This is a really interesting idea, though maybe a bit too expensive and, ah, "hip" for my tastes. (Currently hopping from Airbnb to Airbnb flatshare, paying $1000 or less a month for housing with internet and utilities included. Would be even cheaper if I wasn't in Western Europe.)
I've been thinking lately of where I would like to live for most of my late twenties and early thirties. I'm definitely a bit of a loner, but at the same time, I like living as part of a close-knit community. I wish I could find a little "tribe" of self-directed folks roughly my age in an old, creaky house somewhere in the mountains... or on a remote island... or in a forest, or something. Just people working on their projects, tending to their garden, raising some chickens (or maybe some kids), enjoying the fresh air, and mostly living away from the rest of society. An art commune for the 21st century, I guess.
Unfortunately, if such a place exists, I doubt it has a website, and I especially doubt they'd take in strays. Guess I'd have to organize it myself. It's too bad I don't know anyone else who'd want to live like this. (And even if I did, who knows if we'd get along?)
Some challenges:
initial capital (does one person buy and rent to rest, or is it equal ownership?)
How to settle internal disputes (which would vary based on which of the above set ups you choose)
Ensuring everyone has enough remote work to pay for any (albeit probably small) expenses.
Legal challenges.
Wanting to be remote yet requiring Internet, electricity, groceries (unless you plan on growing nearly all of your food, which brings other challenges).
Note that these challenges aren't necessarily unique and have been faced by basically every commune/intentional community, so researching some of the strategies employed by others would be key.
Hey, thanks for the well thought out comment, the price point is for a certain group who wants total peace of mind not only in terms of internet speed etc.
http://nomadforum.io/ has some pretty diverse people, i'd ask people there, maybe someone knows someone who knows the perfect website-less place.
I guess the selection that will occur based on the price can be either positive or negative depending on your taste.
One of the reason to join one of these communities, I would think, is to socialize and network with interesting individual... and you might want to pay extra for that. Then again, if the prize de facto excludes the people you find interesting than not so much :)
I think I'd try to do a little prize segmentation with tiered costs, that way you could perhaps get more interesting people and maximize profit. Then again maybe it will book fully using these prizes
This is something I may create w/in the next decade. If I ever get enough $$ (don't need much, actually) to build several/a dozen tiny houses in a village somewhere, I'd do it in order to create what you describe.
On a side note, something I've been looking for for many years is a simple, no frills, cheap room rental service across the world's largest cities. Of course, now there's Airbnb, but I'd prefer one company that administers the living locations + design/look of the rooms, if that makes sense, rather than a network of regular people using a site to rent out their places. Basically, I want to know exactly what I'm getting (ie, same price, size, amenities, ease) no matter which city I go to. Like a hotel chain but for short, middle, and/or long term rentals.
Caravanserai looks like a promising start, though I'm also aware of the effort + price points from living abroad (I'm currently in Lisbon), and it's about 50-60% less than the lofty $1,600 mentioned (however, a co-working space here is around $220/mo, and I didn't include this factor in my estimate).
All that said, I am quite the stickler but surely most people won't mind paying the currently-set price.
20s/30s: I'm 32. Of the last 15 years I've spent ~12 in Asia, one in London, one in LA, one Australia/NZ. I can highly recommend traveling around Asia on the slow, looking around for somewhere that suits you, and settling awhile. My choice: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yunnan
I saw a documentary and just this sort of place in the scandinavian countries. I can't find the specific links, but some quick googling turned up the term co-housing and this interesting overview:
You've probably already thought about this, but you might want to make sure clients understand the legal side of things. We've certainly had some cases at Mozilla where remote workers had to be "reminded" that we could only pay them if they maintained residency in their official company of employment, that they would be in violation of the tourist visa they had traveled to these other locations under if they worked there for 3 months, etc.
