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Microsoft announces Project Spartan, its new web browser for Windows 10

85 points| sz4kerto | 11 years ago |theverge.com | reply

80 comments

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[+] quakkels|11 years ago|reply
So, it will take a 'snapshot' of the page that you can markup. This snapshot will disable dynamic features of the webpage but still allow links to work. I wonder if they are talking about halting DOM manipulation, or JavaScript execution. Seems this will definitely create new classes of QA test paths.
[+] vesinisa|11 years ago|reply
Pretty surprising that it's coming with a new rendering engine given the good progress Microsoft has been making in bringing Trident in line with the competition.
[+] Eyas|11 years ago|reply
Insiders have reported on this previously. Basically the "new" rendering engine is a fork of Trident which removes backwards compatibility and legacy code. They might call it something else, but the new engine is basically Trident, refactored, and without the legacy cruft.

Source: http://www.neowin.net/news/internet-explorer-12-big-changes-...

Validated by a few other insiders, including Paul Thurrott, Tom Warren (The Verge), and Mary Jo Foley (ZDNet).

[+] wmf|11 years ago|reply
Is "new rendering engine" marketing-speak for "Trident with backwards compatibility ripped out"?
[+] Touche|11 years ago|reply
That's by far the most interesting thing about this, where are the details on that?
[+] Alupis|11 years ago|reply
Now when you install Windows, you will get no less than two pre-installed browsers (at least for the next several versions of Windows). You will get IE and Spartan... neither of-which you can fully remove since they'll be baked into Windows like IE is now (things depend on IE specifically and don't just rely on the default-set browser)
[+] taf2|11 years ago|reply
which may actually be a good thing because it will further reduce the total number of IE/Spartan marketshare driving fewer developers to care. A real win for the web.
[+] makepanic|11 years ago|reply
I would love to know what this browser is using as a user agent string.
[+] rkuykendall-com|11 years ago|reply
If it's like every single web browser for it, an insanely long amalgam of the user agent strings of every competing browser, every browser that came before it, and the word Spartan.
[+] ddod|11 years ago|reply
I wonder how they can reconcile the name "Spartan" with built in note taking, social sharing, Cortana, and webpage overlay drawing.
[+] cwyers|11 years ago|reply
It's just a codename, and like all Microsoft codenames the past few years, it's taken from the Halo games. It doesn't really mean anything, and it probably won't be the final name, but who knows.
[+] debacle|11 years ago|reply
Because Halo is the strongest brand Microsoft has built in the last fifteen years.
[+] unknown|11 years ago|reply

[deleted]

[+] pdabbadabba|11 years ago|reply
> Who is this wording aimed at?

Part of this is probably just marketing people wanting to make things sound exciting. (I'm tempted to mock this tendency, but it may well be that this sort of wordplay works. I have no idea.)

But I also think there is a surprising number of People who are familiar with the phrase "browsing the internet" but are not necessarily aware that the software you use to do this is called a "web browser." I find that many non-technical people in my life fall into this category.

It's surprising that people don't make the purely grammatical connection between "browsING" and "browsER," but it seems to be a real phenomenon. Perhaps the word "browser" strikes people as jargon and so they screen it out.

[+] hokkos|11 years ago|reply
Not a new rendering engine, reading view/list already exist in Safari or with plugins, annotation doesn't seem that usefull. I would have expected more tools to handle tab overload, password management, plugins.
[+] hackinthebochs|11 years ago|reply
Personally I'm happy to have functionality that previously required a plugin to be built-in. As it is I've sworn off all plugins except adblock for potential security compromises. It's just not worth it.
[+] Sir_Cmpwn|11 years ago|reply
Great, another bloody rendering engine.
[+] sp332|11 years ago|reply
Web content is supposed to render properly on multiple engines. We shouldn't be encouraging a monoculture of webkit.
[+] conradk|11 years ago|reply
Having only one resulted in the IE nightmare. Supporting Gecko and Webkit nowadays is quite simple. I don't mind a new, standards compliant rendering engine.
[+] mjs7231|11 years ago|reply
Progress sucks doesn't it.
[+] wanda|11 years ago|reply

    Naturally, Cortana will be integrated into Project Spartan
    It'll pop up on relevant pages where Cortana can be useful
Another Internet Explorer I won't be using. Block pop-ups only to have one natively installed.
[+] sibbl|11 years ago|reply
I guess there will be an option for that. Almost everything of the Win 10 stuff that MS showed off today was optional.
[+] bhhaskin|11 years ago|reply
It reminds me of clippy...
[+] giancarlostoro|11 years ago|reply
I think it would be great for anyone who is visually impaired to have such functionality enabled by default. I imagine it's configurable, usually everything in Windows is, even if you have to hack through the system registry to configure it.
[+] pdabbadabba|11 years ago|reply
Well, in fairness, they said Cortana would only pop up on "pages where Cortana can be useful." Perhaps this means Cortana will be configured to never pop up.
[+] freshyill|11 years ago|reply
I really wish they would just base IE (or whatever this ends up being called) on WebKit or Blink and call it a day. They could immediately solve 90% of the actual problems people have with their browser, instead of tacking on crap that nobody's asking for.

