Ask HN: Parents, what are you doing for school this fall?

[mbf1]

I'm a professional software engineer with two middle-school aged children and a working partner cramped into a small apartment. Since the shelter in place orders happened and my employer switched everyone to work from home, my apartment has seemed less and less suitable for productivity. It's also not the best environment for children to remain cooped up in their rooms on electronics all day, every day. My partner and I have experimented with some online camps and our local public schools have gone purely virtual, but I'm considering alternative schools this year as well as moving out of our cramped apartment.

Parents: What have you tried? What did you love? What did you hate?

[joe_hills]

Single dad here in a small apartment with a 7yo whose school went fully remote.

I switched to a reduced-hours contractor status at my day job and went "full-time" on my side project so I can make my own schedule.

I do the bulk of my focused work either after my kid goes to bed or before she starts school for the day.

During the day when she's in class, it seems like every class period, there's at least one or two tech issues she needs help with. To keep that time productive for me, I do household chores, meal prep, and any easily-interruptable work-related tasks (like writing correspondence).

It's not ideal, but I feel like I can make it work for us indefinitely.

[actfrench]

I really admire you for doing this on your own with kids in a small apartment. Does your teacher use zoom? One thing that's helped me a lot with my digital pod so the parents don't have to be interrupted is installing software where I can access the child's computer. I also enable screen share for everyone. If your child's teacher is open to getting support to making this more easy for families, I'd be happy to talk to her. Let me know.

[cvhashim]

That’s a very packed schedule. Well done on managing your time.

[westondeboer]

This is how I am working also. I have requested that all meetings in the future happen after 3, so the kids will be done with their schooling.

Today was the first day of school and my kids are in 3rd grade.

Just like you said, there was at least four times that I needed to come over and fix tech support issues. And help them figure out how to do something.

I am trying to figure out which is better right now, with using ipad, laptop, or chromebooks.

[jwally]

Texas, Dallas: Nothing ground breaking, but I'll provide my anecdote as a possible antidote to survivor-bias:

I have 3 kids (5,3,1). The 5 year old was supposed to start public school this year, but her pre-school opened up a private kindergarten and we opted in.

When the pandemic first broke, we pulled our kids out for 2 months and it was hard for us and them. My wife worked in the morning when I had the kids and we swapped at noon, and finished up work after we put the kids down for bed.

We tried following some sort of curriculum for the first 2 weeks, but it fell apart pretty quick and devolved into me throwing the kids in a wagon and walking around the neighborhood then going in the backyard and pushing them on a swing. Anytime I had a meeting in the morning or my wife had one in the afternoon, we'd plop them in front of the TV then struggle pulling them away from it afterwards (google wifi is great for deus-ex-machina internet outages...).

It stings having to pay an extra $15k / yr, but for our kids learning and mental health I'd happily pay double. In my humble opinion, our teachers don't make near enough for the service they provide.

[bertjk]

> we'd plop them in front of the TV then struggle pulling them away from it afterwards (google wifi is great for deus-ex-machina internet outages...).

I can totally relate. One day our kids will figure out that our fiber internet service is actually quite reliable, and that I've been using the ASUS router app to disconnect specific devices at needed times. My 9 year old is starting to suspect something is amiss. "Daddy, can you stop buying chromebooks? Maybe you should buy another brand. It stops working all the time but your computer never stops working."

[mm89]

> It stings having to pay an extra $15k / yr, but for our kids learning and mental health I'd happily pay double.

Austinite here w/family in Dallas. Dallas is unusual compared to Austin/Houston in that nearly anyone coming from a wealthy family living in Dallas proper goes to private schools. I'm not from Dallas but have friends who attended Hockaday, Ursuline, Jesuit, and BL. I always thought it was really odd how many of them went to private school versus my Houston-area friends, who nearly all attended public schools in the suburbs, or one of the better inner-city public schools like Memorial or Lamar. Don't know as much about Austin but from what I hear the public schools here are pretty great too.

[actfrench]

Did you have any luck with digital apps or youtube videos? I've found that some tools are much more effective for personalized, independent learning than others - whereas others require much more parent or teacher involvement. The more they resemble tools used in school, the more work the parent has to do to understand them because they utilize specific methods that have been standardized as teaching methods for group classes to benefit the maximum number of students well (but not necessarily individual students well). Then, in addition to knowing the material, the person facilitating has to understand that specific teaching method (like common core teaching techniques).