It's a bit of a minefield, and I only know the warnings that legal/HR tell managers :-)
Right to the point, that's one of the reasons we choose the countries we did, as they make it OKish to work for a non-local (!!!) company. The Chiang Mai raid a few weeks ago was good example and scared a lot of people, but overall the risk is manageable.
Have you considered having some storage in the house that automatically follows you around the world as you move from place to place ? i.e. your belongings just turn up at the house you are currently staying in without you having to deal with shipping?
Wait...you've named your startup "Caravanserai" and you don't have any destinations on the actual historical Silk Road? For shame!
Turkey is an amazing place to work and live, there's an incredibly vibrant hacker community, and the people are some of the most welcoming in the world (especially if you're a visitor). Istanbul rents on the European side can run pretty high, but on the Asian side (and with the way the exchange rate is going these days), I think you'd be remiss to leave it out.
If not Istanbul, Ankara has a bunch of universities and rents are considerably cheaper. Bodrum, too, has relatively low rents and absolutely amazing natural beauty. Ok, enough ranting...
Seriously cool concept, though. I look forward to seeing where you take it!
We looked at Istanbul, but it was prohibitively expensive, at least for our Beta batch where we reserve certain safety buffer for things that could go wrong and in the neighborhoods we looked at.
Coastal towns like Bodrum could be a nice choice, any areas in Istanbul we should reconsider?
Not to rain on your parade, but isn't it a bit disingenuous to compare your cost with living in NY or SF? I mean, of course it's much cheaper to live in Lisbon or Mexico City, regardless of the particular accommodation.
Yeah, anyone considering a digital nomad lifestyle isn't typically looking at NYC or London; the most popular destination of Chiang Mai is rated at $638/month all-in[1], and most have rent $300-$500 /month, not $1500.
I really love the concept but as presented it isn't appealing. The idea of not having to deal with all the hassle of finding and organising accommodation is great.. but they only have (and not even that yet) 3 locations. "hey you can travel the world (3 locations)" doesn't have so much appeal. Obviously they plan on expanding but the price is for now, not the future.
I suspect that if someone decides to stay for more than a couple of months they will often splinter off into cheaper accommodation. Having the fixed fee also makes it difficult to set up in the most sensible (cheapest) areas.. because the attraction of going it alone in those areas will be higher the better value the area is.
It strikes me they would have been better off setting up a handful of these locations first as individual nomad/co-habitation accommodation, ironing out all the issues, and then introducing the go-anywhere subscription idea. They've left themselves an awful lot to deal with in one go.
Excuse my language, but this is fucking awesome. As an aspiring technomad and serial minimalist, I want to thank you for such great idea and execution. My only fear is that the current service might be quite steep for the average nomad.
What should they do to make me really happy? Be able to invest some sum of money (or an existing property?) and enjoy a lifetime of co-living (they need much more destinations, of course). This can be a nice mode of rapid growth, property in exchange to co-living promise.
I can see why they didn't include this. I don't know about Portugal, but I've driven in Mexico and I know people who have attempted to drive in Bali. If you're not from there, I don't recommend it. You might be fine on most of your trips, but eventually the assumptions you have about driving from your home will be violated, and there will be an incident that will cost you money. If the car belonged to this company it would also cost them money.
One of the perks of cheap locations is that hiring a cab is cheap. Also you can ride a bike. Also driving is the least relaxing way to experience any of these places.
While not sure about this particular business model, it is the first good use case for container hotel rooms I've ever seen.
Standardized rooms all over the world, run as a network of independent providers adhering to the international code of practice, advertised and paid for on AirBNB (because we already have hassle free hotel check in experience, why build another one).
... and stuffed with IKEA furniture we all know and love :)
This is a neat idea, but seems quite expensive, also the price comparisons are a bit unfair.
I can't speak for NY, but in London, you could get a nice room in a shared flat for 890 GBP (=1356 USD) on the edge of first zone, so the commute (monthly Underground ticket for zones 1&2) would be a much more reasonable 130 GBP (=200 USD), far from 698 USD as listed on the site.
