just get there. To each his/her own.
[+] [-] georgeecollins|11 years ago|reply
I am sure someday it will happen. But if I were driving a car for a living I think I would be more worried about a car accident, illness, a recession..
[+] [-] dougabug|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] ameister14|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] waterlesscloud|11 years ago|reply
In fact, their whole technology seems aimed at managing such a fleet in the long run.
[+] [-] somberi|11 years ago|reply
I find Uber and Lyft as great ways of being introduced to new cities. The drivers give me a shade of the city, that I might otherwise miss, just staying in business hotels and talking to the hotel staff, and business partners. I think of them as my "Lonely Planet" for X city.
[+] [-] patcon|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] alokedesai|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] cpkpad|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] cpkpad|11 years ago|reply