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hnriot | 11 years ago

Isn't this the city's job? I actually think it's kind of creepy that Corporations are taking the role of the City. The general idea is the City collects taxes and uses those to provide services like buses.

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hackuser|11 years ago

> Isn't this the city's job? I actually think it's kind of creepy that Corporations are taking the role of the City. The general idea is the City collects taxes and uses those to provide services like buses.

This is a widespread problem. As conservatives, many of them wealthy, push for a reduction in government power,[1] that makes the wealthy relatively more powerful.

A similar point was raised about a park in NYC being financed by a wealthy citizen. Do citizens get an equal say in its design, location, rules, etc.? It is literally undemocratic to allocate that power to those with more money. The same applies to funding for scientific research, and more. We become more and more dependent on these people and their influence grows.

That doesn't mean all charity by the wealthy is bad or even ill-intended, it means that reducing our government's power doesn't eliminate the power, it just hands it to another group.

[1] Off-topic: Note that a certain group of conservatives (I'm not sure "Tea Party" corresponds exactly) also push to reduce the power of other competing groups, including unions, the media, "liberals", voters in poor districts, etc. They make arguments for each, but follow the money and power: It leaves business alone on the political battlefield.

dragonwriter|11 years ago

> Isn't this the city's job? I actually think it's kind of creepy that Corporations are taking the role of the City. The general idea is the City collects taxes and uses those to provide services like buses.

The article seems to indicate that city is operating them and Google is funding them (EDIT: see the chain of replies, its a bit different structure; I don't think that invalidates the following point, however); while I don't think that it should be the exclusive means, I don't see why you wouldn't want to accept that one way that new public services might be piloted is by having an interested private party who has the funds and thinks the service would be valuable simply contribute support for the service for the period of the pilot project, which is what is happening here.

Kalium|11 years ago

I'm not sure I agree with your interpretation. To my reading, the article implies the buses are operated by Google.

cmelbye|11 years ago

In my anecdotal experience, it seems like at least a few Bay Area cities have a hard time doing that properly. Public transit is terrible here. I'm excited at the prospect of a private company giving it a try as a free service to the public. Of course, it's not pure altruism, there are PR motivations. But that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Kalium|11 years ago

My general impression is not that cities have a hard time doing public transit properly. It's that the politics of it make good public transit damn near impossible. Exclusive bedroom communities don't want to be accessible to carless commuters and Muni is impossible to improve because everything is a racist plot against minorities.

TheCoelacanth|11 years ago

Almost the entire US has a problem doing public transit properly. They are a variety of reasons, but it mostly boils down to government policies that favor private vehicles and suburban sprawl.

driverdan|11 years ago

> Public transit is terrible here

It sounds like you've never traveled outside the bay area. Muni + BART + Caltrain is far more than most cities have. What other cities have a system like Caltrain?

I'm not saying it's perfect, far from that. There are plenty of issues, especially with Muni. But it's not terrible.

mattmurdog|11 years ago

The problem isn't really with public transit, it's with traffic and hipsters on their bikes in the middle of the road.

scrollaway|11 years ago

In most of the UK, buses are operated by private corps. It's actually fairly annoying as it means a ticket for one bus doesn't work in another, and there is no way to get a generic bus pass... but I don't see why it shouldn't be this way, to be honest.

Rotten194|11 years ago

Because this is a 2-year pilot program. What happens when after people grow reliant on it, the city buses fall into disuse and disrepair, and then Google decides they don't want to continue it?

Public services should be provided by the government. For someone who lives in a country with a NHS, I think you would realize that.

wereHamster|11 years ago

In switzerland the GA (https://www.sbb.ch/en/travelcards-and-tickets/railpasses/ga....) is valid on most public transportation, including those which are partially or completely private. And the card gives you reduced fare on many of the ski/mountain lifts. Also, I can buy a ticket for most of the participating companies with a single iPhone app (the 'SBB Mobile' app). The SBB btw is state owned.

imron|11 years ago

>but I don't see why it shouldn't be this way, to be honest.

Because essential public services shouldn't be reliant on the whim of a company.

This is why we have taxes. If the city doesn't have enough money to be funding such services, it should perhaps look in to why Google pays so little tax.

vertex-four|11 years ago

> there is no way to get a generic bus pass

Sometimes, there's another private company which does sell generic bus passes. They tend to be extortionately expensive, though.

UrMomReadsHN|11 years ago

Interesting that's why cities like HOAs so much - they provide some of the services which would otherwise be provided by the city. Things like slow plowing, lighting, garbage pickup, and maintenance of shared areas (which would otherwise be public areas). Yet they still collect taxes from them.

sp332|11 years ago

But if I want more buses, I can't just give the money to the city. They'd have to make some kind of contorted tax category that only applies to me so they can take my money. That's assuming I can convince them to spend my money on the buses instead of some other project.

dragonwriter|11 years ago

> But if I want more buses, I can't just give the money to the city.

Sure you can -- its called a grant. Private entities can issue grants with public entities as the recipients -- it happens all the time.

pronoiac|11 years ago

I'd guess that the problem is that multiple cities are involved, and they suck at cooperating amongst themselves.

dmishe|11 years ago

Well yes, but Mountain View isn't exactly good at anything like that.