Interesting Project
Question: How can you make sure, that every Nomad has a place to stay in each destination? If you limit the time one can spend at a destination, the living costs would be exponentially higher as the flight costs technically affect the flat rate.
Internet in Indonesia is ridiculously cheap. For $500 a month you'll have a very nice place in Bali. No need for a year lease.
3g Internet in Portugal is a little bit expensive. Not too bad -- about 2 euro a Gig. 500 euros a month will get you a nice place. Not sure about how long a lease you'd need to sign.
Mexico City. Why on earth would you want to go to Mexico City?
"Mexico City. Why on earth would you want to go to Mexico City?"
Because the most beautiful and exciting city on Earth is full of artists, programmers, scholars, great street food, great fancy restaurants, museums, history, good looking and outgoing young locals, sports clubs, perfect weather, rugged mountain wilderness, organic ripe produce year round, religious pilgrimage sites, great universities, live music and theatre, pretty architecture, peaceful parks, lively squares and plazas, fast easy transit and bikeshare programs, and a constant parade of special events.
Plus, if you're earning in euros or dollars, it's cheap.
Why wouldn't you want to go to Mexico City? It's said to feel very European, and there's a lot of interesting history and architecture. I'd go there just as soon as I'd go to Bangkok.
I can't wait to do it. Definitely in. It's awesome that you're taking the leap to make your spaces connected across countries. And a +1 for the idea of moving boxes around from country to country.
As an aside I can't understand why, as a first step, co-working spaces in different locations haven't partnered up to offer this to people looking to move around and sort out their own accommodation. Having the availability of, say, Regus offices, with the entrepreneurship and tech focus found in current co-working spaces would be a huge plus.
- Is this meant to grow with demand, or be limited to a few first-come/first-served offering?
- It's not clear to me (maybe I misread) what happens when I move to another country. Am I holding a lock on the rooms everywhere, or am I allocated a room on request?
I work remote, and currently in school but once done, I totally want to start moving around the world for periods of times. Q1 2016 is about when that should start happening.
[+] [-] archagon|11 years ago|reply
I've been thinking lately of where I would like to live for most of my late twenties and early thirties. I'm definitely a bit of a loner, but at the same time, I like living as part of a close-knit community. I wish I could find a little "tribe" of self-directed folks roughly my age in an old, creaky house somewhere in the mountains... or on a remote island... or in a forest, or something. Just people working on their projects, tending to their garden, raising some chickens (or maybe some kids), enjoying the fresh air, and mostly living away from the rest of society. An art commune for the 21st century, I guess.
Unfortunately, if such a place exists, I doubt it has a website, and I especially doubt they'd take in strays. Guess I'd have to organize it myself. It's too bad I don't know anyone else who'd want to live like this. (And even if I did, who knows if we'd get along?)
Maybe I'll just go and become a hermit.
[+] [-] caser|11 years ago|reply
We've already run a co-living, co-working trip in Costa Rica and are about to begin another one in SE Asia.
[+] [-] ZeroFries|11 years ago|reply
Some challenges: initial capital (does one person buy and rent to rest, or is it equal ownership?) How to settle internal disputes (which would vary based on which of the above set ups you choose) Ensuring everyone has enough remote work to pay for any (albeit probably small) expenses. Legal challenges. Wanting to be remote yet requiring Internet, electricity, groceries (unless you plan on growing nearly all of your food, which brings other challenges).
Note that these challenges aren't necessarily unique and have been faced by basically every commune/intentional community, so researching some of the strategies employed by others would be key.
It's still a lovely dream, though.
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
http://nomadforum.io/ has some pretty diverse people, i'd ask people there, maybe someone knows someone who knows the perfect website-less place.
[+] [-] mhomde|11 years ago|reply
I guess the selection that will occur based on the price can be either positive or negative depending on your taste.