As a teacher, I've found that most kids either respond best to digital apps , videos or building stuff for independent learning.

If your kids like TV, they might respond really well to Khan Academy or some of the extraordinarily wonderful educational youtube videos out there. I myself used to be resistant to TV, but then I saw how much vocabulary and science especially our 3 year old was learning from his videos, and I started to change my opinion. I also find that if I let him watch as many shows as he wants, he'll eventually get bored and want to do something else.

If it's of interest to you I've spent the last couple months curating a list of my all-time favorite educational youtube channels for kids. The factors I used for vetting them were that they were 1) secular 2) mastery-based 3) fun and engaging for kids 4) scientifically accurate

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC_x3VzF6ifPzFJARuqMulSQ/cha...?

You might be interested to know there's a whole group of homeschoolers that do their entire schooling around youtube videos and documentaries and are really happy with the results they're seeing in their kids. It's often called "documentary schooling"

In the film, class dismissed, the mom gets really frustrated because she feels like her kids are "just watching youtube" all day. Then she goes upstairs and finds out her younger daughter has taught herself sign language. I think sometimes don't give our kids enough credit for the natural curiosity and where it can take them!

Here's a few other groups focused on documentary or youtube schooling:

Homeschooling with Netflix and other secular media https://www.facebook.com/groups/267905676686095/

homeschooling with Netflix https://www.facebook.com/groups/homeschoolingwithnetflix/

Also check out "Gameschooling" if your kids like video games or board games:) https://www.facebook.com/groups/GameschoolMyLittlePoppies/

Also, I agree with you - teachers are incredible. A 15k education is well worth the price.

[zwm]

Young couple here with a 9yo living in a 900sqft apt. Both of us were fortunate enough to scrape by with above poverty income and government sponsored medical insurance while working from home. What have worked is... (1) 60 mins walk morning and evening, (2) 3 x 180 mins outdoor activity per week, (3) 3-5 x 60 mins tech tickets to be rewarded throughout the day for responsibilities and ability to reset emotions after an outburst; first ticket given in morning for just waking up on time and folding blankets, etc, (4) encourage hobbies such as coding, drawing, guitar, blender which keeps child occupied for a couple 1-2 hr and allow us to build our online business, (5) child diagnose w/ ocd, adhd, and likely mild autism, so we are always on our toes but the strict yet flexible schedule allow us to work with our child's personality, (6) sunday kid day! I think what helps the most is my child can combine hobby time + tech ticket to give me a few hours of uninterrupted time each day. I also try not to feel like the child is neglected and as a parent, I want to spend enough quality time with my child without regret. It's an uphill battle still after 2 years of home school. The toughest part is getting time to spend with your spouse but unlike us, you might be able ease things with family support.

[actfrench]

I think it is so admirable that you've made such sacrifices to give your child the best education they can possibly have. Have you joined any homeschool co-ops or babysitting co-ops to give you and your partner a little time together?

[jph00]

I've been surprised at how well our 4 y.o daughter has adjusted to the online world, on the whole. Whilst not all of our friends' children have the same experience, I've noticed it's fairly common for children we know (at least of this age) to quickly adapt to making friends and socializing and learning through Zoom/Skype/etc.

Mornings are spent on "Kid's Club" via https://www.modulo.app , which is a fairly new startup that provides online spaces for kids to learn together, hang out together, etc. My daughter has made a number of new friends through that and she's able to do a lot of the same stuff she was doing before (art, learning apps, etc), but in a more social way. Sometimes she gets to help other kids when they get stuck with their learning apps, and visa versa, which is fun. We're likely to expand this to some of the afternoon too, since they're adding a Spanish program.

Overall, I've noticed that her development has thrived since she's moved to a more self-paced environment. There's been no sign that using screens a lot is causing any problems. We've set up an iPad on an adjustable goose-neck stand so she can (and does) run around a lot and her friends can still see her. We also make sure there's time outside for exercise.

