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Ask HN: How to learn new things better?

222 points| kahrkunne | 9 years ago

So in the spirit of new year's resolutions I'm planning to learn some new things this year; specifically, I want to to draw, and I want to at least get started learning Japanese. I'd also like to keep improving my skill at mahjong, which I picked up last year, and keep on learning tech-related things.

However, I find it pretty difficult to pick up new things. Learning to draw especially is pretty overwhelming for me; I have no idea how to start, as someone with no skill or experience in drawing whatsoever. Learning a language is also pretty intimidating, and it doesn't help that I find the usual way of learning languages (grinding flash cards) to be distinctly awful (not to mention I'm terrible at it).

As HN seems like a community where people love to learn new things, how do you guys go about things like these?

90 comments

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[+] Asdfbla|9 years ago|reply
Maybe just throwing it out there as an additional resource: Coursera has a "learning how to learn" course, which includes lots of references about the theory of learning but many hands-on tips too. It's not too time consuming and doesn't cost anything, so probably can't hurt to look at it. I liked it and try to apply some of the ideas when learning.

https://www.coursera.org/learn/learning-how-to-learn/

[+] dyukqu|9 years ago|reply
I too was going to mention this course.

It is absolutely fantastic, IMO. Going through every week/lecture of it, I keep saying myself it must be an obligatory course for every freshman. We are surrounded with so many distractions in our ordinary daily life and most of us are terrible at habit formation. Procrastination and irregular sleep pattern are our most-common "habit". Long story short, IMHO, this course is a must for whom wants to form a habit, learn how to avoid procrastination / about the importance of sleep / how to avoid distractions and other relevant things.

[+] hive_mind|9 years ago|reply
"Flow" seems to help a lot.

I recently did some image editing with GIMP. (I usually use Photoshop, and don't really like GIMP, but decided to use it because it is FLOSS and I'm switching to FLOSS where available.)

It was one of my first times using it, and it was difficult to use. I had to check a couple tutorials on YouTube before I could get into the flow.

Once I got into the flow, it was an amazing feeling. And after I was done editing, I was able to learn other, new things unrelated to GIMP.

This is the most difficult thing for me: getting into the flow. I suspect that GIMP won't be able to get me into the flow once I become better at it.

It's such a mystery: flow. There are reams and reams written about it on the internet. On how to hack it. Do this, do that.

What I want is a simple activity, that once I start doing it, I automatically get into flow (so that I can harness the momentum to learn other things). Anyone have personal experience with such "hack flow" activities?

[+] amelius|9 years ago|reply
Can somebody who has finished academic education still learn from this course?
[+] ludicast|9 years ago|reply
Going through the class myself. Really good approach - probably more valuable than any other class I've done.

Can't praise enough.

[+] gargarplex|9 years ago|reply
I enjoyed duolingo (https://www.duolingo.com) for learning Swedish. I liked the game mechanics, honestly. Here's why:

* Positive reinforcement: cheerful noises and visual progress once I completed a section.

* Negative reinforcement: if I didn't practice at all that day, I would get a notification at 11pm. If I ignored for a while, they were super passive aggressive, saying things like "These don't seem to be working. We'll stop sending them". I felt guilty and would start agin.

* I wanted to keep my daily streak going. It made me feel like Jerry Seinfeld with his "write a joke a day; put an X on the calendar" technique.

* I liked the concepts of experience (exp) and levels; it let me feel like I was making concrete progress, even if I was totally incompetent. I indulged my gamer side while still being productive!

* duolingo works just as well on browser as mobile

* Training sessions were short enough that if I only had a few minutes of downtime, as long as I had my phone on me, I could actually be productive. This made subway rides that much better.

* duoolingo offers a practice mode where I could work specifically on my speed if I had longer chunks of time and wanted to dive deeper.

And today, I can totally speak intelligible Swedish [1]. It worked.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxoXe5FDIkA – some phrases are off (I should've said "hur man sköter marknadsföring själv") and pronunciation is off.

[+] nothrabannosir|9 years ago|reply
It's personal, but Duolingo has gone a bit south for me. They are (understandably) focusing on getting users to pay. It just hit me in an unfortunate way: Duolingo is all about "streaks". After a fifteen day streak, I was greeted with "You broke your streak! Buy it back for $3.50." I hadn't broken it, I remembered the exact lesson I did, 100%. Sent them an e-mail; no reply. A week later, I'm talking to my sister, exact same thing happened to her 180 day streak... Another e-mail, again no reply.