One of the reason to join one of these communities, I would think, is to socialize and network with interesting individual... and you might want to pay extra for that. Then again, if the prize de facto excludes the people you find interesting than not so much :)
I think I'd try to do a little prize segmentation with tiered costs, that way you could perhaps get more interesting people and maximize profit. Then again maybe it will book fully using these prizes
[+] [-] personlurking|11 years ago|reply
On a side note, something I've been looking for for many years is a simple, no frills, cheap room rental service across the world's largest cities. Of course, now there's Airbnb, but I'd prefer one company that administers the living locations + design/look of the rooms, if that makes sense, rather than a network of regular people using a site to rent out their places. Basically, I want to know exactly what I'm getting (ie, same price, size, amenities, ease) no matter which city I go to. Like a hotel chain but for short, middle, and/or long term rentals.
Caravanserai looks like a promising start, though I'm also aware of the effort + price points from living abroad (I'm currently in Lisbon), and it's about 50-60% less than the lofty $1,600 mentioned (however, a co-working space here is around $220/mo, and I didn't include this factor in my estimate).
All that said, I am quite the stickler but surely most people won't mind paying the currently-set price.
[+] [-] contingencies|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dropit_sphere|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dmayle|11 years ago|reply
http://www.cohousing.org/node/1537
[+] [-] mooreds|11 years ago|reply
http://boulderhousingcoalition.org/
Edit: Oops, didn't see the income limitations before I posted.
[+] [-] psykovsky|11 years ago|reply
[0] http://ruigoord.nl/
[+] [-] jkaunisv1|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] larsberg|11 years ago|reply
It's a bit of a minefield, and I only know the warnings that legal/HR tell managers :-)
[+] [-] hackerboos|11 years ago|reply
I doubt that for $1600 a month this includes all the legal paperwork in order to work in Portugal, Mexico and Indonesia.
It's another abuse of the visa-free status many Westerners are given by countries that wish to attract tourists.
This is the second one I've seen today. First is here - http://drrn.net/why-did-i-move-to-thailand-to-bootstrap-my-s...
Edit: I'm not aware of any new Thai visas being announced. It definitely would have been mentioned on ThaiVisa.com. Please post a link.
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] unfortunateface|11 years ago|reply
Edit: to clarify/simplify
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
Just was stuck for a few days in the Alps with the overhead bin luggage for Bali on the way back to SF, so i feel your pain.
How would you prefer to have it handled?
[+] [-] annon|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] jballanc|11 years ago|reply
Turkey is an amazing place to work and live, there's an incredibly vibrant hacker community, and the people are some of the most welcoming in the world (especially if you're a visitor). Istanbul rents on the European side can run pretty high, but on the Asian side (and with the way the exchange rate is going these days), I think you'd be remiss to leave it out.
If not Istanbul, Ankara has a bunch of universities and rents are considerably cheaper. Bodrum, too, has relatively low rents and absolutely amazing natural beauty. Ok, enough ranting...
Seriously cool concept, though. I look forward to seeing where you take it!
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
We looked at Istanbul, but it was prohibitively expensive, at least for our Beta batch where we reserve certain safety buffer for things that could go wrong and in the neighborhoods we looked at.
Coastal towns like Bodrum could be a nice choice, any areas in Istanbul we should reconsider?
[+] [-] nathan_f77|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] titanomachy|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] polshaw|11 years ago|reply
I really love the concept but as presented it isn't appealing. The idea of not having to deal with all the hassle of finding and organising accommodation is great.. but they only have (and not even that yet) 3 locations. "hey you can travel the world (3 locations)" doesn't have so much appeal. Obviously they plan on expanding but the price is for now, not the future.
I suspect that if someone decides to stay for more than a couple of months they will often splinter off into cheaper accommodation. Having the fixed fee also makes it difficult to set up in the most sensible (cheapest) areas.. because the attraction of going it alone in those areas will be higher the better value the area is.