We've found a lot of good online resources, generally free or very cheap, such as Cosmic Kids Yoga, Draw Every Day with JJK, Mo Willems Doodles, and Khan Academy Kids. We've also discovered kids coding apps, like CodeSpark and SpriteBox, that have been a big hit. The teacher at Modulo.app does a good job of helping us find resources for stuff our daughter takes an interest in, and we share stuff we find with them too.

We're both full-time parents, and certainly we're not as productive as we were before, but for me it's a totally acceptable compromise. I get to be more involved in my child's development and I get to see her much more than I did before. One key thing is to have carefully planned schedules for everyone in the house. Kids are generally much happier when they have a schedule, and it also means as parents we know when we can arrange meetings, do live coding, and so forth.

We're very lucky to have these options. I know a lot of parents just don't have the ability to work from home, or to reduce their working hours to spend more time with their children.

[jasonmorton]

We've been working with Modulo as well; the experience is excellent and is constantly adapting to make it work for our kids, rather than imposing a formula. They enjoy having some autonomy in their education. It's a very nice community as well, and they have the chance to make friends all over the country.

[dbancajas]

is modulo.app the official app endorsed by school? or are you homeschooling?

[whafro]

I have a first grader. Our public school system, which is ordinarily great, has a very vague plan that begins with a hybrid system that operates two mornings a week.

In response, we teamed up with five other families of first graders in our area, and have contracted with a tutor to handle the other three-and-two-half days of the week. We may switch to the remote learning option, since it seems like 75% of their class will do that, which would the benefit of in-person social experiences, but simplify logistics. When not in school, the five kids will be in a basement apartment at one of the families' houses with the tutor, working on their distance learning.

We still have a zillion and a half things to iron out, but it's both progress and ridiculous.

[HaloZero]

Whoa. Must be interesting on the pandemic pods. I haven't heard first hand about this in any of the articles I've been reading about it.

Do all 5 families have some kind of agreement about safety and rules about exposing yourself? Or is it some friends that you trust? I'm always curious about the dynamics there.

[actfrench]

It is so great that you are doing this for your children. The only way we can innovate education is by parents and teachers like you taking the time and having the courage to build something great for their kids. People like you change the world for the better.

[shaftway]

Background: We're in the bay area and our kids are 10 and 8.

We were lucky enough to get an au pair right before the lockdowns started in our area (literally picked him up the night before local lockdowns went into effect). We've had really positive experiences with the au pair program in the past, and our current one has been great, so we've treated him really well. Because of that he's agreed to extend until next summer, and that application went through before visas were locked down. This means that there's a dedicated person here for the kids for 45 hours per week, or about 9 hours per weekday.

We have a decent sized house, but it's hard to get any real focus time because even with the au pair and school the kids don't really respect boundaries. So the kids do most of their schoolwork in their rooms or at the dining table. They work in blocks of about 2 hours, and I schedule breaks to coincide with theirs. During the breaks we try to go for a short walk or something to get the wiggles out, and then it's back to work. Tuesdays (and sometimes Thursdays) I go to my spouse's office where I can isolate and get some real work done until late. We trade that time for Fridays, when I stop work a couple hours early so the au pair can leave if he wants to. If I need to be able to really focus I leave the house and go to a park where I can tether and crank out some real work. This is difficult though, as I need 2 laptops and a phone to get work done.

This wasn't a traditional au pair experience, so we plan on some really nice thank you gifts for our au pair at the end of his contract, and hopefully we'll be back in school next fall and can go back to something a little more normal.

[shaftway]

Oh, one additional thing. We're applying for an IEP for our son. He's diagnosed with ADHD and at the end of last year he did not do well. We're asking for a few things that'll help him (and us) stay aware of what he's required to do for independent assignments. Last year he had four TODO lists scattered across email, Google Classroom, verbal assignments, and some other external system.

[actfrench]

Do your students use any digital learning tools like Khan Academy, Math Tango or Prodigy? Is it the same experience having difficulty getting them to focus/respect boundaries as it is when they have to do school work?

[PenguinCoder]

What is the cost and experience of having an au pair, like ?

[weagle05]

The whole thing is fubar. We're doing our public school's virtual school for our 3 elementary age children. I don't see how its sustainable. This age group cannot do school by themselves, so my wife and I are having to do school while also trying to keep our work going. My productivity is just going to be shot.