All in all, a petty detail, of course. It was the lack of response to support e-mail that got me, not so much the situation itself.

Used to be a fan, but that wasn't a great moment. :(

[+] aaron987|9 years ago|reply
I've been using Duolingo to learn Italian. It was awesome up until about 40% fluency, then it lost its effectiveness. It was a great way to learn basic vocabulary and sentence structure, but after that I learned more by just reading my news in Italian.
[+] adgulacti|9 years ago|reply
duolingo is much better in browser than mobile. there it has course summaries, tables, etc. meanwhile, i think it focuses too much on vocabulary. instead it should be daily dialogue driven.
[+] welanes|9 years ago|reply
So, I've spent the last 7 days working on a new feature to help people set and work towards goals.

The concept goal: Learning Japanese! (I've been 'learning' for 3 years now).

Here's a screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/afAW49V.png.

Basically it's a moodboard that combines a timer, todos, insights, notes, images and links.

'How does that help me learn new things better' you ask?

The challenge with goals - as I see it - is keeping the path from the you of today to the aspirational you (the one that speaks Japanese) clear. January kicks off, a whole bunch of life gets in the way and when you finally get time to focus that path has become a nebulous mess.

The idea with Goals is to be able to open the app and immediately know:

1. What have I achieved so far: insights on hours spent, tasks completed and how close you are to your goal.

2. What do I have to do next: this is your "how". Tasks, links, audio files, notes.

3. Why am I doing this, again? images, media, notes.

The 'Why' doesn't really fit into most methods of learning but I think forgetting this is the biggest point of failure.

I'm going to grab a coffee and get this shipped. I'll post it to Show HN tomorrow and you can see if it's for you.

[+] kahrkunne|9 years ago|reply
I'll be sure to lurk HN tomorrow for it!

Also pleasantly surprised to see Kashiwa Daisuke mentioned in that screenshot

[+] vogt|9 years ago|reply
I've been leaning towards learning Japanese as a 2017 goal, so this or any other tips would be very much appreciated!
[+] oddlyaromatic|9 years ago|reply
This sounds good, I'm going to look out for it.
[+] adpoe|9 years ago|reply
I've decided to learn many, many things over the years: programming languages, human languages, musical instruments, drawing/painting/art, sports, math, chess, etc...

What it comes down to is spending time getting your hands dirty making things (or getting real practice), even if your output sucks for a long time. (And it will.)

Favorite personal example: One day, when I was around 19, I decided that I wanted to be an artist. I hadn't seriously drawn anything since I was about 10. My current skills were atrocious, but I started drawing every single day, anyway, undeterred.

Of course, at first I was awful. But I copied old master paintings, drew pictures of famous sculptures, etc.; all of my free-time, I spent drawing. And slowly, but surely, I got better at it. I did this every day for probably about 3 years or so, and by the end of it, I was very accomplished. But it was a constant effort that took years. I probably did over 1,000 drawings, hundreds of paintings, and so on. And about 90% of them were awful. But the good stuff, it was really really good. I guess that's the price sometimes. Nobody is a genius all the time. Even Michelangelo, or Picasso.

The thing is, if you find something you enjoy, it doesn't feel like work or drudgery. (Even though drudgery is the only way to get better.) Instead, it's an activity that you want to spend time on, and when you do--time passes so quickly you don't know where it went. It's like living life on fast forward. (Maybe that feeling's the real-life inspiration for the old trope of the training montage. A deep kernel of truth beneath the fantasy, after all?)

[+] infinityplus1|9 years ago|reply
So,are you working as an artist now?
[+] sp3n|9 years ago|reply
I have been learning to draw for the past 2 months or so. I want to get into digital painting but I am still learning the fundamentals with a pencil + paper.

A few things that have helped me so far:

- Setting aside at least 1 hour a day to draw. This one is the most important.

- Drawing from the Right Side of the Brain by Betty Edwards

- Fun with a pencil by Andrew Loomis

- Ctrl+Paint: http://www.ctrlpaint.com/ especially the Traditional Drawing, Composition, Perspective and Anatomy sections.

- Sycra's YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL0373FA2B3CD4C899

[+] aerique|9 years ago|reply
For the OP if she happens to have a Wii U I want add Art Academy: Atelier to that list. I'm working through that now and it's keeping me engaged.
[+] kayman|9 years ago|reply
Block out your calendar to learn a specific task.

