Cybersquatter email

[andres]

From: "Thomas Li" <[email protected]>

Subject: important domain names: octopart.cn & octopart.com.cn

Dear Sirs,

We have octopart.cn & octopart.com.cn and found that the domains are useful for you if you want to explore China market.

We can really consider selling them out if you are interested in them.

Please get back to us with your kind offer.

Thanks

Regards,

Thomas

[BitGeek]

These are not "cybersquatters". Octo and Part are generic terms.

One of the domains I own is a combination of a word that means "software" and another word that means "place you like to go". I got it for a developers site... and then after I got it I discovered that there was an italian maker of luxury goods whose trademark is that word - apparently the combination of these two english words makes another word completely in italian.

Am I cybersquatting? I've considered selling this domain to them because its much better than the one that they are currently using. If I sell it to them, then they will be getting a better domain at a price that they think is fair (or they wouldn't be buying it).

Some may say I'm being opportunistic and this is wrong- well, I say that my intent was elsewhere and this was a surprise coincidence... but that my intent isnt' really relevant. If I'd registered the name then I have perfect rights to it-- after all if they'd wanted it, why didn't they register it? If I register it and several years later they decide they want it-- what gives them the right to demand that I give it to them for free?

Finally, the truth is that I didn't register this domain, I bought it at auction. so, what's to say what a fair price is?

The idea that these people are "cybersquatters" is an idea of entitlement-- its based on the false notion that you somehow have a right to domain names, even though you didn't register them when they were free.

This is false. Domain names are an open territory- if you think of it and register it, its yours. If you later realize you should have registered it, then its you're error, not the error of the preson who did register it.

They arent' scamming you, they are asking for compensation for the risk they took in registering it. If hte price they ask is higher than the value of the domain (and if you have foo.com then foo.cn isn't really that valuable, is it?) then just don't buy it and let the owner of foo.cn use it for whatever they want.... why should you care?

If they are using a domain to pretend to be you-- then that would be one thing, and that's what cybersquatting really means.

But domain speculation, like real estate speculation, is a perfectly legitimate activity. Where does one get the idea that all names of a certain category should belong to them even though they couldn't be bothered to register them?

(Speaking in general here, not to the original poster since he didn't express much of an opinion, other than to misuse the word cybersquatter)

[kcl]

According to the law and from the perspective of the business world, what Mr. Li & co. are doing is perfectly fine, no one would disagree. You call it 'legitimate', and I think that's a fair description.

Obviously, though, you'll notice that a lot of people don't like what they're doing. I personally wouldn't go so far as to call it 'unethical', but I know that I definitely don't agree with what they do, since on a number of levels it strikes me as wrong.

The legal framework surrounding the purchase and ownership of domain names was ultimately established by fiat. The model we have is not a sacred construction that fell out of an economics textbook. It was chosen to represent some idea of how we thought domain name ownership should be handled. We didn't know how the domain name market was going to evolve. How could we? It was a radically new idea with little precedent. The closest thing we had was our model for physical real-estate, and so that's roughly what we adopted, in an attempt to make it a fair system.

Early on, though, we realized that our model didn't quite match up to the expectation of fairness we had for our system, and when a legal framework fails to match our conception of how things should work, we revise it, and we do so with more laws. The major law that came out of this was the Anticybersquatting act, and though it was drafted largely as a result of corporate interest, it represents our belief that something was wrong with the framework we had set up. (If I'm going to build a McDonald's, you have to move your lemonade stand off the piece of real estate labeled MCDONALDS in big bold letters...on every map ever printed.)

When you say that Mr. Li isn't a cybersquatter, even though it is grossly obvious he fits that definition (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anticybersquatting_Consumer_Pro...), whether you agree with it or not, it leads me to believe that you have a problem with anyone being labeled a 'cybersquatter', on the basis that there is nothing inherently wrong with the act of cybersquatting.

The problem people have with Thomas Li and octopart.cn, is not that he desires to own a domain name that somebody else might want. It's that, rather than engage in some type of productive behavior, Mr. Li has seized upon a opportunity to make a little money entirely at the expense of the Octopart company. His behavior is counterproductive. It is of benefit to no one (except himself). He has created, in effect, a potential loss for Octopart, and now he is offering them the ability to avoid that loss. The key point here is that he has created a loss opportunity, and no real gain for anyone. Of course, he has the potential to gain money for himself, but in the long tradition of ill-gotten gains, people really won't like him for it, because he won't be receiving money in exchange for some positive output he's created, he'll be receiving ransom money in order to not make something worse.