This is day one, but here's what I'm going to try this week: 1). Get up earlier. I'm going to try to be in front of my computer with coffee by 5:30am. I'm hoping I can log a couple solid hours of work before I have to punch in for school. 2). Long lunch for the kids. Their school schedule only gives them 50 minutes, but the school is going to have to deal with it. I'm going to do 90 minutes so I can try to focus on work while inhaling a sandwich or something. 3) Bourbon when the kids are sleep.

I really hope we can get a rhythm and my kids can pick up some study skills where we don't have to be so hands-on.

[actfrench]

This sounds really stressful. Have you considered any virtual childcare/tutoring options? I run a digital learning pod that meets 3 hours a day. We use the online medium to our advantage, working together on math apps, yoga, science lessons, critical reading (sharing the screen) and other engaging activities. The kids love it and barely every need help from their parents. If you find apps and games your kids love, it's a lot easier to get them to focus than on stuff they dislike. Happy to recommend tools to you if it's helpful. My email is [email protected]

[jeffrallen]

Your proposed schedule will also need time for burnout and therapy. Maybe not a good plan...

You're going to have to let something slide. Choose one priority and then fit what you can into the time that's left, and accept that it doesn't all fit. I hope you choose your child as your priority, but you'll find your own way. Good luck.

[james_pm]

One of our two kids is 17 with special needs. I hope she will be able to attend in-person, daily. Her class sizes are already small and online learning isn't really effective as it's a modified, non-academic program she is in.

The other is 16 and will be attending in person every other day for half a day (1/4 of the time) and doing synchronous, online the rest of the time. She is attending an online summer school course this month to get the hang of things.

(context: Canadian, kids go to public school in Toronto)

[actfrench]

Hi all, I just wanted to offer my support to anyone who needs help thinking this through...I've been a teacher for 15 years, and also the founder of schoolclosures.org (which has helped over 100,000 families impacted by school closures. This fall, I started offering digital learning pods (for social interaction) combined with mastery learning (personalized recommendations for learning apps for independent study + 1-1 tutoring) for families impacted by school closures (Modulo.app) I've worked with hundreds of families looking to enrich their child's learning as a supplement or replacement to school. I'd be happy to talk to any family looking for support in figuring out what to do this fall. Every family's situation is unique and it can be helpful to speak to someone who has experience in the area. I know this has been really stressful and confusing for all - f anyone would like to talk (free of charge), I'd be happy to lend an ear and advise as best I can on education, homeschooling, curriculum, social-emotional concerns, financial security or anything related to school or working from home with kids. My email is [email protected]

[winphone1974]

I have 2 in elementary and one in middle school. Our public schools will supposedly open physical classes with an online option as well. You need to pick and commit to one. I'm strongly in the physical camp for many reasons, most importantly the online school in the spring was garbage and a lack of socialization at this age is a very real and serious public health concern-for healthy young kids with no underlying health issues maybe as important as COVID itself.

That said I personally don't schools will stay open until even Christmas and don't know what our next step will be. We've investigated private school as the class sizes are much smaller and they have far more flexibility and motivation to make in person learning work.

Context: western Canada with big public school classes and very few cases, the majority impacting very old and those with previous health concerns

[GiorgioG]

> lack of socialization at this age is a very real and serious public health concern

(No offense intended) I keep hearing this and wonder what proof we have of this? I have two kids, one introvert, one extrovert and neither seem to have been impacted. Sure they'd like to hang out with friends, but they're basically the same personality/kids/temperament they had pre-pandemic.

[flowerlad]

> lack of socialization at this age is a very real and serious public health concern-for healthy young kids with no underlying health issues maybe as important as COVID itself

Lack of socialization - for a few months - is as serious as a disease that's killing people by the hundreds of thousands?

Even if the kids themselves are at lower risk, they can transmit the disease to parents as well as teachers, who are much more vulnerable.

[actfrench]

This has been a painfully lonely time for many children. There's no good solution for this. But here are some ways, I've found families have navigated the social isolation piece

-small online clubs -daily scheduled facetime with friends -focusing on developing/nurturing healthy relationships with siblings and parents (this goes along way in building healthy attachments later in life) -socially distanced hikes with friends wearing masks -make friends with one other family who is also socially distancing.