Don't overthink. Just do it.

And after a few months of trying and reading the process will get better automatically.

Key is to just start and be regular.

[+] teach|9 years ago|reply
Agreed. Unless you're doing barbell squats it's far more important in my experience to just get started.

Waiting to start until you have the perfect equipment or technique or form or strategy raises the starting friction and prevents me from doing a great many things I should be doing.

[+] CuriouslyC|9 years ago|reply
Check out Dr. Robert Bjork's page on desirable difficulties (https://bjorklab.psych.ucla.edu/research/).

Additionally, you need to write about whatever you're learning. Essays, reviews, whatever strikes your fancy. Learning really happens when you try to use the information.

[+] kahrkunne|9 years ago|reply
I'll try writing about what I'm learning, I really like the sound of that! Another one of my new year's resolutions was to start writing things anyways - I feel like I frequently write entire essays in my head, but I never put them to paper.
[+] rm_-rf_slash|9 years ago|reply
I learned Chinese at my best pace by watching Chinese TV streams while practicing calligraphy over and over, as well as studying vocabulary and grammar with the streams of Chinese TV in the background.

Chinese TV sucks. I paid no attention to the ctl+c-ctl+v plots. However it did help me learn tonality in a way that the butchered American classmate pronunciations could never do. Subtitles also helped with learning characters.

I have found that learning works best with as much immersion as possible. It is never as casual as a subway commute crossword puzzle.

[+] simonhughes22|9 years ago|reply
Spaced repetition is very effective, although again it does require flash cards, but optimizes (i.e. minimizes) the frequency at which you have to review them based on how you are learning.
[+] teach|9 years ago|reply
Anki[0] is an excellent, free spaced-repetition app if making paper flash cards isn't your style.

[0] http://ankisrs.net/

[+] Broken_Hippo|9 years ago|reply
On learning to draw:

A bit of background: I drew before I could write, started oil painting when I was 7 or 8. I'm 38 now, and usually work with pen and watercolors.

The first thing I suggest you do is check out some lessons. There are a lot of, "how to draw" for children (and adults) that are really useful - especially for people and animals. I still use reference photos and look up techniques from time to time, actually. I also suggest watching Bob Ross. I might not paint landscapes, but his technique is definitely good - you'll likely pick a bit up even if you don't paint.

I'd also suggest learning about color theory, perspective, and eventually how light sources affect the work - some of these can be forgotten if you do more abstract stuff. Remember, part of drawing is basically training your fine motor skills and muscles to do things: This all gets better with time, and why folks suggest sketching daily. This is the same with painting.

Some folks can paint but can't draw as well: I fully suggest trying some painting along with the sketching. You might find that you like doing abstract art, focusing more on texture, use of space, and colors than actual form too. (You can draw just as abstractly, and doing so is good line and texture practice).

And random advice: Switching from pencil to ink isn't as scary as it seems. It helps to break things up into smaller pieces. Sometimes it helps to change a color photo to black and white.

And I'm out of stuff from the tope of my head.

[+] wturner|9 years ago|reply
What works for me is to integrate the thing I want to learn into my lifestyle and do it everyday. If I have a day where I am inspired or particularly creative I just funnel that energy into the topic. Along the way I give myself small project goals that emerge from exploring the activity.

The ideal scenario is to become immersed so the topic becomes "part of you".

I also give myself a two year gestation period of incremental learning to see results and build muscle memory. I did this with programming and once you do it with one topic, you will build the confidence that it will come to fruition with anything else you decide to do.

I'm not a fan of peddling the idea that anything worth learning can be learned "fast". It may work for some people, but I think they are the minority. it's been my experience there's usually a fair amount of self deception involved in "fast" learning....or "fast" anything for that matter. This works for some people - I'm not one of them.

If you want to learn a new language then walk around with headphones listening to people speak it. When you talk to people in English in your head ask yourself how to say the same thing in the alternate language. etc....

[+] g00gler|9 years ago|reply
This. I had programmed on and off for awhile, never anything big, until I started doing it everyday. Now it's part of who I am and the way I think, kinda crazy.
[+] JoshTriplett|9 years ago|reply
Even if you're a self-taught person, you don't have to learn everything that way, rather than (for instance) taking a class or otherwise going through a course of study. Not necessarily a university class; check out your local community center, or seek out a local artist that also teaches on the side.
[+] medell|9 years ago|reply
The first time I learned a new language I didn't use these tools and I failed miserably. Looking back, I'm thinking "Why did I use 300 hours and spend $X of cash?" without taking the time to learn about learning.