Once the real problems are fixed, feel free to tack on crap because IE is basically only exists as a way for people to download Chrome anyway.

[+] cwyers|11 years ago|reply
This actually seemed pretty convincing to me:

https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/470/maybe-window...

"The reason Microsoft didn’t adopt Blink is simple: Google.

Aside from the obvious issues these two companies have with each other, consider a few other relevant details. Google had split Blink from WebKit earlier because it was always fighting with Apple and wanted control. But now Google is doing what it wants with Blink—as Apple did/does with WebKit—because it’s strategically important to Google. That is, Google could only be counted on to do what was best for Google at all times, and not what was best for Blink generally, and the community of companies using it."

Given how Apple and Google had the public divorce over WebKit, it makes sense that Microsoft didn't trust Google enough to base their new browser on Blink.

[+] theandrewbailey|11 years ago|reply
Build a browser on Webkit or Blink, just like everyone else? There's already dozens of those. You can download Chrome just as well in any browser.

It's great that MS is improving IE, because having a Webkit/Blink dominated monoculture is bad. Didn't we learn this with IE6?

[+] ryankshaw|11 years ago|reply
I disagree.

I hate IE, especially it's older versions. Dealing with ie 6-10 and all of their crappy warts and stagnation have made my life more difficult and objectively held the entire web back for years. But the reason why they are so crappy are not so much that they are made by Microsoft but because for much of that time they could be. IE 6 was way better than anything else at the time and for more than a decade after that, MS could just sit on their laurels untill others leap-frogged them.

Competition is good. Webkit and Blink are better now, but without competition, there will be no one to push them forward.

[+] Someone1234|11 years ago|reply
If everyone is based on WebKit then we'll eventually wind up in an IE 6.0-type situation where nothing moves forward because there are too many cooks in the kitchen. I think the competition between WebKit, Gecko, Trident, and KHTML is healthy and spawns innovation.

Honestly I hope Microsoft keeps trying to make the best browser possible if for nothing else just to keep WebKit on its toes. Otherwise the others will spend less and top engineers will grow bored and move on to impactful problems.

[+] untog|11 years ago|reply
IE 11 is fine. Good, even. They've already solved 90% of the actual problems people have - just not developer perceptions.

I don't want a rendering engine monoculture.

[+] ProAm|11 years ago|reply
> IE is basically only exists as a way for people to download Firefox anyway
[+] na85|11 years ago|reply
Will Project Spartan continue Microsoft's trademarked aversion to standards-compliant DOM rendering?
[+] tw04|11 years ago|reply
If it's not cross-platform, I'm not sure why they're bothering. They seem to think that the turn-off is simply standards compliance. While that's a big deal, a bigger deal is having to learn a whole new workflow when switching between operating systems... at least in my world.
[+] blumkvist|11 years ago|reply
And how big is your world?
[+] benaston|11 years ago|reply
So... they are trying to make the Web more shareable with a proprietary annotation feature, thereby introducing a new category of UX issues, bugs and incompatibilities.

I suppose that would be kind of neat if the Web wasn't already the most shareable medium in the world (you've heard of URLs?).

MS is way behind in standards implementation (yes still, even in IE11). Yes this software is pure vapor, but has their browser project office heard of feature prioritization?

MS has not, cannot and will never change. They are onto a losing strategy long-term (just review your GA logs). And for that I am glad because as a developer for the Web, I hate them with a passion.

[+] theandrewbailey|11 years ago|reply
While the web is the most sharable thing ever, it's not the most annotatable or drawable medium. This annotation feature will let corporate office monkeys communicate changes to their intranet sites easier than using vague text descriptions or printouts (or, kill me, scanned printouts).

And guess who the primary target audience is for MS browsers? Corporate office monkeys.

[+] cma|11 years ago|reply
Those who have heard of URLs might also have heard of link rot.
[+] Animats|11 years ago|reply
"Chief among those new features is new inking support that lets users annotate web pages and sync all of those notes to OneDrive and share them with collaborators"

In other words, your web browsing is reported to Microsoft so this markup will be in sync. Will that information be made available to advertisers? Will Microsoft backdoor HTTPS to make this work?

[+] devindotcom|11 years ago|reply
So all cloud services are inherently suspect? Then why call one in particular out at all?

This is no different than saving a web page for reading later on instapaper or the like.

[+] bhhaskin|11 years ago|reply
Why would Microsoft have to backdoor HTTPS if they control the browser?