We see a similar thing happening in the parking of domain names on a massive scale. Mass parking occurs when an entrepreneur buys up thousands of domains, on the cheap---since most of them haven't been registered---and then sets up dummy search pages and advertisements on each of them. He never puts original content on these sites. With judicious use of SEO tricks, he can still get them to pop up in your Google search, even though nobody in their right mind would ever link there or even want to visit there in the first place. Do parked domains actually add value for the consumer? Not likely. At best they simply rearrange or add vestigial segments to the plumbing of the internet. If I search for "sony tv" and the first ten results are WALMART.COM and the last one is TARGET.COM, my search isn't any better than if the first result was Wal-Mart and the second was Target. All Wal-Mart's done is increase the probability that I visit their site before I visit Target's...which may improve their market share, but actually degrades my experience as a consumer. You'll notice what we have going on is, again, a transfer of wealth, and not a creation thereof.

The practice of mass domain name parking must make some people a lot of money, but I don't think that anyone believes this is a desirable feature for the internet to have.

(Historically, these types of 'transactions' are frowned upon. If I'm a pirate and I capture your ship, I just got a lot richer, but the net effect on society is negative, since much work has been expended without the creation of wealth, and now much more work in the future will have to be expended on defense, which, short of economic stimulus and R&D, also fails to create wealth. This is why industrialized societies don't like war, or theft, or raiding, or vikings, bandits, bank and train robbers, burglars, pirates, muggers, hijackers, and highwaymen. Their acts are always lucrative for a small number of people at the severe expense of everyone else. Wouldn't you rather someone spend all day planning a building instead of a robbery?)

[morris]

As the author pointed out, the domain was registered five days after his site launched. The domain was registered in bad faith. The owner is now soliciting the author for an offer on the domain name. According to Wikipedia, cybersquatting is 'registering, trafficking in, or using a domain name with bad-faith intent to profit from the goodwill of a trademark belonging to someone else.'

[kirse]

Sounds like BitGeek is sending your emails ;)

[andres]

octopart.cn and octopart.com.cn were registered on 3/10/07. we launched on 3/05/07.

[cstejerean]

this is sad. the good news is you probably don't need a .cn domain name. what registrar did you use? Some registrars are a bit shady and will pull this kind of crap on you.

[icky]

So make the subdomain cn.octopart.com, and tell them to suck it! ;-)

[BitGeek]

this is called enterprising. They aren't pretending to be you, they are just buying generic domain names that might be useful to someone in the future. You can either buy them from them, or give them a pass.... that's your choice.

But it seems like you're offended that they offered them to you and that's a waste of energy.

[viewrcorp]

-------- Original Message -------- Subject: viewr.cn & viewr.com.cn Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 23:30:27 +0800 From: Thomas Lee <[email protected]> To: [email protected] CC: [email protected]

viewr.cn & viewr.com.cn Dear Sirs,

We have viewr.cn & viewr.com.cn for your purchase to expand China market which is to be No.1 market in the world.

Your interest? make offer pls.

Thanks

Regards,

Thomasa

[snowmaker]

We got one, too, at Scribd. Maybe they read news.ycombinator.

[corentin]

I guess it's more automated than that; they probably monitor registry updates with robots.

[choward93]

When i got a business license a couple years ago, someone bought my company's .com domain mere days after i registered the trade name. The domain is absolutely useless to them, but they keep it in hope that ill pay them big time for it. not in their lifetime...

[tlrobinson]

cyber-squatters lie somewhere between the scammers and spammers on my internet jackass shitlist.

[edw519]

all your base belong to octopart.cn

[swallace]

Beware! all those chinese domains are tainted with lead.

[rms]

I just registered a new, really good, 6 character .com domain and the .cn is already gone...

[ph0rque]

We got a similar email when we launched i-conserve.com (also with the chinese domain name).

[PStamatiou]

We (skribit.com) got an email like this within a week of our launch..

[robertgaal]

Yep, we got one too. Idiots.

[zeantsoi]

all your domains are belong to us