This is especially true with languages, unless you can be fully immersed, but I still recommend it. Look into metacognition and spaced repetition. You'll need a system that works for you but look for techniques backed by research.

Specifically, Fluent Forever is a fantastic book on learning how to learn languages and Scott Young's blog mentioned is great. I second the art recommendation "Drawing on the Right Side of the Brain". Good luck!

[+] akbar23|9 years ago|reply
Check out Beyond Brilliance-a book that was just released out of UC Berkeley designed to teach you how to learn. www.beyondbrilliance.org
[+] xiaoma|9 years ago|reply
Wow! I feel like we're kindred spirits! Drawing on the left side of the brain is an incredible book that did it for me. I've been writing about language learning all over for years, but this interview with Gabriel Wyner is a great spot to start: http://lingsprout.com/en/experts/gabriel-wyner-making-your-o...

He was in the process of studying Japanese at the time of the interview and had some specific comments about it vs the several languages he's learned before.

[+] rcdexta|9 years ago|reply
You mean Drawing on the right side of the brain? http://drawright.com/

I was wondering if there was another school of thought that I missed out completely till now! :)

[+] wasyl|9 years ago|reply
From my experience it's amazing to spend at least 20 minutes every (I mean every) single day on the thing you're learning. Whether it's playing an instrument or learning language, there are days when you seem to not have time for that - but 20 minutes is easily found, and it really, really, really helps. I think I've seen some research regarding that, but I might be remembering wrong. What I know for sure is that it both helped me learn more efficiently, but also helped me through weeks of lesser motivation
[+] yhylord|9 years ago|reply
Is it still realistic when you want to start multiple things at once? Or should you really go one by one?
[+] throwaway_proc|9 years ago|reply
I want to strongly recommend this book on procrastination: https://www.amazon.com/Procrastinators-Digest-Concise-Solvin...

I started studying (math) at university this fall for the first time in my life. I'm 32 years old. I have extreme problems to adjust myself to the workload that is required. The other freshmen struggle as well, but I have clearly more problems.

The problems arise most noticably when I'm not subverted to direct peer pressure, that is, when I'm not sitting in university to do homework with my group partners. As the workload is (or seems) so extreme, at least for us freshmen, I just didn't have time to do anything else than sit in uni to do homework, often until 8 or 10 pm or even into the night when there was a deadline the next morning.

What I should have done differently so far is prioritizing the learning of material over just trying to get stuff done inefficiently. I realise that these inefficiencies and getting rid of them are a normal part of growing up academically.

The procrastination problem starts to show up most visibly in my spare time, where I have the time but just cannot bring myself to learn the material. This is where the book really helps. I admit, I just finished it and it will take some time to show results. The thing is, I knew for years (which I have wasted partially) that gaming, reddit, HN, twitch.tv, etc. are a strong negative influence for me. The book helped me realise just how bad my procrastination problem really is and it already helped me be more productive in situations where otherwise I just couldn't bring myself to work on important stuff due to distractions.

[+] daniel-levin|9 years ago|reply
I would advise you to be as experimental as possible, and see what works for you. Each person learns things in their own way. Just picking a particular path (such as using Duolingo, as others have suggested) may work. It may not. I have found that this rings especially true in technical subjects.

My personal suggestions are Duolingo, and "Drawing on the Right Side of the Brain" by Betty Edwards. I went from stick men to badly-proportioned but otherwise lifelike still-lifes in a few hours with this book. I have a very strong audio memory so Duolingo works well for me. The most important aspect to getting not-terrible at anything is deliberate practice [1]. Drills, and boring exercises work very well for me.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Practice_(learning_method)

[+] pravenj|9 years ago|reply
My methods are divided into 2 -- binge and short bursts. In both I tend to use open ended questioning, perspectives and reflections as ways of enhancing the learnings.

Binge is method I use to learn a lot about a topic in the shortest period possible. I start a binge with either trying to understand more about a topic or to try an see whether a hunch I have in regard to the topic is well worth following.

Short burst is a method I use to learn something more deeply and more over a longer term. In this I put in 5-10 minutes 3-4 times a day maybe for a period of about 2-3 weeks. Then rest and reflect for a couple of weeks and then go through the cycle again.

I have written a post about it here : http://prjoshi.com.np/2017/01/02/on-learning/

Hope it helps.