It strikes me they would have been better off setting up a handful of these locations first as individual nomad/co-habitation accommodation, ironing out all the issues, and then introducing the go-anywhere subscription idea. They've left themselves an awful lot to deal with in one go.
1. nomadlist.com
[+] [-] gwbas1c|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] lukasm|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] dcarmo|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] caser|11 years ago|reply
hackerparadise.org
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] Red_Tarsius|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
And we hope there are many more in cities like NY, SF or London.
[+] [-] KevinBongart|11 years ago|reply
BUT WHY OH WHY THE SCROLL HIJACKING?
[+] [-] ryanSrich|11 years ago|reply
Hijacking is specifically altering the speed and or movement of the scroll.
[+] [-] Scramblejams|11 years ago|reply
I hate this trend towards elimination of affordances.
[+] [-] titanomachy|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] guard-of-terra|11 years ago|reply
What should they do to make me really happy? Be able to invest some sum of money (or an existing property?) and enjoy a lifetime of co-living (they need much more destinations, of course). This can be a nice mode of rapid growth, property in exchange to co-living promise.
[+] [-] brunooo|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] awch|11 years ago|reply
The inclusion of a moped or shared vehicle in each location would seal the deal for me.
[+] [-] jessaustin|11 years ago|reply
One of the perks of cheap locations is that hiring a cab is cheap. Also you can ride a bike. Also driving is the least relaxing way to experience any of these places.
[+] [-] paulftw|11 years ago|reply
Standardized rooms all over the world, run as a network of independent providers adhering to the international code of practice, advertised and paid for on AirBNB (because we already have hassle free hotel check in experience, why build another one).
... and stuffed with IKEA furniture we all know and love :)
[+] [-] tomp|11 years ago|reply
I can't speak for NY, but in London, you could get a nice room in a shared flat for 890 GBP (=1356 USD) on the edge of first zone, so the commute (monthly Underground ticket for zones 1&2) would be a much more reasonable 130 GBP (=200 USD), far from 698 USD as listed on the site.
[+] [-] hruu|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] codecamper|11 years ago|reply
3g Internet in Portugal is a little bit expensive. Not too bad -- about 2 euro a Gig. 500 euros a month will get you a nice place. Not sure about how long a lease you'd need to sign.
Mexico City. Why on earth would you want to go to Mexico City?
[+] [-] WildUtah|11 years ago|reply
Because the most beautiful and exciting city on Earth is full of artists, programmers, scholars, great street food, great fancy restaurants, museums, history, good looking and outgoing young locals, sports clubs, perfect weather, rugged mountain wilderness, organic ripe produce year round, religious pilgrimage sites, great universities, live music and theatre, pretty architecture, peaceful parks, lively squares and plazas, fast easy transit and bikeshare programs, and a constant parade of special events.
Plus, if you're earning in euros or dollars, it's cheap.
[+] [-] O____________O|11 years ago|reply
Why wouldn't you want to go to Mexico City? It's said to feel very European, and there's a lot of interesting history and architecture. I'd go there just as soon as I'd go to Bangkok.
[+] [-] justizin|11 years ago|reply
[+] [-] tonyhb|11 years ago|reply
As an aside I can't understand why, as a first step, co-working spaces in different locations haven't partnered up to offer this to people looking to move around and sort out their own accommodation. Having the availability of, say, Regus offices, with the entrepreneurship and tech focus found in current co-working spaces would be a huge plus.
[+] [-] AYBABTME|11 years ago|reply
- Are there more locations that are considered?
- Is this meant to grow with demand, or be limited to a few first-come/first-served offering?
- It's not clear to me (maybe I misread) what happens when I move to another country. Am I holding a lock on the rooms everywhere, or am I allocated a room on request?
I work remote, and currently in school but once done, I totally want to start moving around the world for periods of times. Q1 2016 is about when that should start happening.
[+] [-] deerpig|11 years ago|reply
$1,600 is more than a little pricey....
[+] [-] rohunati|11 years ago|reply