[jeffrallen]

Amen, brother! Physical presence here until the house of cards falls down, then... Shuffle?

[dec0dedab0de]

Our school district made everyone decide if we were going to send the kids in or keep them home for remote school. My kid is in junior high, and did pretty good with remote school, so we decided to start the year at home.

I already worked from home so that wasn't a change. One thing that did change right at the beginning of lockdown was that I got diagnosed with a chronic illness that requires treatment that makes me immunocompromised, so that played a role in the decision.

[jeffrallen]

Sorry for your illness, and I wish the best for your family!

[MontagFTB]

Our school district is 100% distance learning for now. If you find yourself in a similar situation, here are some tips we have found helpful, especially for our 2nd grader:

1) Print out the daily/weekly schedule for the student, and put it up on the wall somewhere. This is one less tab they have to keep open and refer to constantly. Also, a second copy helps parents keep on top of the kids schedule. A color printer here is a huge benefit. We have an HP Color LaserJet Pro M255dw, and it’s amazing.

2) Get a headset with a microphone; aim for comfort more than style. Something over-ear with a cushioned headband. They’re going to be wearing it all day, and earbuds can fall out of small ears. My 7yo daughter looks like an airline pilot with hers on. They’re huge, but she loves them.

3) Encourage your child not to panic when something goes wrong. Adults are much better equipped to handle meeting malfunction than kids. They won’t get an unexcused absence or other demerit because of a computer malfunction. The kids extend grace to the teacher when they see it, and they’ll be treated in kind.

[westondeboer]

Which headphones did you go with?

[emidln]

My wife is a stay at home parent and taught my daughter for the last 3 months of the school year last year. My daughter (then in the 4th grade) was attending a private school in the Chicago suburbs. The transition was decent, with her school already having a 1:1 laptop program and Google Classroom integration into her curriculum. The only change was that 4th graders didn't take their chromebooks home, but when school was abruptly closed, the laptops came with. All of her subjects had asynchronous work pages or chapter questions, asynchronous reading, asynchronous projects, and then synchronous instruction, synchronous classmate discussion/talk/project time, and synchronous project presentations. My daughter's grades improved slightly, likely from the additional focus given the lack of classroom distractions at home. My wife was available to answer immediate questions while I was working from home in most subjects, although I helped out when additional perspectives were needed to learn the material (my wife and I had very different education experiences, so our methods tend to be divergent).

This year we had the option of a similar remote program for the first semester or in-person, with the commitment lasting until the grading period is over. We're very fortunate to have one parent who can easily dedicate time during the day and a program conducive to remote learning. I can only imagine the sleepless schedules that would be involved in a less structured online program or with both parents working.

The major reason for not moving to home schooling this year is to guarantee our place at the private school for 6th/7th/8th grade without a significant donation to get back in. It is sorta unfortunate to pay extra to home school our kid, but we enjoy the community in-person when that was available. We're lucky we're in a position to be able to choose this.

[dataminded]

We tried virtual via our daughter's private school and were really disappointed.

We are going to home-school with a private teacher.

We also found a couple of other families that we'll consider play-dates or select group lessons with.

[chrisseaton]

Like a traditional live-in governess (governor?)?

Clever, since they’re then part of your family bubble. Must be expensive though!

[dsr_]

Massachusetts: our school district is offering a choice between full-remote and hybrid week-in/week-remote programs, but noting that at least the first 2 months will be all-remote for everyone. Since our kids are of reasonable age, we asked them and accepted their preferences for all-remote. They get to change their minds at the end of the first semester.

[GiorgioG]

Home-schooling. Our public school system can't get its stuff together.

[jedberg]

I will start by saying I had the easiest possible situation to start with, and 100% acknowledge that privilege. My wife is a stay at home mom and I've worked from home for five years, and have an office with a door (and we have a yard). Also neither kid was in formal schooling yet in March. One was in preschool, which just shut its doors March 18th and gave us refunds, and the other is only three.

During the summer we enrolled the five year old in weekly art camp (all over Zoom). She had fun doing art and it kept her busy for a good chunk of the day. The camp was only an hour but then she'd spend a bunch of hours afterwards finish the project. She's enrolled in their after school program now which starts in a couple weeks.

She was supposed to start Kindergarten this year, but since we're in California, that's all remote over Google Meet. Right now she has a 1 hour Meet in the morning, and that's it. Starting next week there will be three meets throughout the day, once with the whole class and then two small groups with the teacher or a parent.

So far it's working out. The kinder teacher is embracing online learning and has good activities that work over Meet, and she's totally cool with younger siblings joining in (because apparently 1/2 the class has a younger sibling).

Beyond that, the kids just play with each other all day, and sometimes I take a break to play with them. My wife gets to work on her own projects but has to take frequent breaks to mediate their playtime or help them transition activities.

We have a rule in the house of no electronics when the sun is up. Sometimes we let them break the rule to play educational games, especially right now during the heat wave when they can't even go in the yard. But the rule is a good fallback when they want to use electronics: "Sorry, sun's still up!".

Also we're super lax about cleaning up toys, so I can't walk in a straight line in my house anymore. There are toys everywhere. But it's a small price to pay to avoid the daily clean up arguments!

[meristem]

Here: 8-year old twins with very different interests, school system fully remote for at least first 8 weeks, they are in different classes (it is the best solution, although 2x work for us). I have the weirder schedule (consultant, flexible hours with unmovable deliverable commitments)and my husband has mornings available. 1. We chose to keep them in public school, remote. 2 We chose to keep their nanny for an extra year to help with school (she has a psych degree and education experience) 3. We've set them up on the dinning room table, and 30 minutes into it realized we'll need to split them physically and get headphones with mics(no solution yet for physical separation)

We have loved: teachers who are technically adept.

Suggestions: Can you get a mobile wifi take one kid out at a time to do school outside? (This assume you are also in an area you can be outside in a safe way, between COVID and heat)

Can you and your partner talk to your companies and change your work hours? Are your employers on board with "this is not working from home, this is being at home during a pandemic, attempting to work"?

Have you found a way to prioritize some personal time daily/weekly so you two do not burn out to a crisp?

What we hate: the complete disruption. We are not great at teaching our kids, not because of lousy skill (we both taught college), but lousy patience teaching a young age group. We have done a lot of "learning on the go" this summer--for example: taking kids into a river, talking about currents, water sources, why stones in rivers are round, ecosystems, etc. Or playing with Gravitrax to explore gravity, friction, the topography of our 100 yr old house's living room (and why /how construction settles). But it is hard and it is not "curricular & organized"

We are also in a socioeconomic group that can afford a nanny, and have professions that have allowed for flexibility. We have had it "easy".

There is no way to overstate the sheer hellish hell of choices this all can be, and YMMV with anything I wrote here.

[tmaly]

Back when everyone went stay at home, my daughters Montessori school started zoom lessons. It was quite hectic to be doing work from home and keeping the kids in the right zoom room.

I spent time teaching my daughter different topics and used workbooks over the summer. She is in good shape for the start of school.

Right now the school is bringing kids back in, but giving them the option to do remote learning. I am going for the in person learning. Each kid is getting their own workspace, and they have to wear masks when they are not at their workspace.

If they were not considering in-person learning, I would probably opt to get some families together to create one of those learning pods.

[toddmorey]

We're in a tough spot because my wife has struggled with chronic respiratory infections and is in the high-risk patient population. But our youngest has special needs and remote learning can't provide the educational support he needs (though damn the teachers are awesome and creative and trying all they can).

First three weeks are remote for all students in my district, but we'll have some hard choices ahead balancing health and education needs. Seems so much these days is choosing between options that are all far, far from ideal.

Oh, and we live in Texas where 7,500 new cases/day are still being reported.

[actfrench]

Hi Todd, there is a group that might help you. It's a homeschooling group for children with special needs. Since many parents have pulled their kids out to address special needs, these parents have a huge wealth of knowledge about how to homeschool neurodiverse children. https://www.facebook.com/groups/homeschoolingpoppies/

What curriculum or learning apps have you tried so far? Some are better suited to different types of educational needs than others. I'd be happy to recommend some resources that might be helpful and also can connect you to specialists and tutors who are volunteering for free to help kids with special needs during the crisis.

Please let me know if I can be of support in any way I can.